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It's hard to judge Dennis Lindsey

Engorged On Unborn Gore said:
I see.

Definitely new here. But I've been watching the Jazz since the '87 series against the Lakers when I was 12.
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Welcome aboard the crazy train.
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Isn't it obvious? Koc is no longer the GM. Instead he got promoted (because he was so fantastic at the job he had) to President of Basketball Operations. He's the puppet master pulling the strings of DL. Bottom line, you do not let players like Jefferson and Millsap walk for nothing. Even in a year where their contact is expiring. By looking to make a move you give other teams the impression that you have a pre discussed arrangement with that player and full intentions to resign. It's a poker game and we showed our hand half way through that season. I read a post from someone saying we didn't resign because we wanted to tank. That's BS. If so, what did we talk for? The team we have now can't make it to the playoffs. So if your right, fail! As a team that's serious to win, you don't tank, you reload. I'm not afraid to say the Jazz upper management is awful. They have no desire to win a championship.
 
Diamond77 said:
I blame Lindsey that he didn't build a solid bench for this season.
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I think they're still trying to develop young talent for a couple years down the road. Hayward and Favors are entering their prime. Gobert will continue to develop (hopefully) for another couple years. The key with this group was the development of Exum, which just hit a snag. I think they want all these young players to develop together, take their lumps together and "grow internally."

Yeah, bringing in a few choice vets would add to the win total this year, no doubt. Even guys we had in the past, like Mo Williams and Marvin Williams could help this group.
 
Also, I'm not sure what the obsession with Trevor Booker is. I'm still trying to figure out the thing he's good at. It's not shooting, rebounding or defense.
 
Catchall said:
Also, I'm not sure what the obsession with Trevor Booker is. I'm still trying to figure out the thing he's good at. It's not shooting, rebounding or defense.
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He's a Lakers Slapper... though I'm not insinuating that his opinions are as out of touch as our poster of that same name.
 
Overall I'm pleased with DL, but there is one thing that really bugs me that no one is talking about. For his first two or three years as GM every time he came on the radio he talked about how KOC did such a good job of putting the Jazz in a good financial situation. He'd talk about assets and how when the time is right the Jazz will be able to make moves because they are in a better situation than other teams. It was like "Okay Jazz fans, things suck now, but we'll be able to make some moves because we are in a better financial situation than everyone else in the NBA."

Well, when the time finally arrived the league signed new TV contracts and the Jazz were no longer in a better position.

The Jazz organization was aware a new TV deal was going to be put in place and it was going to be lucrative. DL fed us a bunch of crap for his first couple of years.
 
JFFR said:
Overall I'm pleased with DL, but there is one thing that really bugs me that no one is talking about. For his first two or three years as GM every time he came on the radio he talked about how KOC did such a good job of putting the Jazz in a good financial situation. He'd talk about assets and how when the time is right the Jazz will be able to make moves because they are in a better situation than other teams. It was like "Okay Jazz fans, things suck now, but we'll be able to make some moves because we are in a better financial situation than everyone else in the NBA."

Well, when the time finally arrived the league signed new TV contracts and the Jazz were no longer in a better position.

The Jazz organization was aware a new TV deal was going to be put in place and it was going to be lucrative. DL fed us a bunch of crap for his first couple of years.
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This is a much better negative judgement than has been presented. His lack of adding veteran help through free agency or trading and taking on salaries is probably a bit over patient if that makes sense.

They misjudged the Hayward market a bit too... could have locked him into a 4 year deal a little cheaper or a little more team friendly.

All and all though I think we've done really well. There may not have been any good deals out there, but I think if you are going to criticize DL it would be for a lack of bigger deals.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Same return? We would have gotten a protected future first, an international prospect who was a borderline first round pick, and rid ourselves of Novak's contract by letting him walk? I realize some may view that as a pile of meh, but Kanter in a contract year when everyone knew he'd get an offer from someone that would make a GM squirm is basically worth a pile of meh. There were no good fits out there style wise for Kanter so DL got some value. He got market value... its not like he didn't try and get more.

We also had to do it to rid ourselves of that turd and everyone knew it. Wasn't like we were negotiating from a place of power.
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And I agree with part of that, but I'm still not willing to say our return was anything good. Average at best. And lets try to be intellectually honest here, if you're going to refer to Tibor Pleiss as a borderline first round pick, perhaps we should refer to Enes Kanter as a #3 pick, huh? We got Jerret (sucks), Pleiss (below average) and a late pick. Best part was getting rid of Novak's contract, and getting rid of Kanter. I agree that the trade was good overall, but I think our return was average at best.
 
NAOS said:
I noticed you never answered my question about how you've done the math and concluded that we didn't get a "good" return.

We didn't trade the 3rd pick. We traded Enes Kanter. And we traded him just before a new contract that was destined to be bananas.
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Well unfortunately, we don't have this magic formula you're looking for that will give us a precise answer that ends all speculation. This is one of those things called "an opinion". I think we're still allowed to have those these days, maybe not though. I've explained in other posts what our return was from Kanter, and why I think it was subpar. I know you know how to read, so you can find em, I'm not doing your work for you.
 
Howard said:
Well unfortunately, we don't have this magic formula you're looking for that will give us a precise answer that ends all speculation. This is one of those things called "an opinion". I think we're still allowed to have those these days, maybe not though. I've explained in other posts what our return was from Kanter, and why I think it was subpar. I know you know how to read, so you can find em, I'm not doing your work for you.
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wow, u mad brough.

I still think you're hung up on the fact that he was #3 pick. I think it's fair to assume that Lindsey got all he could for him (especially considering he traded him to another team with in the division/conference). In fact, it's weird to claim otherwise. Should he have traded Kanter sooner? In hindsight, definitely. But that's hindsight.
 
Howard said:
And I agree with part of that, but I'm still not willing to say our return was anything good. Average at best. And lets try to be intellectually honest here, if you're going to refer to Tibor Pleiss as a borderline first round pick, perhaps we should refer to Enes Kanter as a #3 pick, huh? We got Jerret (sucks), Pleiss (below average) and a late pick. Best part was getting rid of Novak's contract, and getting rid of Kanter. I agree that the trade was good overall, but I think our return was average at best.
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The difference is that Kanter has proven he wasn't worth that pick... Tibor has not had the opportunity to prove he was a worthy pick. I was stating that because he was a valuable Euro prospect not one that was selected with the 59th pick in the draft.

If we got average value we shouldn't complain. There would have to be circumstances that were in our favor to get above average value and since all circumstances were working against us at that point we did just fine.
 
NAOS said:
wow, u mad brough.

I still think you're hung up on the fact that he was #3 pick. I think it's fair to assume that Lindsey got all he could for him (especially considering he traded him to another team with in the division/conference). In fact, it's weird to claim otherwise. Should he have traded Kanter sooner? In hindsight, definitely. But that's hindsight.
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This is the actual argument that should have been made. We should have moved on sooner, but we still were in discovery mode.
 
Catchall said:
Also, I'm not sure what the obsession with Trevor Booker is. I'm still trying to figure out the thing he's good at. It's not shooting, rebounding or defense.
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Booker became a fan favourite especially after his phrase related to Kanter. A player has to be judged for his performances on the court.
 
Diamond77 said:
He brings energy, what else?
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I mean, as a backup PF he rebounds pretty well, not elite or anything, but definitely above average. He can hit a 3 pointer (he needs to start taking more though). The only thing I really dislike about him is that he is an awful FT shooter.
 
King Cy said:
I mean, as a backup PF he rebounds pretty well, not elite or anything, but definitely above average. He can hit a 3 pointer (he needs to start taking more though). The only thing I really dislike about him is that he is an awful FT shooter.
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He is an average player. I think the Jazz could have found better players than him and Ingles as free agents.

In my opinion Lindsey should be more active in free agency.
 
Diamond77 said:
He is an average player. I think the Jazz could have found better players than him and Ingles as free agents.

In my opinion Lindsey should be more active in free agency.
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Meh, what FA PF signing do you think would have been a reasonably price upgrade over Booker?
 
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