RandyForRubio
Well-Known Member
I take it you've never conversed with Thriller before.
How should a history teacher handle the "N" word?
- Thread starter ♪alt13
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I take it you've never conversed with Thriller before.
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
I feel like I'm piling on. You're a good guy Colton. But you're completely in the dark.
The state of Utah has a requirement for educators to provide parents with a list of movies they are going to show that are above a G rating. Teachers will then include this list and permission slip typically at the start of the year usually in their disclosure.
Students who don't Return this slip cannot legally watch these movies. Alt assignments are then Provided.
Legally, teachers in k-12 cannot require students to watch any movie that their parent/child objects to.
Rated R movies are forbidden, regardless of permission slips.
So clearly, this was the PG version and most likely this veteran teachers got the required permission slips.
If this parent/student had an objection about the movie, discussion, or assignment, they could have requested an alt assignment. No teacher would object to giving a student a textbook assignment in the library rather than having their name dragged through the mud for $30k.
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
Get your facts straight about k-12 education in Utah before you debate with me. If you feel like the policy I've stated is wrong, inform me. But if ad hominem attacks are all you can use, then you've already lost.
Miggs
Well-Known Member
Clearly? So you're saying it was rated PG despite having the word ****** in it? And that's clear to you?
Teachers don't mess around when it comes to those disclosures haha
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
They don't. All middle schools that I've worked in (3 districts) require the disclosures to be over viewed and approved by dept heads and administrators.
Movie listings are part of these. In fact, I don't know of a single teacher who doesn't have a movie list. From health to social studies.
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
Pepsi Cola donated thousands of copies of this movie edited for k-12 education. All districts in Utah have access to this movie and all schools that I've worked with have had a copy specifically to be used in 8th grade.
You're free to believe that this teacher and elected school board member broke Utah law and showed an unauthorized R rated version of this movie. Which would easily result in stiff disciplinary action from his school (possible termination) and possible loss of his elected position on the board.
Or, you can believe that he used one of the thousands of edited copies donated to his district/school.
Care to place some money on which one of us is right?
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
https://www.standard.net/State/2016...ially-charged-word?printFriendly=201605041547
Difficult to edit for readability and quote on my phone.
So basically he violated two policies:
* He used the n word
* he didn't include the movie on his movie list. A surprising oversight I'll admit. But certainly nothing worthy of termination.
* He had a confederate flag up last year. But had to take it down. Unbelievable. What other possible setting should you have that flag up? When I taught us history I put on display the old Japanese empire flag, the Soviet Union flag, and the Nazi flag on display during our WWII and Cold War units. Should I have gotten in trouble? It's a prop. It's educational. It's part of education.
But
* The movie is the edited version donated by Pepsi cola. It's the school's copy.
* The movie has been approved by the district
* the movie uses the n word... Like a lot. The violence is edited. But the n word isn't because this is like supposed to be educational or something. Crazy.
* mommy still thinks her son was subjected to the R rated version. Despite what the school's investigation found. Cuz you know, parents know best.
* mommy wants the teacher fired
* mommy says the student doesn't feel safe at school.
* the school gave him a slap on the wrist because this is bs and that his lawyers would have a field day with this long and expensive litigation if he pressed charges.
Like everything in our educational system here in conservative states. We bitch about how little people know about our country, history, etc. we will approve of movies for kids to watch. But Heaven forbid they learn anything.
The district approved and owns a copy of a movie that uses the n word... A lot. But heaven forbid the teacher explain what that word means.
So typical of regressive red states.
We hate abortion and teen pregnancy! But heaven forbid you ever teach sex education!
Difficult to edit for readability and quote on my phone.
So basically he violated two policies:
* He used the n word
* he didn't include the movie on his movie list. A surprising oversight I'll admit. But certainly nothing worthy of termination.
* He had a confederate flag up last year. But had to take it down. Unbelievable. What other possible setting should you have that flag up? When I taught us history I put on display the old Japanese empire flag, the Soviet Union flag, and the Nazi flag on display during our WWII and Cold War units. Should I have gotten in trouble? It's a prop. It's educational. It's part of education.
But
* The movie is the edited version donated by Pepsi cola. It's the school's copy.
* The movie has been approved by the district
* the movie uses the n word... Like a lot. The violence is edited. But the n word isn't because this is like supposed to be educational or something. Crazy.
* mommy still thinks her son was subjected to the R rated version. Despite what the school's investigation found. Cuz you know, parents know best.
* mommy wants the teacher fired
* mommy says the student doesn't feel safe at school.
* the school gave him a slap on the wrist because this is bs and that his lawyers would have a field day with this long and expensive litigation if he pressed charges.
Like everything in our educational system here in conservative states. We bitch about how little people know about our country, history, etc. we will approve of movies for kids to watch. But Heaven forbid they learn anything.
The district approved and owns a copy of a movie that uses the n word... A lot. But heaven forbid the teacher explain what that word means.
So typical of regressive red states.
We hate abortion and teen pregnancy! But heaven forbid you ever teach sex education!
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The Thriller
Well-Known Member
In all seriousness, how many of you would've been offended by me having those flags placed on a table as props during those units? I never thought that people might be offended by them. It's not like they were flown or pledged to. They were used as props. The days I had the Nazi flag out it was used as part table cloth for the WWII and holocaust books I had on the table for the students to see and even check out if desired.
I thought I was being a good educator, not a selfish racist trying to make kids feel Uncomfortable.
That year I blocked the windows out and set up a holocaust museum. For a day the students received a profile and walked through the classroom learning about the holocaust and a victim. Essentially the same thing you'd do at the holocaust museum in LA or DC.
Several teachers from other departments came up and brought their kids through it. A few said that we should put that display up in the school sometime for all kids to go through. Like during tolerance week or something. I also had the Soviet flag and pics of Kruchev and Kennedy for the Cuban middle crisis.
Here I thought I was just giving he kids a good educational experience. Apparently not.
I guess we could just read out of a textbook next time or something. Which is probably what this 8th grade teacher will probably do next year. Here kids. Read 5 pages on the civil war. Boom. Now you're educated.
Murika
I thought I was being a good educator, not a selfish racist trying to make kids feel Uncomfortable.
That year I blocked the windows out and set up a holocaust museum. For a day the students received a profile and walked through the classroom learning about the holocaust and a victim. Essentially the same thing you'd do at the holocaust museum in LA or DC.
Several teachers from other departments came up and brought their kids through it. A few said that we should put that display up in the school sometime for all kids to go through. Like during tolerance week or something. I also had the Soviet flag and pics of Kruchev and Kennedy for the Cuban middle crisis.
Here I thought I was just giving he kids a good educational experience. Apparently not.
I guess we could just read out of a textbook next time or something. Which is probably what this 8th grade teacher will probably do next year. Here kids. Read 5 pages on the civil war. Boom. Now you're educated.
Murika
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NAOS
Well-Known Member
I'm late to this thread, but I thought I'd just say that this is one terrible piece of reporting.
RandyForRubio
Well-Known Member
My comment was about you in general, not on this topic. I didn't expect you to pick up on that though.
No doubt, that's all the first week of school was for me every year.
Miggs
Well-Known Member
Some things never change.
I'm old school, with a dim view of PC issues in general. I go with "sticks and stones may break my bones, but words can never hurt me." I think we're being "schooled" for mass manipulation by literal mobs of paid operatives, say folks answering ads on Craigs list for $50 to show up, carry some signs, and say stuff to random passersby to make the news out that we're a nation of haters that need to be rounded up and re-educated.
oh, I've had my share of hate coming at me, I just don't givadamn.
Any word that exists in history, or in our imagination, should be spelled out in full, and pronounced as people ever pronounced it. We can then discuss the intelligence behind some people's use/misuse of it, and express better opinions. Stop with the campaign against freedom of speech, freedom of opinion, freedom of thought; teach the abused to laugh it off and prove the haters ignoramuses, that's all.
oh, and yes, I think PC patrolmen are haters of the worst kind. Who do you think you are?
oh, I've had my share of hate coming at me, I just don't givadamn.
Any word that exists in history, or in our imagination, should be spelled out in full, and pronounced as people ever pronounced it. We can then discuss the intelligence behind some people's use/misuse of it, and express better opinions. Stop with the campaign against freedom of speech, freedom of opinion, freedom of thought; teach the abused to laugh it off and prove the haters ignoramuses, that's all.
oh, and yes, I think PC patrolmen are haters of the worst kind. Who do you think you are?
I never called for his termination.
But still, not including the movie in his movie list and requiring students to watch it without an opt-out (which violates the "students who don't return the slip cannot legally watch the movies" policy you quoted), and using the n-word repeatedly in class, are not behaviors appropriate for 8th grade teaching, I guess we all agree. If he had followed protocol then we wouldn't be having this thread.
Not sure who you're directing this to, but no one here has expressed offense at that type of thing. Seems reasonable to me. And no one has called you a selfish racist.
JimLes
Well-Known Member
I have a question about this one. I obviously don't know how things work in Utah, but here in Alberta, we have a provincial curriculum which provides you with a list of pre-approved texts for say, English Lit classes. Texts here nowadays very explicitly includes movies, too. Now, the curriculum says this is simply a list of recommended texts, but a teacher can feel free to teach other things, using their judgement.
The pre-approved list is bulletproof, though. You absolutely cannot be questioned on showing anything on that list, as long as it's recommended for the given grade. If parents have issues, it is their job to look at the list(freely available online) and figure out if they have a beef with anything. There are no forms sent home to be signed or anything like that. If you have an issue with a text, it is your responsibility to inquire into whether the teacher is teaching it and ask that your kid be given an alternative assignment. If you fail to do that ahead of time and the book or the movie is on the pre-approved list, your kid is going to read/watch it.
So, what I'm trying to say her is that I'm unclear on whether there is such a master list in Utah. I know this is Social Studies and not English, but do you have to get prior approval for something that is explicitly part of the curriculum?
Also, I'm pretty sure when I've shown Shawshank Redemption, which is nearly mandatory for grade 11 students, it was the version that played in theatres.
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
Yes, districts here have approved reading lists which teachers must follow. If a teacher wants a book to be approved it must be submitted to the district's committee and they must read and approve it. Typically this takes months to accomplish.
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
It wasn't directed at anyone here but was in reaction to the mommy (and people like her). In the article i linked, mommy was calling for this teacher's termination, how she would expect that type of language at a KKK rally, etc.
When I taught us history I had flags from Japan, the Soviet Union, and Nazi Germany on display. I had pics of those dictators on display. The way some crappy parents look for ways to get educators (this state's punching bag) in trouble explains a lot on why there's such a teacher shortage and why education is slipping.
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
Right. He violated protocol. That's it.
99 percent of all 8th grade classes this month are watching this movie and I guarantee you most will have a discussion about that racist term too.