Frankie Smokes. Who says No?
- Thread starter amedawg00
- Start date
LoPo
Well-Known Member
Treat him like Bruce Bowen and park him in a corner. Doesn't matter. His defense is top notch and we need top notch defenders.
Also, we need young players to develop. We have Butler, Doke and maybe Forrest, Brantley. It's not like we have too much youth or anything
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enchilada_style
Well-Known Member
I’m all about it if I don’t ever have to watch oni run out there full of anxiety like it’s his first date
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And who somehow is a better player than Frankie Smokes.
Frank: Career TS% = .454 -- That's bad!
It’s the TS% of an all-time great from most before the 80’s!
But seriously, I’m speaking comparatively.
Nope.
I havent watched Frank as much as Oni, but I suspect they both have the same issues. They both look like they should be much better than they are and I'm guessing both have trouble processing the game at NBA speeds with the ball in hand.
Both foul way too much to be reliable defenders.
Both are inconsistent shooters.
Neither are good at finishing in traffic.
Both foul way too much to be reliable defenders.
Both are inconsistent shooters.
Neither are good at finishing in traffic.
Frank is SO much better defensively….in real life NBA games. Not GM hype.
Maybe, but he fouls even more per minute than Oni does. You can't be a consistently good defender if you're constantly fouling.
Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
These are decent reasonings I guess?
Sure he might do better here and great, he’s taller then O’Neale, not sure Oni had to be mentioned with O’Neale, he sucks and shouldn’t play, but Frank can’t shoot and I don’t see him getting better at that this year.
campaignist
Well-Known Member
Mm, the reasoning would be that the only reason Oni plays is defense, and odds are his ceiling isn’t much higher. He might be a neutral at best on offense. Smokes has a much higher ceiling and could likely fill or exceed Oni’s role. There are so many capable offensive players here that he wouldn’t need to try to score very much.
The price is likely the same for both. They’re so desperate for defenders that you could theoretically keep both and see who’s better.
I was just using Royce and Onis’ heights for comparison. His being DM’s bestie is actually an important plus as well.
Edit: sorry, I thought you were saying you didn’t get the reasoning.
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There is no solid evidence that Oni is a better shooter and I wish it would stop being parroted. The only reason he has a higher TS% is because he almost exclusively shoots 3s, at which he connected at a lower percentage than Frank last year (by a significant amount, actually). FT% is also similar (~80%).
The difference is Frank isn't terrified and has actually proven he can play defense. And he can handle the ball some. The comp isn't all that close in terms of who is better than the other. To be clear, I am not saying Frank is a good shooter, but he's good enough to not be left wide open and that's good enough for a great defender with legit wing size in a pinch.
If you can get Frank in the Oni role, that is absolutely a win.
The difference is Frank isn't terrified and has actually proven he can play defense. And he can handle the ball some. The comp isn't all that close in terms of who is better than the other. To be clear, I am not saying Frank is a good shooter, but he's good enough to not be left wide open and that's good enough for a great defender with legit wing size in a pinch.
If you can get Frank in the Oni role, that is absolutely a win.
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The Thriller
Well-Known Member
Why not? We need a wing defender. A wing defender who can also handle the ball is nice.
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
It’s weird how we went weeks talking about how awesome it would’ve been to have signed Torrey Craig and now people are coming up with excuses for not signing Frankie Smokes. Wouldn’t they have both filled the same role? Come in when needed, play 5-10 mins, wreck havoc defensively, and maybe score once or twice? I mean was Phx really asking anything more out of craig? Would we ask anything more out of craig? Why wouldn’t we just ask Smokes to play a similar role?
SteakNEggs
Well-Known Member
Frankie should.
seattlejazzfan
Well-Known Member
Oni's NBA skill is that Quinn Snyder likes him. If you're one of the lucky ones, that's all it takes to make it.
Wait, how has it been proven Frank is proven on D and isnt terrified? Frank has been given way more opportunity to develop in the NBA and has done absolutely nothing with it. At least with Oni you can argue that he's lacked a leash to truly make mistakes and develop past them (not to say I think this should be given to Oni).
Frank fouls more per minute than Oni. Frank is a career 38% from inside the arc. Frank has been Exum level dreadful at shooting outside of the arc besides this past year (hopefully that's a sign and not just very limited sample size because his minutes got cut massively.).
I think we are all kidding ourselves when we act like one is definitively better than the other.
They are basically the same age, same size, and have the same applicable skills (yes Frank can handle/playmake more, but it's not NBA level and I think it's a stretch to say he has potential to develop it to NBA level).
The case for Frank over Oni just comes down to something new and shiny. Have we seen enough of Oni? Has he shown more in practice than in the actual game? Or is his game in practice pretty equal to game on court and we've seen enough to know the well is tapped dry? If both are in similar roles to earn minutes next year, I think it's a coin toss as to who would actually come out the better player.
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What? Snyder likes him? Is that why he started cutting his minutes for Trent Forrest and Matt Thomas towards the end of the season?
I'm not sure Snyder likes him at all. I think Oni was just the default due to his theoretical skill-set and the fact that the other options were too flawed.
I think Forrest is the guy who has the most "Quin Favorite" potential as he plays the game with high IQ, effort, and confidence. Once he got scouted he just became too flawed to put on the court as teams were giving him 10 feet of space from the corner.
And honestly, if Forrest learns to shoot at all he's way way way ahead of Oni or Frank.
I'm all for signing Ntlikina, but I just don't want to overhype him at all. If we signed him I would expect him to probably continue to be the player he is, but it's worth a shot at the minimum. You can probably keep both Oni and Frank and let them compete tbh. It doesnt have to be one or the other.