Jazz and Knicks discussing Donovan Mitchell trade per Shams Charania and Tony Jones

[Elizah Huge]

At absolute worst the Knicks 2023 1st will be mid-teens. We should pass on that plus our own top-5 pick for what exactly?

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

No, we shouldn’t. It’s not that hard to understand. Settle for the 3 unprotected 1sts because it means our pick is likely in the top-5 this year in one of the best drafts of the last 15 years.

I won’t settle for nothing less than 4 unprotected and 5-6 picks overall.

 

[Elizah Huge]

I won’t settle for nothing less than 4 unprotected and 5-6 picks overall.

So you’d pass on 3 unprotected and 3 protected and our own top-5 pick this year because you held out for an extra unprotected 1st?

 

[Coach Ellis]

From Hoopsrumors: "If the Jazz don’t get an offer they like from the Knicks or one of those other potential trade partners, they’re comfortable entering the season with Mitchell on their roster. According to Jones, the club believes it’s in a good position to retool the roster around Mitchell and is more inclined to take that route than to accept “90 cents on the dollar” for the three-time All-Star."

Danny Ainge doesn’t give up value in a trade just “because”. . .

Remember back when Hayward left and a bunch of Jazzfanz were like “he should send us Jae Crowder and stuff back” so we can convert it into a sign and trade. . . and Ainge was insisting on getting assets back instead of just doing it - ultimately walked away and signed him outright. Then he traded Crowder, Zizic, IT and a draft pick to get Kyrie Irving.

He’ll walk away from the deal if it’s not to his liking. He’d rather bounce than take a bad deal. I’m okay with that. Knicks come to the table with a real offer or they can watch Mitchell on TV somewhere else.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

So you’d pass on 3 unprotected and 3 protected and our own top-5 pick this year because you held out for an extra unprotected 1st?

At some point its just an ego thing from Danny if he passes on a compromise.

There are even deal I would do that take only 2 unprotected picks if they really want to be able to make their second move you take 23/28 outright... which means they have 24/26/30 they can trade in a year... but if they want that deal I'm taking all the protected picks and getting a swap in 25/27/29 with the Minny pick. It would increase the value of picks you already own.

 

[Coach Ellis]

So you’d pass on 3 unprotected and 3 protected and our own top-5 pick this year because you held out for an extra unprotected 1st?

I think the floor should be the Gobert Trade honestly. If they don’t start at those terms, it’s not worth it, IMO. Giving up a star player in his prime should cost a premium price.

23/25/27 unprotected
29 top 5 protected
28 pick swap
Push for the Dallas and Milwaukee (or Detroit) picks
Toppin, Grimes, maybe Quickley and salary filler

At least Vanderbilt, Beverley and Beasley all seem to be positive value assets - not sure Fournier or Rose are.

 

[idiot]

September 6 a September 26 is really “today”

Time is a flat circle anyway.

Curious why you keep thinking Sept. 6 is going to make a difference. I think it was easier to see with Beverley still on the Jazz, but do you have a specific (or fuzzy) scenario in mind that Beasley or Vanderbilt (or Bolmaro, for that matter) unlock?

 

[Elizah Huge]

I think the floor should be the Gobert Trade honestly. If they don’t start at those terms, it’s not worth it, IMO. Giving up a star player in his prime should cost a premium price.

23/25/27 unprotected
29 top 5 protected
28 pick swap
Push for the Dallas and Milwaukee (or Detroit) picks
Toppin, Grimes, maybe Quickley and salary filler

At least Vanderbilt, Beverley and Beasley all seem to be positive value assets - not sure Fournier or Rose are.

In no circumstance should you walk from 6 total 1sts with 3 of them being unprotected. Let’s get real here.

 

[framer]

I'm beginning to see quite a bit of upside in that Dallas pick. I think they struggle a bit in the regular season.

 

[Coach Ellis]

In no circumstance should you walk from 6 total 1sts with 3 of them being unprotected. Let’s get real here.

Isn’t that basically the deal I outlined?

As long as 3 of the picks are unprotected, I’m less concerned about taking back any of the other picks (outside the Wizards pick - which I think is garbage.)

23/25/27 unprotected picks
Dallas, Detroit and Milwaukee protected picks
One of the protected picks doesn’t have to be the 29 Knicks pick.
I’d still insist on a 28 pick swap and Toppin and Grimes.

 

[framer]

What if we take 4 picks and let NY top 3 or 5 protect the first 3? Odds are they will need to come back and give us assets to unprotect them later anyway.

 

[Jingled]

From Hoopsrumors: "If the Jazz don’t get an offer they like from the Knicks or one of those other potential trade partners, they’re comfortable entering the season with Mitchell on their roster. According to Jones, the club believes it’s in a good position to retool the roster around Mitchell and is more inclined to take that route than to accept “90 cents on the dollar” for the three-time All-Star."

It's obvious the Jazz are using Tony to get the message out there that "they don't have to trade Donovan" and "they're comfortable keeping him and re-tooling around him" to try and put pressure on the Knicks to up their offer. It's all just posturing...they have no intention of actually re-tooling the roster around Donovan to try and be competitive, they're fully planning on a re-build.

 

[Elizah Huge]

Isn’t that basically the deal I outlined?

As long as 3 of the picks are unprotected, I’m less concerned about taking back any of the other picks (outside the Wizards pick - which I think is garbage.)

23/25/27 unprotected picks
Dallas, Detroit and Milwaukee protected picks
One of the protected picks doesn’t have to be the 29 Knicks pick.
I’d still insist on a 28 pick swap and Toppin and Grimes.

Not really because you said the floor was the same as the Gobert deal which is 29 being top-5 protected and I think the Knicks don’t want to include that pick at all. That is the most valuable pick they own.

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

So you’d pass on 3 unprotected and 3 protected and our own top-5 pick this year because you held out for an extra unprotected 1st?

For the Knicks

 

[Engorged On Unborn Gore]

Yawn.


View: https://youtu.be/GXbk3OL-t-s

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Curious why you keep thinking Sept. 6 is going to make a difference. I think it was easier to see with Beverley still on the Jazz, but do you have a specific (or fuzzy) scenario in mind that Beasley or Vanderbilt (or Bolmaro, for that matter) unlock?

There will be more moves… I think everyone agrees there. Once everyone is eligible to be traded we can do the rest of our business… you kinda need to show the rest of your cards. Could be a lakers deal or some other move. I just think it turns up the urgency.

Vando signed with Klutch recently… Beasley has been mentioned with the Lakers… windy mentioned him today. I have some theories in the Lakers… maybe it’s not fully agreed to but I really think a Westbrook deal goes down. Nothing is currently preventing the Indiana deal from happening… it might be the preference and maybe lakers are hoping to do it with 1 pick or add some protections. They tell Indy they have a couple weeks to do a deal or they have another deal that opens up and they will take it.

I know everyone assumes we can rank with Don and the other moves don’t change things… but each move shows a few more cards. That date would also allow all parties to have close to final rosters a couple weeks before camp…

Might be wrong but I think it’s an important date.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I'm beginning to see quite a bit of upside in that Dallas pick. I think they struggle a bit in the regular season.

I think it’s lotto protected… or at least top 10.

 

[FrenchJazzFa]

Nothing to worry about. Sep 6th is the first date and training camp on Sep 23 is the second. Things will move soon and we'll see. I'm not excited to wait probably because European Championship start next week and i'm gonna cheer for Rudy and french team.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

It's obvious the Jazz are using Tony to get the message out there that "they don't have to trade Donovan" and "they're comfortable keeping him and re-tooling around him" to try and put pressure on the Knicks to up their offer. It's all just posturing...they have no intention of actually re-tooling the roster around Donovan to try and be competitive, they're fully planning on a re-build.

Jake Fisher and Mike Scotto did a pod. They said the only name the Jazz have kicked around to improve the roster is sexton… they said if they actually did think that was a possibility they would have heard about them asking on someone and they haven’t heard anything. He was pretty clear that if it was happening he’d know about it.


This is why I would have been calling on vets like Theis and doing so loudly. Make some noise about Poeltl inquiries and such.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Jake Fisher and Mike Scotto did a pod. They said the only name the Jazz have kicked around to improve the roster is sexton… they said if they actually did think that was a possibility they would have heard about them asking on someone and they haven’t heard anything. He was pretty clear that if it was happening he’d know about it.


This is why I would have been calling on vets like Theis and doing so loudly. Make some noise about Poeltl inquiries and such.

Jazz should make some more down payments to Spurs and Pacers