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Gun Control

SaltyDawg said:
Unbelievable that we're allowing this gun control nonsense to happen. Maybe someone should steal a tanker truck and crash it into a school bus so we can outlaw gas and big or fast cars.
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do it Salty, be a martyr for the cause!

But which is it, big or fast?


<3
 
fishonjazz said:
Wait... so you're telling me that it was possible to sell guns on ksl before? So someone could put an add up to sell thier 9 millimeter for 50$ and a 14 year old kid (or violent criminal, or insane person) could call up that person and go pick it up from them?
No background checks or anything?
Was selling guns on ksl just like selling anything else in the classifieds (coffee tables, cars, etc etc)? Were there any additional restrictions/requirements for selling guns on there?
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Ya weird huh?

My friend bought a gun of KSL from one our own congressman here in Utah. That really threw me for one. He said it was just like any other transaction. I had to ask over over in different ways to see what I was missing, but sure enough, its that easy.
 
My solution to all this is, have all the guns you want, but if your gun is used in a murder, you spend one year in jail minimum. Nobody can sell or trade guns to one another. Only gun dealers can sell. Once you own a gun, its yours, its tied to you forever. We'll see then just how careless everyone is with there guns. And lets throw a 50,000 dollar fine on there too, just for ****s and giggles.
 
Hack said:
My solution to all this is, have all the guns you want, but if your gun is used in a murder, you spend one year in jail minimum. Nobody can sell or trade guns to one another. Only gun dealers can sell. Once you own a gun, its yours, its tied to you forever. We'll see then just how careless everyone is with there guns. And lets throw a 50,000 dollar fine on there too, just for ****s and giggles.
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And then when criminals just start making their own guns?

I don't know if you're aware of this, but you can use a 3d printer to make a fully automatic ak 47 clone right now. The file you need to do it is all over the net right now.

3d printers are fairly new. If people are already making fully automatic ak47 clones with them, what will people be making in 5 years when you can get one for a couple hundred dollars?

We start censoring the net? Is that what's next?
 
Is the $200 3d printer that makes fully automatic ak47's compatible with my soon to be obsolete laptop or will I need to buy a smart phone?
 
I think there is more to this gun control nonsense.

Food for thought...

As the "Arab Spring" was happening, fueled by social networks, our own government started pushing for ways to censor the internet. This included an internet "kill switch" to shut it down nationwide, social network filters, access to peoples' private social network accounts, access to archives and records from peoples' private social network accounts, and all the same for individual email, cell phone, and isp accounts.

Then, while we're sending all kinds of arms to these rebels to fight their revolutions, we're simultaneously trying to restrict the guns Americans are allowed to have.

Pretty scary stuff.
 
SaltyDawg said:
And then when criminals just start making their own guns?

I don't know if you're aware of this, but you can use a 3d printer to make a fully automatic ak 47 clone right now. The file you need to do it is all over the net right now.

3d printers are fairly new. If people are already making fully automatic ak47 clones with them, what will people be making in 5 years when you can get one for a couple hundred dollars?

We start censoring the net? Is that what's next?
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Well I dont think that addresses anything I said and really is just a separate issue.

I am aware of the 3D printers. I met a traveling sales guy years ago when the first came out. So I know what they are capable of.

This is just another problem we will have to tackle. No guns should be legally made from these printers. If you are caught with one then you will be punished.

I just dont understand this attitude that, oh man, the criminals just keep coming up with new tricks. Therefore we might as well just give up. Ya, good idea. Lets just give up on goverment and lets let everyone just do what they want. That has to be the solution right? **** no! Thats madness. The world would really end in about a week. Governments are a need, like it or not. At least 60% of people are incapable of acting like good human beings to one another. Someone has to babysit or things will go straight to ****. All these laws we have places are there for a reason. Those reasons are because these complications already surfaced and had to be remedied. And in the future, more laws will be made to correct the stupid **** people do.
 
fishonjazz said:
Wait... so you're telling me that it was possible to sell guns on ksl before? So someone could put an add up to sell thier 9 millimeter for 50$ and a 14 year old kid (or violent criminal, or insane person) could call up that person and go pick it up from them?
No background checks or anything?
Was selling guns on ksl just like selling anything else in the classifieds (coffee tables, cars, etc etc)? Were there any additional restrictions/requirements for selling guns on there?
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Fish, I mean no disrespect, but your perspective seems to have very little base in reality. I am going to assume that you haven't ever perused the firearms classifieds.

Well, I have extensively. It's far from a free-for-all of guns and money. Sellers almost always state, up front, that they require ID and a signed bill of sale. Many will only sell to someone with a concealed carry permit (this is, effectively, a background check.)

I sincerely doubt a 14 year old could successfully procure a firearm through KSL.
 
Hack said:
Well I dont think that addresses anything I said and really is just a separate issue.

I am aware of the 3D printers. I met a traveling sales guy years ago when the first came out. So I know what they are capable of.

This is just another problem we will have to tackle. No guns should be legally made from these printers. If you are caught with one then you will be punished.

I just dont understand this attitude that, oh man, the criminals just keep coming up with new tricks. Therefore we might as well just give up. Ya, good idea. Lets just give up on goverment and lets let everyone just do what they want. That has to be the solution right? **** no! Thats madness. The world would really end in about a week. Governments are a need, like it or not. At least 60% of people are incapable of acting like good human beings to one another. Someone has to babysit or things will go straight to ****. All these laws we have places are there for a reason. Those reasons are because these complications already surfaced and had to be remedied. And in the future, more laws will be made to correct the stupid **** people do.
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Hey, I'm not one saying "let's just give up because the criminals will get guns." I'm the one saying, "let's NOT give up. The criminals will get guns, so let's not take them away from the good guys."

The people panicking and saying "let's ban all these guns because the criminals are using them" are the ones who gave up on our personal freedoms.
 
Bronco70 said:
Fish, I mean no disrespect, but your perspective seems to have very little base in reality. I am going to assume that you haven't ever perused the firearms classifieds.

Well, I have extensively. It's far from a free-for-all of guns and money. Sellers almost always state, up front, that they require ID and a signed bill of sale. Many will only sell to someone with a concealed carry permit (this is, effectively, a background check.)

I sincerely doubt a 14 year old could successfully procure a firearm through KSL.
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You are 100 percent correct that i have no idea how the guns are sold on ksl, but from your post it seems like you are saying that MOST or MANY sellers require id or permits or something like that... But there are no requirements or regulations that are mandatory?.... So i could in fact sell to whoever i want regardless of age, criminal history, etc etc?

If that is true then i think ksl did the right thing by stopping the POTENTIAL free for all of guns and money.
 
^^ so true salty^^^ if you take guns away from law abiding citizens it will only be the criminals who will still have guns, and guess what? they will still use them to shoot down even more vonerable people. people who think banning guns will solve this problem are either naive, or stupid. you all can pick...
 
Also i read that ksl is TEMPORARILY stopping the sale of guns on the website that they own and run, so maybe they are just going to try to find a more responsible way to do it.
 
JGolds said:
^^ so true salty^^^ if you take guns away from law abiding citizens it will only be the criminals who will still have guns, and guess what? they will still use them to shoot down even more vonerable people. people who think banning guns will solve this problem are either naive, or stupid. you all can pick...
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I have never seen anything suggesting to BAN guns..... i have seen stuff about types of guns and amount of ammo that clips will hold and more strict background checks. But nothing about banning them (at least nothing seriously considered)
Its kind of ironic that gun enthusiasts are the most paranoid people around..... seems like having guns would make you less paranoid LOL.
 
fishonjazz said:
Wait... so you're telling me that it was possible to sell guns on ksl before? So someone could put an add up to sell thier 9 millimeter for 50$ and a 14 year old kid (or violent criminal, or insane person) could call up that person and go pick it up from them?
No background checks or anything?
Was selling guns on ksl just like selling anything else in the classifieds (coffee tables, cars, etc etc)? Were there any additional restrictions/requirements for selling guns on there?
Click to expand...

I just posted an add (using a proxy through an untraceable country) vaguely worded but very obviously for illegal shrooms available to 14 year olds and younger. Inquiries have been directed to fishonjazz @ jazzfanz.com. Happy sales.
 
larryselbows said:
With all of the recent gun violence, what is the sentiment on the board about Gun Control? I personally am beginning to think there is some merit to it.
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If one adult at the school was armed they could have saved a lot of lives.

I have been indifferent to gun control in the past. But it makes no sense to me to take guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens when the criminals will just get their hands on them anyway.

I have never owned a gun and don't ever plan on owning one.
 
SaltyDawg said:
Hey, I'm not one saying "let's just give up because the criminals will get guns." I'm the one saying, "let's NOT give up. The criminals will get guns, so let's not take them away from the good guys."

The people panicking and saying "let's ban all these guns because the criminals are using them" are the ones who gave up on our personal freedoms.
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Thats fine. But I think you missed my point then.

Im all for rights first and foremost. People should be able to own guns. My problem is that most people only own them because they think they are toys. They collect them like they are stamps, and hardly any people even have safes or a way of keeping them out of other peoples hands. There is just foolish careless attitude people have for them. Thats why I say you should be punished if your gun ends up killing someone. And there should be some kind of limit too. I know people with 20, 30, 40 guns. WTF is that even for? This isnt a game and these arent toys.

People should be held responsible for what their gun does. If its used for criminal activity. Then maybe people will only obtain them for the reasons they are for. Not just because they think they are cool and fun to play with. Im not over playing that either. Thats a big part of american culture. People adore them like they are fancy cars or something. I come across these types all the time.
 
gregbroncs said:
If one adult at the school was armed they could have saved a lot of lives.

I have been indifferent to gun control in the past. But it makes no sense to me to take guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens when the criminals will just get their hands on them anyway.

I have never owned a gun and don't ever plan on owning one.
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I think every citizen was law abiding at some point, and then they broke the law.

The problem you give a gun to a law abiding citizen and then that citizen has some issues (divorce, job loss, drug/alcohol abuse etc) and now what was once a resposible law abiding citizen is now a disgruntled pissed off citizen possibly looking to use thier gun in a criminal way.

Like others have said, to me there is really no answer.... this is just the world we live in and **** happens.
 
fishonjazz said:
I have never seen anything suggesting to BAN guns..... i have seen stuff about types of guns and amount of ammo that clips will hold and more strict background checks. But nothing about banning them (at least nothing seriously considered)
Its kind of ironic that gun enthusiasts are the most paranoid people around..... seems like having guns would make you less paranoid LOL.
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gun control will lead to more and more and more control over guns. thats how politics work it seems.
 
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