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Jazz Offseason Plan

LoPo said:
Good. There is actually zero reason whatsoever that Royce should be traded. None. At under $10 million, we need more of guys like him not less.

I feel the same way about Ingles, but I understand he's an expiring, maybe retiring next year, and we need to maximize every asset possible. Still don't want to trade him.
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Yes, the Royce news was also good news. I mostly hate that the Favs contract ended up being so toxic that we likely have to attach a freaking first round pick to move him.

Moving forward, can future offseasons not just be using assets to undo the last offseason? Dennis has had some hits that have covered up all the filler and downright bad tracks on the rest of the album.
 
LoPo said:
The casuals? Cmon man. Who are you? Jerry Reinsdorf?

Memphis has 2 foundational pieces on rookie contracts (Morant and JJJr), Brooks on a bargain deal, and a few others on good deals. They had cap space and the ability to create that much more. Instead of using that cap space to grab another 5-8 year building block, they used it to pay Adams more than good fit JV and declining Bledsoe just to move up 7 spots in a draft.

If I was Memphis, I would have used that space this summer to sign a badass. They could have gone after John Collins, Dinwiddie, Gary Trent Jr, Powell. Or they could have traded for a known commodity instead of hoping for draft perfection.

Memphis had this summer and next to add a massive piece. I think they screwed the pooch.

Sent from my SM-A516U using JazzFanz mobile app
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Yeah casuals…

I’m seeing guys saying I like JV better than Bledsoe and Adams and my god… look at that cap space… that could be anything?!?! Those folks are evaluating this like checkers… Nice move!!!!

This is chess and only those detailed enough to see the landscape and what that next move will be are going to get this right. I’m not even talking about who Memphis drafts… the things the casuals are missing:

-this move means NO is giving up on Ball and Hart for the right to give Kyle Lowry 3/75M -90M or worse… to be leveraged by Lowry to get where he really wants to go and then to replace Ball with Dinwiddie… some great work there!

-JV is on an expiring deal and wants a long term extension. Memphis decided they didn’t want to pay him and would instead sell high and hold on to that long term flexibility.

-why didn’t Memphis want to use cap space? Because they already have a ton of good useable nba players and Memphis is not a FA destination. So Dinwiddie or Powell are going to take their money to come off the bench? Is either guy a meaningful upgrade over Melton, Bane, Allen? They likely are an upgrade but a meaningful upgrade worth the extra 20M a year over multiple years? They have almost too
Many good players already and need to consolidate.

-Memphis wants JJJ to be their center long term… adams is a stop gap. They also have Tillman who needs some time there… Brandon Clarke plays small ball center as well. JV missed 10 games this year… they went 6-4. They didn’t want him to grumble about no extension all year and then walk at the end of the year.

-Memphis has another deal lined up for Bledsoe. When they flip him for Buddy Hield or Kyle Kuzma (bled is repped by Klutch) please claim that you only look at one deal at a time and that no one could have seen this coming… or you can claim that Kuzma sucks too. Again you can play checkers like a casual or evaluate the whole board.

-Collins???? GTFOH. He is restricted. Hawks have no reason to let him walk… your best way to get a talent like that is to trade for him at mid season… you know what might help you trade for him… what if you had expiring contracts and first round picks? That might be something that would help… right?

This deal sets them up to get that blue chip talent to put next to Morant… they already have plenty of supporting talent.

I know I know CmoNs mANe BLeDsowS SUx… just wait for the next moves… and the next moves absolutely factor into this move… unless you are a casual with regard to trades and the cap.
 
Griffin is the same dude who hired SVG and gave Adams an extension and gave up assets to trade him before the extension kicked in and found a way to keep Bledsoe instead of Hill (expiring) while doing it. This is the guy you are trusting with your cap space. When they sign Lowry and end up making the 8 seed for this shortcut I hope that playoff series goes more than 5 games.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Yeah casuals…

I’m seeing guys saying I like JV better than Bledsoe and Adams and my god… look at that cap space… that could be anything?!?! Those folks are evaluating this like checkers… Nice move!!!!

This is chess and only those detailed enough to see the landscape and what that next move will be are going to get this right. I’m not even talking about who Memphis drafts… the things the casuals are missing:

-this move means NO is giving up on Ball and Hart for the right to give Kyle Lowry 3/75M -90M or worse… to be leveraged by Lowry to get where he really wants to go and then to replace Ball with Dinwiddie… some great work there!

-JV is on an expiring deal and wants a long term extension. Memphis decided they didn’t want to pay him and would instead sell high and hold on to that long term flexibility.

-why didn’t Memphis want to use cap space? Because they already have a ton of good useable nba players and Memphis is not a FA destination. So Dinwiddie or Powell are going to take their money to come off the bench? Is either guy a meaningful upgrade over Melton, Bane, Allen? They likely are an upgrade but a meaningful upgrade worth the extra 20M a year over multiple years? They have almost too
Many good players already and need to consolidate.

-Memphis wants JJJ to be their center long term… adams is a stop gap. They also have Tillman who needs some time there… Brandon Clarke plays small ball center as well. JV missed 10 games this year… they went 6-4. They didn’t want him to grumble about no extension all year and then walk at the end of the year.

-Memphis has another deal lined up for Bledsoe. When they flip him for Buddy Hield or Kyle Kuzma (bled is repped by Klutch) please claim that you only look at one deal at a time and that no one could have seen this coming… or you can claim that Kuzma sucks too. Again you can play checkers like a casual or evaluate the whole board.

-Collins???? GTFOH. He is restricted. Hawks have no reason to let him walk… your best way to get a talent like that is to trade for him at mid season… you know what might help you trade for him… what if you had expiring contracts and first round picks? That might be something that would help… right?

This deal sets them up to get that blue chip talent to put next to Morant… they already have plenty of supporting talent.

I know I know CmoNs mANe BLeDsowS SUx… just wait for the next moves… and the next moves absolutely factor into this move… unless you are a casual with regard to trades and the cap.
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That whole explanation was to tell us that Memphis has enough talent already and that #10 is going to be a going to be a blue chip talent. I just don't buy it. Taking Bledsoe when he doesn't really fit, especially as you said they have enough role playing emerging talent, was dumb.

If JJJr is their center long term, why replace their current starting C with a more expensive, longer contract, worse stop gap option? Do you realize they have to pay to extend JJJr next year? Why not just trade JV at the deadline for an asset and ride with JJJr?

Memphis has to hit at least a triple if not a home run on this #10 pick to rationalize the deal. I don't care what New Orleans does. It has to make sense for Memphis first and I just don't see that.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Yeah casuals…

I’m seeing guys saying I like JV better than Bledsoe and Adams and my god… look at that cap space… that could be anything?!?! Those folks are evaluating this like checkers… Nice move!!!!

This is chess and only those detailed enough to see the landscape and what that next move will be are going to get this right. I’m not even talking about who Memphis drafts… the things the casuals are missing:

-this move means NO is giving up on Ball and Hart for the right to give Kyle Lowry 3/75M -90M or worse… to be leveraged by Lowry to get where he really wants to go and then to replace Ball with Dinwiddie… some great work there!

-JV is on an expiring deal and wants a long term extension. Memphis decided they didn’t want to pay him and would instead sell high and hold on to that long term flexibility.

-why didn’t Memphis want to use cap space? Because they already have a ton of good useable nba players and Memphis is not a FA destination. So Dinwiddie or Powell are going to take their money to come off the bench? Is either guy a meaningful upgrade over Melton, Bane, Allen? They likely are an upgrade but a meaningful upgrade worth the extra 20M a year over multiple years? They have almost too
Many good players already and need to consolidate.

-Memphis wants JJJ to be their center long term… adams is a stop gap. They also have Tillman who needs some time there… Brandon Clarke plays small ball center as well. JV missed 10 games this year… they went 6-4. They didn’t want him to grumble about no extension all year and then walk at the end of the year.

-Memphis has another deal lined up for Bledsoe. When they flip him for Buddy Hield or Kyle Kuzma (bled is repped by Klutch) please claim that you only look at one deal at a time and that no one could have seen this coming… or you can claim that Kuzma sucks too. Again you can play checkers like a casual or evaluate the whole board.

-Collins???? GTFOH. He is restricted. Hawks have no reason to let him walk… your best way to get a talent like that is to trade for him at mid season… you know what might help you trade for him… what if you had expiring contracts and first round picks? That might be something that would help… right?

This deal sets them up to get that blue chip talent to put next to Morant… they already have plenty of supporting talent.

I know I know CmoNs mANe BLeDsowS SUx… just wait for the next moves… and the next moves absolutely factor into this move… unless you are a casual with regard to trades and the cap.
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LoPo loves getting pwned
 
LoPo said:
That whole explanation was to tell us that Memphis has enough talent already and that #10 is going to be a going to be a blue chip talent. I just don't buy it. Taking Bledsoe when he doesn't really fit, especially as you said they have enough role playing emerging talent, was dumb.

If JJJr is their center long term, why replace their current starting C with a more expensive, longer contract, worse stop gap option? Do you realize they have to pay to extend JJJr next year? Why not just trade JV at the deadline for an asset and ride with JJJr?

Memphis has to hit at least a triple if not a home run on this #10 pick to rationalize the deal. I don't care what New Orleans does. It has to make sense for Memphis first and I just don't see that.
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You either didn’t read or didn’t understand… go ahead and place your faith in Griffin… he’s killing it and Memphis is doing a terrible job. I’m done explaining it to you.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Griffin is the same dude who hired SVG and gave Adams an extension and gave up assets to trade him before the extension kicked in and found a way to keep Bledsoe instead of Hill (expiring) while doing it. This is the guy you are trusting with your cap space. When they sign Lowry and end up making the 8 seed for this shortcut I hope that playoff series goes more than 5 games.
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New Orleans has a lot more options after yesterday than they did before. They have the assets to pursue Lowry. Or Beal. Or Lillard. Or keep Lonzo and Hart with the intention of trading them later and doing something next summer.

So many options now that they aren't paying Adams and Bledsoe $38 million this year and at least $21 next year.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I didn’t mention that Memphis draft record is ****ing pristine as well…
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Yeah, my favorite was Wade Baldwin at 17

Or Jarrell Martin at 25 the year before that.

Or JOrdan Adams the year before that.

It's only been recent and anyone can have a hot streak. Most of their picks have been obvious grabs for their big wins. Yet to do anything nearly as impressive as DL (who you will relentlessly bash).
 
FAILED STATE said:
LoPo loves getting pwned
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I'm right sometimes and I'm wrong sometimes.

Memphis took on bad contracts and ill-fitted players to move up 7 spots in the draft.

New Orleans slid back 7 spots to open up a number of options this summer.

I agree with @Handlogten's Heros that it's too early to truly grade this trade for either team, but as of right now, New Orleans has a ton more options than Memphis will have the next two summers. As a Jazz fan, we are frustrated right now because we don't have many if any options. Flexibility is the name of the game.
 
Also, could be a win for both teams. Doesnt have to be one team having an obvious win/lose thing.

But at the end of teh day I find it pretty hard to believe anyone would rather be in the position Memphis is in compared to the one NOLA is in.
 
LoPo said:
New Orleans has a lot more options after yesterday than they did before. They have the assets to pursue Lowry. Or Beal. Or Lillard. Or keep Lonzo and Hart with the intention of trading them later and doing something next summer.

So many options now that they aren't paying Adams and Bledsoe $38 million this year and at least $21 next year.
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Yup giving up premium draft capital is going to set them up for a Beal or Lillard deal. Keep throwing **** against the wall… maybe something sticks.
 
LoPo said:
I'm right sometimes and I'm wrong sometimes.

Memphis took on bad contracts and ill-fitted players to move up 7 spots in the draft.

New Orleans slid back 7 spots to open up a number of options this summer.

I agree with @Handlogten's Heros that it's too early to truly grade this trade for either team, but as of right now, New Orleans has a ton more options than Memphis will have the next two summers. As a Jazz fan, we are frustrated right now because we don't have many if any options. Flexibility is the name of the game.
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We are just flat out ignoring the additional first they got and marginalizing the jump from 17 to 10… they basically got two good firsts for their maneuver.
 
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