Graphic video released of police killing another black man in cold blood

[Stoked]

Man, what an injustice. First, an officer murders him, then the officer is NOT indicted so no repercussions for him. Third, the caller who made 911 call clearly made false statements regarding this guy posing a threat gets off the hook. At the end, all the family gets is "well, **** happens".

From what I understood there are 19 people on the jury that decided this and only 7 needed to agree that charges should be brought. So that means that only 6, or less, out of 19 thought charges should be filed. I wonder what was presented to them that convinced 13(+) people.

But basically this means that legally he killed that man but did not murder him.

 

[Getting Traded]

I think this is a very important subject point in this case. To most of us who actually watch the video. It appears he is shot at once or twice at first. Then he goes to the ground. Then he gets back up and runs towards his gun. Then he is shot again and doesn't get back up. I'd be willing to bet that's what happened. Although, Eenie-Meenie thinks maybe he was only shot before he fell the first time. I find this hard to believe based on what the video shows.

I agree. I wouldn't say I think that, but I was told that. It could be a crucial piece of information if charges are brought against the cop -- as the Feds are taking over the case. If he shot once, ok, that didn't kill him, but if there was a second shot that killed him, then it could weigh heavily against the cop. In fact, I said the same to the lady I talked with whose son is a policeman. She quickly corrected me and said he wasn't shot again. But maybe she was covering it up.

 

[dodo]

From what I understood there are 19 people on the jury that decided this and only 7 needed to agree that charges should be brought. So that means that only 6, or less, out of 19 thought charges should be filed. I wonder what was presented to them that convinced 13(+) people.

But basically this means that legally he killed that man but did not murder him.

True, though after watching that vid, it feels like murder.

After reading this article: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...io-shooting-charges-911-calller-john-crawford it sounds the key lies with the person reported the victim. The 911 caller made it sound like a clear shooter case. They even cite the responding officer calling back dispatch to confirm some of the reported actions Crawford. Probably the evidence was that it was reported as active shooter situation and the officers acted this way to save others.

The 911 caller claimed children have been threatened. From the article:

The children who Ritchie appeared to claim were under threat from Crawford were in the store with their mother, Angela Williams. Williams, 37, died of a heart attack in the panic that ensued among customers following the police shooting.

So again Stoked, what happens with the 2nd amendment rights? Oregon is open carry state. The guy wasn't even given a chance to comply with a request for ID, show hands, nothing. Just shot for possessing a firearm. What happened with the 2nd ammenders on this site?

Overall, someone has got to pay a price for what happened. AND the police owe to revisit their assessment procedures. You can't be just bursting up shooting up people because someone reported it. There was a case in Denver a month ago where a gamer was being "SWATTED" live in a game. Someone called the cops on him and reported he killed people. Swat team comes in.....

 

[Qman]

True, though after watching that vid, it feels like murder.

After reading this article: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...io-shooting-charges-911-calller-john-crawford it sounds the key lies with the person reported the victim. The 911 caller made it sound like a clear shooter case. They even cite the responding officer calling back dispatch to confirm some of the reported actions Crawford. Probably the evidence was that it was reported as active shooter situation and the officers acted this way to save others.

The 911 caller claimed children have been threatened. From the article:



So again Stoked, what happens with the 2nd amendment rights? Oregon is open carry state. The guy wasn't even given a chance to comply with a request for ID, show hands, nothing. Just shot for having a gun. What happened with the 2nd ammenders on this site?

At work so I can't see the video, but sounds like the problem is the 911 caller was a liar. He/she should be charged with some kind of murder charge.

 

[Stoked]

True, though after watching that vid, it feels like murder.

After reading this article: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...io-shooting-charges-911-calller-john-crawford it sounds the key lies with the person reported the victim. The 911 caller made it sound like a clear shooter case. They even cite the responding officer calling back dispatch to confirm some of the reported actions Crawford. Probably the evidence was that it was reported as active shooter situation and the officers acted this way to save others.

The 911 caller claimed children have been threatened. From the article:



So again Stoked, what happens with the 2nd amendment rights? Oregon is open carry state. The guy wasn't even given a chance to comply with a request for ID, show hands, nothing. Just shot for having a gun. What happened with the 2nd ammenders on this site?

What? Crawford was shot in Ohio, not Oregon. I read the article and it hammers the 911 caller. However statements that it was a crank call are just opinion. Perhaps he did exaggerate the circumstances. I don't know has I have not heard the call. Basically this is a hit piece by the Guardian agaisnt the 911 call.

I do agree that police should interview him if they haven't already.

Your 2nd amendment attack in this thread is very strange.

 

[dodo]

What? Crawford was shot in Ohio, not Oregon. I read the article and it hammers the 911 caller. However statements that it was a crank call are just opinion. Perhaps he did exaggerate the circumstances. I don't know has I have not heard the call. Basically this is a hit piece by the Guardian agaisnt the 911 call.

I do agree that police should interview him if they haven't already.

Your 2nd amendment attack in this thread is very strange.

I mistyped the state but Ohio is also traditional open-carry state just as Oregon so it doesn't change the premise of my post. I am surprised that this thread is split the way it is where traditionally right-wing, gun supporting posters are supporting whatever the police actions are while questioning every fact on the other side. Why are not these people outraged that police is killing innocent civilians exercising their 2nd amendment right?

Case in point is you calling the guardian article "hit piece".

Here is another "hit piece" that you can discard as lefties propaganda:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ohn-crawford-walmart-lied-victims-mother-says

“Sergeant Darkow repeatedly yelled ‘drop the weapon’,” said Williams, in a narrative released by Beavercreek police late last Friday. “After repeated commands to drop the weapon the male turned to us in an aggressive manner with the rifle in hand. At that time the black male was in a position where he could shoot me or sergeant Darkow.”

This is the narrative from the PD. Please, watch the video and tell me, intellectually honestly, does it fit what you saw?

 

[Stoked]

I mistyped the state but Ohio is also traditional open-carry state just as Oregon so it doesn't change the premise of my post. I am surprised that this thread is split the way it is where traditionally right-wing, gun supporting posters are supporting whatever the police actions are while questioning every fact on the other side. Why are not these people outraged that police is killing innocent civilians exercising their 2nd amendment right?

Case in point is you calling the guardian article "hit piece".

Here is another "hit piece" that you can discard as lefties propaganda:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ohn-crawford-walmart-lied-victims-mother-says




This is the narrative from the PD. Please, watch the video and tell me, intellectually honestly, does it fit what you saw?

Again, why are you targeting me with this? I never, not once, said the police shooting inthis case was justified.

 

[LogGrad98]

What I am questioning is the motives so many are trying to assign to the police. There is a big difference between making a mistake and being a murderous evil racist pig bent on killing every black person they can get away with.

 

[dodo]

Again, why are you targeting me with this? I never, not once, said the police shooting inthis case was justified.

The general "right" lined up against the "anti-racist" crowd of this board. Since you quoted and objected "injustice/murder" post (perhaps technically right on the "murder") point I started a discussion with you. But I am not "targeting" anyone...I am just surprised the traditional right of the board are not lining up to support the case of person being shot on the premise of 2nd amendment rights (even though the original poster's agenda is race).

 

[Hotdog]

This is the narrative from the PD. Please, watch the video and tell me, intellectually honestly, does it fit what you saw?

I don't see that either. It doesn't look like there is much time that conversation goes on between the cop and Crawford, if any at all. Just based off the video, it doesn't look like the cops said anything, they just shot. But, if you listen to what Crawford ' s girlfriend says. She states that before he is shot she hears him say "it's not real"(I assume he is talking about the gun). So then it does appear that a conversation went on if only for a few seconds, maybe a little more. The video looks one way, but the cops could have made their demands, and Crawford acted a little stubborn and defiant and didn't do what he was told like a lot people who get annoyed by police. Maybe he didn't understand the severity of the situation and delayed listening to the cops demands, prompting a trigger happy unknowing cop to take action. . I dunno, I'm just pondering the possibilities.

I would like to know some more details about the case that could shed some more light on the situation. Like when, how and where he was shot. It's not completely clear. Also it would help to hear some clear audio of the event so we can know how much warning the cop gave.

 

[Hotdog]

...I am just surprised the traditional right of the board are not lining up to support the case of person being shot on the premise of 2nd amendment rights (even though the original poster's agenda is race).

That's a good point. I would be curious to know what the right think about that as well. (I'm not a Republican even though it may appear that way based on my posts)

The open carry law is a weird one. It's your right to do it, but it's still not really allowed. You can't walk around with a gun and not be stopped by police. There are a grip of YouTube videos where people try it but it doesn't go over well.

You would think that a law is a law and a right is a right, but in this case society doesn't treat it as such. It's like it's outlawed but has never been officially changed.

Personally, I don't care for guns. I don't own one. I don't feel that unsafe and the need to carry one. Seems like carrying one around is more trouble than its worth. But if I see someone carrying one around out in the open it will give me pause. You have to assess what's that persons doing. It's not normal everyday life so it stands out and can make people nervous.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

The 911 caller was inflammatory, said Crawford was pointing the gun at kids, said it looked to him like he was loading the gun ... really stupid. He in part was responsible for what happened.

Just listened to the call and it was synced to the audio. You are right. He claimed that Crawford was pointing the gun at kids when two children and their mother happened to walk in the vicinity, but despite what he said the gun was never pointed in that direction. His false statements are definitely partially to blame for this. I also learned that another woman died at the scene that night, apparently of stress.

 

[Gameface]

I think there needs to be a "standard protocol" for typical police interactions. I know to some extent the police have them, but this needs to be something the public is educated about, I'd say as part of driver's education.

What I'm saying is that there needs to be a specific process that takes place during a traffic stop or when police stop a person on the street or any other public place. Basically a set of steps taken by both parties that ensures safety by providing predictable actions. If a person is not following the standard protocol then it is a sign that they are being uncooperative and need to be dealt with more cautiously. But it's a two way street. The police have to follow the standard protocol as well, so if they shot someone who was following the standard protocol then it is clear it was the officer who broke protocol and was in the wrong.

 

[Gameface]

That's a good point. I would be curious to know what the right think about that as well. (I'm not a Republican even though it may appear that way based on my posts)

The open carry law is a weird one. It's your right to do it, but it's still not really allowed. You can't walk around with a gun and not be stopped by police. There are a grip of YouTube videos where people try it but it doesn't go over well.

You would think that a law is a law and a right is a right, but in this case society doesn't treat it as such. It's like it's outlawed but has never been officially changed.

Personally, I don't care for guns. I don't own one. I don't feel that unsafe and the need to carry one. Seems like carrying one around is more trouble than its worth. But if I see someone carrying one around out in the open it will give me pause. You have to assess what's that persons doing. It's not normal everyday life so it stands out and can make people nervous.

To be clear, open carry in no way means that you are allowed to carry your weapon in your hand. That is called brandishing and is typically a crime. To properly open carry you need to have your weapon in a holster, or in the case of a rifle it can be attached to a shoulder strap (but I personally think that is a terrible way to carry a weapon in public).

Many gun rights groups stage open carry confrontations by going into places that typically don't allow weapons on their property, which is their right, so that they can then pressure these establishments to change their weapon policies. But they have also staged such events in establishments that allow concealed and open carry in order to illicit a police response so they can assert their right to carry.

 

[Getting Traded]

I don't see that either. It doesn't look like there is much time that conversation goes on between the cop and Crawford, if any at all. Just based off the video, it doesn't look like the cops said anything, they just shot. But, if you listen to what Crawford ' s girlfriend says. She states that before he is shot she hears him say "it's not real"(I assume he is talking about the gun). So then it does appear that a conversation went on if only for a few seconds, maybe a little more. The video looks one way, but the cops could have made their demands, and Crawford acted a little stubborn and defiant and didn't do what he was told like a lot people who get annoyed by police. Maybe he didn't understand the severity of the situation and delayed listening to the cops demands, prompting a trigger happy unknowing cop to take action. . I dunno, I'm just pondering the possibilities.

I would like to know some more details about the case that could shed some more light on the situation. Like when, how and where he was shot. It's not completely clear. Also it would help to hear some clear audio of the event so we can know how much warning the cop gave.

Hack, where did you get the info about his girlfriend? If you look at the video, it appears he was shot about a second after they said, put it down, but it's very hard to tell if they did say anything before that. If you look on the left screen, you will see that their feet come into the picture about 4 seconds before they call out to him (maybe less, have to go back and look to see exactly how long).

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

I think there needs to be a "standard protocol" for typical police interactions. I know to some extent the police have them, but this needs to be something the public is educated about, I'd say as part of driver's education.

What I'm saying is that there needs to be a specific process that takes place during a traffic stop or when police stop a person on the street or any other public place. Basically a set of steps taken by both parties that ensures safety by providing predictable actions. If a person is not following the standard protocol then it is a sign that they are being uncooperative and need to be dealt with more cautiously. But it's a two way street. The police have to follow the standard protocol as well, so if they shot someone who was following the standard protocol then it is clear it was the officer who broke protocol and was in the wrong.

 

[dodo]

Just listened to the call and it was synced to the audio. You are right. He claimed that Crawford was pointing the gun at kids when two children and their mother happened to walk in the vicinity, but despite what he said the gun was never pointed in that direction. His false statements are definitely partially to blame for this. I also learned that another woman died at the scene that night, apparently of stress.

According to what I read, the woman who died from heart attack was the mother of two kids that walked in the vicinity of Crawford seen in the video and reported by the 911 caller.

 

[The Thriller]

Maybe blacks should stop committing crimes?

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Maybe blacks should stop committing crimes?

Yeah. This carrying bb guns around has got to stop right now or we're going to have to teach someone a lesson they won't forget!

 

[Yell42]

I'd be pretty pumped if you made some overtly racist comments (again) and got banned outright.

Ive never made any racist comments

and the worst racists in america are al sharpton and jesse jackson and other parasites like them

always wanna blame 'the white man', but hey it gets them on TV an thats all they care about