General Conference - Fall 2010

[colton]

Kicky, the answer to the question is, no, they can not. It's actually another temple interview question.

6. Do you affiliate with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, or do you sympathize with the precepts of any such group or individual?

Wow, I've never interpreted that as a political question. I've always understood it to mean, "Do you support any anti-Mormon groups?" Otherwise both active Democrats and Republicans would have to answer "Yes" to the question, because (to my view anyway), there are plenty of teachings and practices in both parties which are contrary to LDS gospel principles.

 

[colton]

Given that, is it fair to say that there is functionally a political litmus test to being in the church? Or is it ok to believe something different as long as you never talk about it, effectively putting you in political exile?

This may explain the odd John Birch Society splintering and semi-LDS takeover that I've been curious about for some time.

I wouldn't say there's a political litmus test at all. For example, a friend in my ward (and fellow BYU professor, for that matter) is the county Democrat chairman. He's a great guy, and it wouldn't surprise me at all if he's called to be our next bishop.

But as far as excommunications go, I would say people are only excommunicated for behavior, not for belief.

 

[Scat]

...calling church leaders "bigots" doesn't seem like a very reasonable way to proceed for someone that is trying to not be excommunicated.

This. I know lot's of Mormons that are liberal Democrats. Hell, my FIL is right there at the top. That being said, he's been a temple worker for years and has been in several different bishoprics. I can almost guarantee you that there are Democrats in the council of the 12. The church does not dictate what your politics should be or how you should vote or what party you should be affiliated with. They are not going to excommunicate a member for voting against Prop 8 or voting for Obama. Good grief, Harry Reid from Nevada is a Mormon! Take a look at his voting record and tell me how he could possibly still be a member in good standing if the church dictated a persons politics!!

That said, there are certain ways to go about handling your business if you disagree with the church heiarchy. Publicly calling out the leaders, stating how wrong they are and plastering your face all over the evening news whle using derogatory names is probably not the best way to go about stating your case. Yeah, you'll get tons of publicity but it's not going to accomplish anything other than getting yourself kicked to the curb. This as I see it is the difference between Steve Young's wife and Andrew Callahan. Steve Young's wife simply stated her position, placed a few signs in her front yard and donated money to fight prop 8. Not hardly the actions of a person that is politically neutered.

 

[Archie Moses]

Wow, I've never interpreted that as a political question. I've always understood it to mean, "Do you support any anti-Mormon groups?" Otherwise both active Democrats and Republicans would have to answer "Yes" to the question, because (to my view anyway), there are plenty of teachings and practices in both parties which are contrary to LDS gospel principles.

You're right about the political part, like voting for prop 8. What I'm saying is that if you're advocating homosexuality and participating in groups that slander the church's stance/viewpoint on homosexuality, it's probably not going to sit well with your leaders. Right?

 

[Archie Moses]

This. I know lot's of Mormons that are liberal Democrats. Hell, my FIL is right there at the top. That being said, he's been a temple worker for years and has been in several different bishoprics. I can almost guarantee you that there are Democrats in the council of the 12. The church does not dictate what your politics should be or how you should vote or what party you should be affiliated with. They are not going to excommunicate a member for voting against Prop 8 or voting for Obama. Good grief, Harry Reid from Nevada is a Mormon! Take a look at his voting record and tell me how he could possibly still be a member in good standing if the church dictated a persons politics!!

That said, there are certain ways to go about handling your business if you disagree with the church heiarchy. Publicly calling out the leaders, stating how wrong they are and plastering your face all over the evening news whle using derogatory names is probably not the best way to go about stating your case. Yeah, you'll get tons of publicity but it's not going to accomplish anything other than getting yourself kicked to the curb. This as I see it is the difference between Steve Young's wife and Andrew Callahan. Steve Young's wife simply stated her position, placed a few signs in her front yard and donated money to fight prop 8. Not hardly the actions of a person that is politically neutured.

This. +1.

 

[Bronco70]

I did no such thing, the LDS Church made it's stance clear with Packer's remarks and they have every right to do so. If you agree with what I said above, that the LDS Church is not being victimized, than why are you trying to play the victim claiming I'm trying to somehow remove your right to a voice?

That is some pretty circular logic. My claim the whole time has been that the church has a right to it's stance, just as those whose views stand in opposition have a right to theirs. Everyone falls under the same 1st amendment. I don't remember claiming or insinuating that the church was being victimized. If you'd care to enlighten me as to where I did so, I'd be interested to see, because that isn't my position at all.

Newsflash, it's the LDS Church that is actively trying to limit the actions of homosexuals.

So what's your point? The church has every right to their position. Last I checked, they are not a legislative body - they cannot enact anything that directly limits gay rights.

What did they ever do to the LDS church?

Aside from flying off the handle over comments made by an old man whose influence does not extend past a group of people who largely already believe that way? Nothing.

 

[cowhide]

Wow! What can you say about stuff like that. I am sure that there are some people who think that way but just WOW!

 

[cowhide]

Were there any talks on food storage this time around? I've always thought the emphasis on that was genius, and surely there was a lot of people that have probably benefited that over the past 3 or 4 years, but I think we are getting even closer to the point when that advice is going to look even smarter unfortunately.

Why is the world going to end in a few years? Geez everyone be afraid? My parents were gulllible enough to fall for that scam of having to buy dehydrated meat from the church and then forcing me to eat the crap. I can tell you that listening to a talk about food storage would be as exciting as watching paint dry.

 

[TroutBum]

Why is the world going to end in a few years? Geez everyone be afraid? My parents were gulllible enough to fall for that scam of having to buy dehydrated meat from the church and then forcing me to eat the crap. I can tell you that listening to a talk about food storage would be as exciting as watching paint dry.

I can just see your parents holding you down, hands tied, jaw forced open by a steel contraption, ramming dried meat down your stupid *** throat. Cry harder, hack.

 

[The-Joker]

Thanks for that.

So apostles and prophets are men, and imperfect. And Mormons will accept what the prophets say. But what if this issue one of those human errors? So you're saying the quest for truth stops at the prophets who's testimony may be laced with falsities?

If a member wishes for personal revelation, and disputes what the church says. They can take it up with the man upstairs. That's the principal the church was founded upon.

 

[cowhide]

I can just see your parents holding you down, hands tied, jaw forced open by a steel contraption, ramming dried meat down your stupid *** throat. Cry harder, hack.

Did I hurt your little feelings? You have no idea how I grew up dumbass. Typical response by the sheep.

 

[Duck Rodgers]

Why is the world going to end in a few years? Geez everyone be afraid? My parents were gulllible enough to fall for that scam of having to buy dehydrated meat from the church and then forcing me to eat the crap. I can tell you that listening to a talk about food storage would be as exciting as watching paint dry.

Let's be honest, your parents food storage was depleted because you ate everything else in the ****ing house. Their crisis was that their son was a blimp.

 

[TroutBum]

Did I hurt your little feelings? You have no idea how I grew up dumbass. Typical response by the sheep.

Of course you hurt my feelings, I'm a bishop and in charge of the food storage for the whole stake. I know exactly how you grew up; a spoiled little Skyline/East side chump, who injected roids into you and your friends asses and tried to look cool at school by wearing ankle socks and walking on your tip-toes to show off your calf muscles. I know your ilk, jerk face.

p.s. I'm not a sheep, I'm a horse.

 

[UB]

Man this thread is cool. Almost as cool as my hip new signature pic. Hunky dudes will always end an argument, I say.

 

[UB]

just look at em

 

[TroutBum]

How can you not? Daaayum.

 

[Scat]

Wait a minute... I got semi-chastised for posting pics of gay men. I'm calling foul! Alright, my pics were were a little more obnoxious and were simply deleted by a mod but still... it's a pic of gay men!!

 

[Craig K. Manscill]

Alright, MAYBE we're in the middle of yet another civil rights revolution where a group of people should have rights but don't, but when have these old men I so revere led me wrong before in similar situations? .... Okay, maybe they've been wrong on every civil rights issue in the last century, but seriously, these guys can tell good stories and they're old and wise looking. Plus it makes my mom happy when I listen to what they say.

- Craig

 

[UB]

Wait a minute... I got semi-chastised for posting pics of gay men. I'm calling foul! Alright, my pics were were a little more obnoxious and were simply deleted by a mod but still... it's a pic of gay men!!

Wait, excuse me. What indicates these men are gay, and why would that be a bad thing? Are you one of those dudes that wear a swimsuit and flipflops in the locker room at the gym?

 

[Scat]

Why is the world going to end in a few years? Geez everyone be afraid? My parents were gulllible enough to fall for that scam of having to buy dehydrated meat from the church and then forcing me to eat the crap. I can tell you that listening to a talk about food storage would be as exciting as watching paint dry.

You find it gulliable to be preparred? And it doesn't take the end of the world to wish you had saved up on certain items.

I lived in SoCal during the Northridge Earthquake. For the first 3 days the grocery stores were flat out closed. There was no running water and no electricity. If you didn't have it in your house you couldn't get it. Some of the most basic necessities such as water were impossible to get. Once the grocery stores did open you could only buy non-perishable goods. They couldn't sell refrigerated items or perishable goods due to the power having been off. Items such as bottled water, batteries, toliet paper and canned goods flew off the shelf. People were limited to a certain amount of each item. You also had to be escorted through the store by an armed guard with a flashlight. This was a relatively minor quake in the grand scheme of things but it is also the one event in my life that made me decide that food storage is a great idea. I lived this crap for just one week. I can't imagine needing to live like this for months, years or even indefinitely.

I have no problem with the church preaching prepardness and food storage. All it takes is one quake, one major fire, one riot, one terrorist attack and you will be wishing you weren't such an idiot and payed a little more attention.

I also keep a couple of guns and plenty of ammo because asshats like you that think being preparred is "boring" and gullible. Call me paranoid but I've been there and have seen the benefits of having extra stored up.