How long are you going to tollerate losing?

[gregbroncs]

It does mean something. Perception is reality. The perception is the Jazz are doing the same thing as GS because, well, they are.

Bill Simmons is a Hack that hates the Jazz. I don't generally regard anything he says about the Jazz as semi intelligent. He will take the road of attacking them every time. So no it really does not mean any thing.
.
Also perception is reality only if you let it be. His opinion doesn't change my perception one iota.

 

[Farmer.Tan]

The exact same way I did during the 2003 – 2004 season.
I am going to sit back and enjoy watching a bunch of young players who are not yet prima donnas, Who are still willing to work hard and play together as a team, And who will end up winning more games than most people think.

 

[Stoked]

here is my question. if our core + awful scrubs only win us 35 games this year and we get a top-5 pick, do you really think the rookie we draft next year is worth 15+ wins individually? this rebuild is just beginning and it's a 2-4 year process. we will suck for a while unless our core is acutally better than we think, which means we won't be ending up with a top-5 pick next year.

Well the C6 will be better the following year, plus the drafted rookie(s) and then the Jazz go hard into free agency.

 

[Jeditiger]

Who says we are going to lose that much?

I like this spirit! #goJazz

 

[Stoked]

It does mean something. Perception is reality. The perception is the Jazz are doing the same thing as GS because, well, they are.

My perception is that what GST did and Utah is doign is different. Therefore it is reality. The perception is they are not becasue well they are not.

/Thread

Basically so far in this thread it has been this:

Same as GST:
Fishonjazz
Green
Hotttnikkk

Different than GST
PKM
Stoked
Zulu
Gregbroncs
Whiskypriest (repped me in agreement)
Jeditiger

 

[Dr. Jones]

Really? Then why would Ty tell the organization that the path they were taking was not beneficial to his long term job security? Why did he say, that even with the moves they are making, he will be the good soldier and lie on the grenade this year in hopes that his employment will continue? Those don't sound like words a head coach would say of a team whose goal was to win as many games as possible.

If the Jazz were trying to win, if their goal was to make the playoffs this year, we would not have let Millsap walk, we would not have traded for Jefferson and Biedrens, we would have resigned Foye, etc.

It's ok. This is how the NBA works. Boston did it and they ended up winning titles because of it. OKC did it and they are now competing for titles. SA did THE SAME THING AS GS, and they are competing/winning titles. It's not the end of the world. So what, the Jazz play the same game other teams play. It's ok. The good news is, this will make us much better in the long run, just as it did for GS.

/thread

The argument you're making here is that the Jazz made decisions that will likely result in more losses this year. That is not the argument. Everyone agrees with that.
We're arguing the reasons. Playing young guys, them getting chemistry and experience, being able to really evaluate what you've got, and knowing better how to fill holes through the draft and FA is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> than the reason being to lose a lot for a single draft pick.

At this point I'm only still debating this because I am flabbergasted at how someone can survive life with such a narrow-minded simplistic brain. No offense. (if you write something now and end it with "No offense" you're gay)

It does mean something. Perception is reality. The perception is the Jazz are doing the same thing as GS because, well, they are.

WTF does perception have anything to do with anything at all? We're not debating what the some media guy thinks.. we're debating FO strategy.

Short of injury, I'd be all of shocked, pissed and embarrassed to be a Jazz fan if that happened.

The difference is that the Jazz will try to win with what they have, while GSW actually tried to lose games. If you think the Jazz are going to try to lose games, then I completely disagree with you.

That sums it up for me.

 

[Stoked]

I like this spirit! #goJazz

This!

GO JAZZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[NCJazz]

The exact same way I did during the 2003 – 2004 season.
I am going to sit back and enjoy watching a bunch of young players who are not yet prima donnas, Who are still willing to work hard and play together as a team, And who will end up winning more games than most people think.

Well lets hope the games are close but that we lose most of them.

 

[Stoked]

Well lets hope the games are close but that we lose most of them.

As long as the Jazz come to play I will be happy about winning alot of games and ok with losing alot of games. If the Jazz are winning alot than that means that the group we are building off of is coming into their own and can be a force to be reckoned with as they are now.

 

[A-Train (old)]

Bill Simmons is a Hack that hates the Jazz. I don't generally regard anything he says about the Jazz as semi intelligent. He will take the road of attacking them every time. So no it really does not mean any thing.
.
Also perception is reality only if you let it be. His opinion doesn't change my perception one iota.

Look at my sig. He is not a hack.

 

[Jazz Traveler]

To heck with Simmons. It's only one opinion. Others have said the Jazz are taking the right step in rebuilding.

I can not see the Jazz ever deliberately throwing a game. That isn't what this organization is about. There's more talent for this year's team than there was for the AK led team that was supposed to get 8 wins. Remember how much fun it was to watch the scrappy underdogs come away with a win?

This year may start out a little rough but I expect to see young players trying their hardest, learning and growing, and starting to gel. Wouldn't doubt that we just miss the playoffs by only a few games. Golden State was tanking as hard as they could with the roster they had. Look for the Jazz to surprise everybody with their scrappiness. The same way the Jazz underperformed this last year, I think they will exceed expectations this season..

 

[A-Train (old)]

Bill Simmons is a good analyst in my opinion. He speaks what's on his mind unlike most of the ESPN hacks who agree with everything that goes on. He is right we could have gotten a few good players with that $25 mil and maybe got an 8th seed, but we all know we would rather have a top-10 pick in the 2014 draft and have $25 mil of cap room next summer, than rather be stuck with two vets with the $25 who would be taking minutes away from our young players.

 

[A-Train (old)]

To heck with Simmons. It's only one opinion. Others have said the Jazz are taking the right step in rebuilding.

I can not see the Jazz ever deliberately throwing a game. That isn't what this organization is about. There's more talent for this year's team than there was for the AK led team that was supposed to get 8 wins. Remember how much fun it was to watch the scrappy underdogs come away with a win?

This year may start out a little rough but I expect to see young players trying their hardest, learning and growing, and starting to gel. Wouldn't doubt that we just miss the playoffs by only a few games. Golden State was tanking as hard as they could with the roster they had. Look for the Jazz to surprise everybody with their scrappiness. The same way the Jazz underperformed this last year, I think they will exceed expectations this season..

We won't throw any games. We start Burke, Burks, Hayward, Favors, Kanter and let the chips where they may fall, which is most likely in the lottery.

 

[Stoked]

Look at my sig. He is not a hack.

Just playing devil's advocate. I have no opinion an Simmons being a hack or not.

How does your sig prove he isn't?

 

[Stoked]

We won't throw any games. We start Burke, Burks, Hayward, Favors, Kanter and let the chips where they may fall, which is most likely in the lottery.

Which we are all in agreement on.

 

[MVP]

We've been tolerating it for 3 years without hope of obtaining an awesome draft pick.

I doubt this year will make us all sad and depressed. It's sort of what we've been asking for. Demanding. We need to rebuild.

That's what we as fans were asking for. Question is though how this losing will affect young players mentality. I am a bit afraid some of them may be mentally crushed/destroyed from all the losing Jazz will encounter this year. 35 min a game is fun as long as it is competitive. But if they are getting blown out all the time it is going to be hard for them to keep competitive composure and develop in the right way. Plus we have Corbin factor - is he a good motivator and supporter to help youngsters through tough times?

 

[A-Train (old)]

Just playing devil's advocate. I have no opinion an Simmons being a hack or not.

How does your sig prove he isn't?

He approves of the Jazz taking on Biedrins, Jefferson, Rush, and picks to tank.

 

[nightmare3983]

LOL.. I dunno man... With what we're doing, we're setting ourselves up in a position to "go young" for the entire season.


GSW "go young" with their final 20 games....

I don't really see a big difference ... to be honest witchu

I haven't gotten through the whole thread yet, so sorry if this has been mentioned, but in the last couple games of the season, the Warriors benched their best active player, the young Klay Thompson in the 4th quarter. They were absolutely trying to lose those games.

 

[Dr. Jones]

I haven't gotten through the whole thread yet, so sorry if this has been mentioned, but in the last couple games of the season, the Warriors benched their best active player, the young Klay Thompson in the 4th quarter. They were absolutely trying to lose those games.

Yes. The argument here isn't whether GSW tanked.. we all agree on that.
The disagreement is whether the Jazz made the moves they did in order to be bad on purpose and tank for a good draft pick.

My take is they are completely different circumstances and intentions. I do not believe we made the moves in order to be bad and lose. I believe got rid of bad contracts to have cap space and we made room for our young guys to get playing time they need in order to;
1) Gain experience
2) Form chemistry with one another
3) Get enough floor time to be adequately evaluated

This allows us to make the smartest and most informed decisions with not only draft but the spending of our $31MM in cap space next year. Does it hurt that we could lose a lot of games in the process and get a better pick? Of course not. I just find it absurd that we've made all these moves purely to tank.

 

[nightmare3983]

Yes. The argument here isn't whether GSW tanked.. we all agree on that.
The disagreement is whether the Jazz made the moves they did in order to be bad on purpose and tank for a good draft pick.

My take is they are completely different circumstances and intentions. I do not believe we made the moves in order to be bad and lose. I believe got rid of bad contracts to have cap space and we made room for our young guys to get playing time they need in order to;
1) Gain experience
2) Form chemistry with one another
3) Get enough floor time to be adequately evaluated

This allows us to make the smartest and most informed decisions with not only draft but the spending of our $31MM in cap space next year. Does it hurt that we could lose a lot of games in the process and get a better pick? Of course not. I just find it absurd that we've made all these moves purely to tank.

This, especially since the Jazz don't have to get a certain position in the lottery to keep their pick.