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How do the Jazz get this thing back on track?

NUMBERICA

Well-Known Member
2022 Award Winner
Let's start with the obvious (and also probably overwrought and trite): tanking is ugly and lowly. But you don't win **** in the NBA without star power which takes luck, and sometimes you have to make your own luck. Players are also generally their best with the team that drafted them and a team like the Jazz aren't going to lure a superstar in free agency anyway. To keep the stink of throwing games off your players and coaching staff, your front office has to be committed to depleting the product on the court how they can while still keeping an eye on the future. When you're one of two teams in a conference of 15 that have no real hope of making the playoffs and the best player that you currently have for the future is not very explosive and is on the more diminutive side of things, actual victories are more moral than they are practical. Starting with this caveat is important because it's important to note that getting in the trenches is rarely the most ideal way to do things. Unfortunately for the Jazz, this probably IS the most ideal way to do things.

Here are my suggestions:

Trade all vets worth half a **** away for worse (or virtually no) players
That specifically means Marvin Williams and Richard Jefferson. Take back whatever future asset you can so that you can continue to peddle this notion that you're doing the trade for any reason beyond the ugly and obvious. Taking back non-expiring contracts might be necessary, but in those cases, you can ask for more in terms of future assets and do it with a straight face. Here are some ideas that have been mentioned in a different thread or two;
-Marvin Williams for Caron Butler (which would also make the Bucks better)
-Richard Jefferson for Ben Gordon (which would also make the Bobcats better and destroy the Jazz)
-Marvin Williams and Richard Jefferson for Danny Granger and Chris Copeland (franklin)
-Marvin Williams for Steve Nash (and SOME kind of asset if one even exists, I also think Nash could be a nice asset for Burke and/or the coaching staff)
-Marvin Williams for Kendrick Perkins and a 1st rounder (they own Dallas' pick which is top-20 protected through 2017, then unprotected in 2018).
-Richard Jefferson for Emeka Okafor
The Jazz might also consider trading Evans and/or Garrett as well. Staggering the timing on the trades might help with destabilizing the chemistry as well.

Fire Corbin
Hire Sydney Lowe as interim coach.

Experiment
Dedicate game time to workshop ideas. Work on sets that aren't already in the offense. Dedicate the team to playing different defensive schemes (2-3 zone, 3-2 zone, triangle and 2, box and 1, 2-1-2/full-court press, forcing teams middle into help, etc.) for games on end to develop a depth of understanding. Play Evans at SF, Burks at PG. Use all of these experiences to broaden your eventual options and gather data on how they work when implemented.

Play Kanter
The Jazz play like hot dog**** when he's on the floor. His role and primary directive need to be altered. He should be shooting threes and the offense modified as such. Then he should be told that as long as he's not dogging it or fouling out, that he gets first-crack at minutes. For his mistakes short of dogging it (for which you unceremoniously pull him), just coach as you go and just see if he figures it out. This could really be a make or break decision for him, but that's a risk I think is worth taking since he'll have to figure this out sometime (or not).

Trade Hayward?
I don't know about this one. I like Hayward. Depending on the cost, he could be a really nice piece to have. But on a team of legit options, he may be more of a luxury than a necessity. He's important for what the Jazz do right now, and depending on how the Jazz feel about what he might get offered and what they're willing to match, trading him could accomplish a lot of goals simultaneously.



Any other suggestions?
 
I do agree with the play Kanter portion at least. That is a certain way to lose more, which we do need to do. This Rookie pg is messing **** up guys.
 
Monsons piece the other day was so epic. The last ****ing thing we need is Marvin and Jefferson, who have miraculously revived their careers in a contract year, ruining our future. Something has to be done there ASAP and I think we solve most of our winning problems. These guys have no desire to be here next year. I have faith Dennis Lindsey sees what we see and will right this ship.
 
We all know Corbin loves himself some vets, so the best solution is to trade decent vets (Marvin & Jefferson) for bad vets. Ty won't be able to help himself no matter how bad the vets are, he'll play them and we'll go back to losing. Definitely a bonus if we can snag a draft pick or two in the trade(s).
 
First thing:

Gotta get rid of the 2 vets who are desperately trying out for new teams. Gotta get rid of them. Get a 2016 second rounder or a bag of chips for them. I don't care.

Gotta force kanter and favors together and let them figure things out. We need to know more about kanter.

I would look and dropping Hayward's mins. We know who he is, and it isn't all that great. Is burks a keeper? Need to see.

Fire Corbin. He's like Jefferson and Williams, desperately trying to salvage his career. Should have fired him last year. Kept him on and now he's screwing up the tank. Of course he would. He gains nothing by helping the jazz develop while scoring a top draft pick for his replacement to enjoy coaching.
 
bottom line corbin doesnt develop our core group ... instead he lets them ride the pine .. we should be playing Kanter until its obvious he is or isnt going to make it
 
Monsons piece the other day was so epic. The last ****ing thing we need is Marvin and Jefferson, who have miraculously revived their careers in a contract year, ruining our future. Something has to be done there ASAP and I think we solve most of our winning problems. These guys have no desire to be here next year. I have faith Dennis Lindsey sees what we see and will right this ship.

May be Lindsey is wanting to get some assets back by trading Jefferson and Marvin at the trade deadline (i.e., to a contender), hence the green light to play them big minutes earlier in the season.


Pretty sure Lindsey has something brewing....
 
Keep doing exactly what we have been doing with Marvin Williams.

Eventually, teams are going to figure out if you throw a big guy on williams and run iso's creating a harsh, physical environment they can beat us.

Next year, we draft a stretch 4 or throw big dollars at Spencer Hawes or like big that can stretch to beyond the 3 line.
 
I agree on the idea of trading Williams and Jefferson.

Put JLIII back into the lineup as the primary PG back up.

I say keep Hayward but increase the focus on him as the primary ball handler.

Kanter back into the starting lineup.

Play Biedrins

Play Harris


Remember that if we take back non expiring contracts that the Jazz still have their amnesty.
 
Let's start with the obvious (and also probably overwrought and trite): tanking is ugly and lowly. But you don't win **** in the NBA without star power which takes luck, and sometimes you have to make your own luck. Players are also generally their best with the team that drafted them and a team like the Jazz aren't going to lure a superstar in free agency anyway. To keep the stink of throwing games off your players and coaching staff, your front office has to be committed to depleting the product on the court how they can while still keeping an eye on the future. When you're one of two teams in a conference of 15 that have no real hope of making the playoffs and the best player that you currently have for the future is not very explosive and is on the more diminutive side of things, actual victories are more moral than they are practical. Starting with this caveat is important because it's important to note that getting in the trenches is rarely the most ideal way to do things. Unfortunately for the Jazz, this probably IS the most ideal way to do things.

Here are my suggestions:

Trade all vets worth half a **** away for worse (or virtually no) players
That specifically means Marvin Williams and Richard Jefferson. Take back whatever future asset you can so that you can continue to peddle this notion that you're doing the trade for any reason beyond the ugly and obvious. Taking back non-expiring contracts might be necessary, but in those cases, you can ask for more in terms of future assets and do it with a straight face. Here are some ideas that have been mentioned in a different thread or two;
-Marvin Williams for Caron Butler (which would also make the Bucks better)
-Richard Jefferson for Ben Gordon (which would also make the Bobcats better and destroy the Jazz)
-Marvin Williams and Richard Jefferson for Danny Granger and Chris Copeland (franklin)
-Marvin Williams for Steve Nash (and SOME kind of asset if one even exists, I also think Nash could be a nice asset for Burke and/or the coaching staff)
-Marvin Williams for Kendrick Perkins and a 1st rounder (they own Dallas' pick which is top-20 protected through 2017, then unprotected in 2018).
-Richard Jefferson for Emeka Okafor
The Jazz might also consider trading Evans and/or Garrett as well. Staggering the timing on the trades might help with destabilizing the chemistry as well.

Fire Corbin
Hire Sydney Lowe as interim coach.

Experiment
Dedicate game time to workshop ideas. Work on sets that aren't already in the offense. Dedicate the team to playing different defensive schemes (2-3 zone, 3-2 zone, triangle and 2, box and 1, 2-1-2/full-court press, forcing teams middle into help, etc.) for games on end to develop a depth of understanding. Play Evans at SF, Burks at PG. Use all of these experiences to broaden your eventual options and gather data on how they work when implemented.

Play Kanter
The Jazz play like hot dog**** when he's on the floor. His role and primary directive need to be altered. He should be shooting threes and the offense modified as such. Then he should be told that as long as he's not dogging it or fouling out, that he gets first-crack at minutes. For his mistakes short of dogging it (for which you unceremoniously pull him), just coach as you go and just see if he figures it out. This could really be a make or break decision for him, but that's a risk I think is worth taking since he'll have to figure this out sometime (or not).

Trade Hayward?
I don't know about this one. I like Hayward. Depending on the cost, he could be a really nice piece to have. But on a team of legit options, he may be more of a luxury than a necessity. He's important for what the Jazz do right now, and depending on how the Jazz feel about what he might get offered and what they're willing to match, trading him could accomplish a lot of goals simultaneously.



Any other suggestions?


all wonderful suggestions and a great overall thread.
repped.

One thing i would add is that there is no way in hell the bucks would do the suggested trade (unless they think marvin makes them worse than butler or we sweeten the pot with draft picks) as the bucks are smart enough to be trying to lose right now
 
First thing:

Gotta get rid of the 2 vets who are desperately trying out for new teams. Gotta get rid of them. Get a 2016 second rounder or a bag of chips for them. I don't care.

Gotta force kanter and favors together and let them figure things out. We need to know more about kanter.

I would look and dropping Hayward's mins. We know who he is, and it isn't all that great. Is burks a keeper? Need to see.

Fire Corbin. He's like Jefferson and Williams, desperately trying to salvage his career. Should have fired him last year. Kept him on and now he's screwing up the tank. Of course he would. He gains nothing by helping the jazz develop while scoring a top draft pick for his replacement to enjoy coaching.

Good stuff
 
Great post. Thanks OP.

I think you forgot a big one: injuries

You know, those tricky or mysterious ones like skin infection to the knees...

It is timne to shut down Hayward for 10 games with a bruised pinky finger or ear infection. Anything could do the trick. Remember GS last year?
 
They just need to place Luke3, Beans and Harris a lot of minutes and things will take care of themselves. We don't our youngsters getting too tired.
 
No need to get creative we lost without a point guard. Don't play burke more than 10 mins a game. We will lose plenty.
 
Let me see if i understand so many people's desire to lose, lose, lose. We do this thing (at great risk to our young players) on purpose, in hopes of landing a superstar player in the draft. While at the same time moaning that no superstar player would actually come to Utah and if they did we could not keep him. Variously, due to his own desire to be elsewhere or we can't afford to keep them. Does this about sum up the plans of so many of you brilliant strategist.

Let me ask a few simple questions. Was Karl Malone a superstar? Was John Stockton a superstar? Did they stay in Utah long enough to please everyone? How did we acquire them? Can you say second leading scorer in history, and how about all-time assist leader by a mile. Just in case you are goofy enough to argue they were not "really" superstar players.

Collectively we do a lot of talk about "developing" our young players, and then a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth if they actually seem to be improving, resulting in wins. Causing the situation where anyone who plays too good should immediately be traded. Can anyone say "conflicted". Leaving us with one very high draft pick and nothing else.

I am not personally on your spaceship to "tankland". Go Jazz!! Build this team using all available avenues not sacrificing everything for one big long shot. I realize not many here will agree with this post.
 
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