fishonjazz
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I agree with this
Is Gordon Hayward overrated?
- Thread starter Stifle Tower
- Start date
fishonjazz
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If Gordon gets 5 years 150 million then he will be overpaid. Like AK.
We all wanted the jazz to give AK his contract at the time it was given because we thought he would be a star. We regretted it.
With hayward I'm already pretty certain that he is not a star so I don't think it's wise to give him star money.
VoiceofSanity
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Yep he is not overrated or underrated. He is a good player who got a max offer from another team and is going to get a ton of money next Summer. At the same time he has never been to an all star game, never been an all nba player, and never won an NBA award like you said which is also fair.
Basically Hayward is a very good, but not a great player. The Jazz will not compete for a title with him as the #1 option. The current Jazz team will continue to improve, but to compete for a title two things need to happen; Exum needs to become the star player many believe he can be, and hopefully after winning 50 games next year they can look attractive to a star free agent in the 2017 offseason.
Because Hayward is better than AK. Also AKs contract didnt really hurt us that much. We didnt have a chance at elite players in FA. We didnt let players leave that we couldnt resign. Teams overpay a couple players, that is fine. You just cant have 3+ bloated contracts.
VoiceofSanity
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Which is why next year is so important. IF Exum comes back and has a good year and the Jazz win 50 games. It will look like an attractive destination for free agents. As of right now, the Jazz are just a team that has had 3 straight losing seasons and 4 straight lottery years.
I dont think Hayward is overrated. I think he is as valuable as a young player can be. He seems to have a good work ethic and has improved every year since he has been in the league. He scored more points this year than he did the year before with less minutes. Among SF's, the kid is wholly talented.
I am definitely a fan of his.
That being said, the biggest issue I have with G is his penchant for ill timed TO's, boneheaded plays and lack of clutchness. I know this means a lot of different things to many people but I am not confident in Hayward as I am with, let's say, Hood. Hood has that intangible that I think Hayward does not. I hope that makes sense.
I am definitely a fan of his.
That being said, the biggest issue I have with G is his penchant for ill timed TO's, boneheaded plays and lack of clutchness. I know this means a lot of different things to many people but I am not confident in Hayward as I am with, let's say, Hood. Hood has that intangible that I think Hayward does not. I hope that makes sense.
D
Deleted member 848
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Stats go against your "lack of clutchness" claims
My post is more of an eye test than anything. And maybe there's some confirmation bias at hand...who knows. I will say that I remember more of Hood's clutchness than I do Hayward's.
Hood shot 26% in the final minute of close games compared to 56% from Hayward.
In clutch minutes Hood shot 40% and Hayward shot 43%.
So yeah, you are completely wrong.
D
Deleted member 848
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Biggest Jazzfanz fallacy.
D
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This rebuild becomes a colossal failure if we lose Gordon.
If the only offers on the table for Hayward + whatever are scraps, then obviously you don't trade him. But if there's anything of significance out there for him or a package with him in it, I think it's time to take a serious look.
But let's be clear, him leaving for absolutely nothing is a scenario very seriously in play. And for good reason on both sides.
But let's be clear, him leaving for absolutely nothing is a scenario very seriously in play. And for good reason on both sides.
fishonjazz
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His assists and rebounds have actually went down for the last two years per 36 and his scoring was actually lower this year than last year per 36.
He actually played more minutes per game this year than last too btw. (36 this year and 34 last year)
Crazy how when you start starting Rudy Gobert other players rebound numbers go down.
I've thought it was a colossal failure for two years now. People are starting to realize it and unfortunately the Millers will soon be informed as much as they begin to lose life long fans. It is evident they must do something dramatic to bring hope back. Hell, some of the most dedicated fans at jazzfanz are becoming disenfranchised.
We aren't putting up with another rebuild after this botched job. They had better realize as much before it is too late.
He is a GREAT 2nd player on a team and hopefully Exum or someone else becomes the Jazz superstar. Hayward is a great Robin. I think last night showed that he is not at the caliber of even a retiring Kobe in crunch time. The last 90 seconds, Kobe was old Kobe and Hayward was too human.
I agree with you but the numbers say otherwise.
l Abach l
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It's funny how malleable and easily deceived (some members) of a fan base, who watched their team get steamrolled by The GOAT, Michael Jordan, are....
I wonder how that could've happened in just 20 years.. Why would they place their faith in Hayward so easily?? The west is stronger now then it ever was..
Some of y'all act like this dude is Prime Tracy McGrady, he's echelons below...
How'd the standards get this low?? Is Al Jefferson still to blame?? Hayward isn't even close to as good (for Utah) as prime Deron.. How has that been lost in these conversations??
Same folks still trying to spin Hayward conversations into Burks vs Hayward discussions when Burks is already on-board for the next bunch of years, at an agreeable/reasonable salary for his age/talent/role/production.
These are some of the same folks that were breaking teenage Andrew Wiggins chops over lack of Killer Instinct.. right??? These are the people here giving 26 year old, highest-paid on the team, Hayward a pass, even calling him underrated.. It's totally disingenuous.. almost makes me think he's getting the benefit of the doubt because he's 'homegrown' and white..
I wonder if some of you truly see what it takes to actually win in the NBA?? It's much more than stats and efficiency, you still need to, as a team, will it to be so.. With Hayward as the top option on this team, that means 'the others' (who are all young as ****) have the option to make it happen themselves, or defer to Hayward (Or Favors) who aren't all that much better than a coinflip in big spots..
Luckily the FO knows this and has tweaked the roster so it's not set up to be made or broken by Hayward.. He's forced their hand to prepare themselves for him to leave after next season. With Hood here, Burks on a reasonable deal for 3 more seasons, multiple draft picks and capspace, they've done a better job than anyone could've expected.
"Pressure burts pipes, but it also buffs diamonds" Hayward has shown signs of bursting under not even all that much pressure, he's 26.. chances are he' a good, not great player and will remain as such..
Stephen Curry really started to break out near when he was about Haywards age, that's a bigtime outlier though..
Bravo. Incredible post!!!
Not sure how I missed that post. It is a good one.
It's funny how malleable and easily deceived (some members) of a fan base, who watched their team get steamrolled by The GOAT, Michael Jordan, are....
I wonder how that could've happened in just 20 years.. Why would they place their faith in Hayward so easily
Some of y'all act like this dude is Prime Tracy McGrady, he's echelons below...
How'd the standards get this low?? Is Al Jefferson still to blame?? Hayward isn't even close to as good (for Utah) as prime Deron.. How has that been lost in these conversations
Same folks still trying to spin Hayward conversations into Burks vs Hayward discussions when Burks is already on-board for the next bunch of years, at an agreeable/reasonable salary for his age/talent/role/production.
These are some of the same folks that were breaking teenage Andrew Wiggins chops over lack of Killer Instinct.. right??? These are the people here giving 26 year old, highest-paid on the team, Hayward a pass, even calling him underrated.. It's totally disingenuous.. almost makes me think he's getting the benefit of the doubt because he's 'homegrown' and white..
I wonder if some of you truly see what it takes to actually win in the NBA?? It's much more than stats and efficiency, you still need to, as a team, will it to be so.. With Hayward as the top option on this team, that means 'the others' (who are all young as ****) have the option to make it happen themselves, or defer to Hayward (Or Favors) who aren't all that much better than a coinflip in big spots..
Luckily the FO knows this and has tweaked the roster so it's not set up to be made or broken by Hayward.. He's forced their hand to prepare themselves for him to leave after next season. With Hood here, Burks on a reasonable deal for 3 more seasons, multiple draft picks and capspace, they've done a better job than anyone could've expected.
"Pressure burts pipes, but it also buffs diamonds" Hayward has shown signs of bursting under not even all that much pressure, he's 26.. chances are he' a good, not great player and will remain as such..
Stephen Curry really started to break out near when he was about Haywards age, that's a bigtime outlier though..
"But Dante Exum is coming back and Alec Burks isn't injuried any more! 2004 Detroit Pistons baby!"