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Lockout!!!

This article explains some of the specific sticking points.

https://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/22748484/33239434

NBA Lockout: The league's 'last, best offer'
Posted on: November 11, 2011 12:18 pm
Edited on: November 11, 2011 12:24 pm

By Matt Moore

David Stern denied that the offer presented to the players on Thursday night was the league's "last, best offer" to Howard Beck of the New York Times. Beck attempted to follow up, because, well, if the players reject the offer and the league follows through with its threat to revert back to the so-called "cap reset" offer (47 percent BRI, a flex-cap, dragons, a dungeon, no cupcakes, etc.), they're not taking it, as Beck said, but Stern again dodged it. That was the point of this approach. The league's not threatening to cut off talks (they can't for fear of a lack-of-good-faith-barganing charge). This puts the onus on the players. "We're not giving you the worst offer, we're giving you a better offer than the worst offer. So you should take it, otherwise we'll only offer the worst offer." And they try and pass this off as benevolent.

But the reality is that this is their last, best offer. The players can't accept 47 percent with a flex-cap, not without a court fight. They'll take that deal when the battle is truly lost, as opposed to mostly lost, which it is now. Consider that the players are surrendering $3 billion in their position which was extremely close to what the owners have proposed in the last week, but it's the systemic changes that continue to hamper the odds of a deal. The players have given so much, and the league wants just a little more. And at some point it's either surrender or fight. Talking is over. Deal or no deal.

Decertification sounds great when pitched by an agent, I'm sure, but the realities are pretty dark for that course of action. It only really works as a leveraging tactic, considering that with the appeals process and the likely drag from the courts in proceedings as they would want this to be settled outside of their courtrooms and would encourage the parties to do just that, it would take years to complete. But if your options are that or lay down to be stepped on, a lot of players, especially stars with money in the bank, will opt for just that.

And so, like I said, this is the league's last, best offer. Or maybe its "last, not-nearly-as-sucky-as-what-comes-n
ext" offer. So what exactly does it entail and where do we go from here? Here's the rundown of where the sticking points of a deal stand Friday morning according to reports.

BRI
Everything in the proposal is based on a 50/50 revenue split which the players have finally conceded to if they feel the systemic changes are swallowable (indications are that they don't, but we'll get to that). It winds up costing the players close to $3 billion over the length of the deal compared to the prior deal which gave them 57 percent. That's a heck of a give-back, and yet still not enough for the owners.


Mid-Level Exception

Ken Berger of CBSSports.com reports that the owners have "agreed to increase the mid-level exception for luxury tax-paying teams to three-year deals starting at $3 million. The exception, which was for two years starting at $2.5 million under the previous proposal, would be available every other year for teams above the tax threshold." But there's a catch.

(T)he league's proposal would restrict teams from using a full mid-level exception -- four-year deals starting at $5 million -- if the signing itself pushed the team over the tax. Union negotiators want the mid-level restriction to kick in only if the team already is above the tax line before it uses the exception. The league's version is the one that is in the current proposal, according to a person who has seen it.

via Stern offers 72-game season, few alternatives - CBSSports.com.

So they've settled how much the MLE will be, but not whether you have to be over the tax already to be barred from using the full version, or if you would be barred from using it if using it would put you into the tax. If this sounds like an obnoxiously small detail, it is, but it also affects a great deal of teams and in particular serves as a disincentive from teams spending more to win, which obviously the players don't want for multiple reasons.

Super-Tax and Repeater tax


The luxury tax is being revamped as the "super-tax," in order to serve as a spending deterrent, either for restriction of player movement, cost reduction, or competitive balance purposes, depending on what side you're on. The previous structure was a simple dollar-for-dollar tax. So if you were $5 million over the luxury tax threshold, you paid $5 million in luxury tax.

The league's latest offer proposes an increase of .50 cents on the dollar for the first $5 million over, then increasing penalties. Here's the breakdown, courtesy of Berger:

First $5 million in salary spent over luxury tax threshold: $1.50 tax on every dollar.
Second $5 million: $1.75 on every dollar.
Third $5 million: $2.50 on every dollar.
Fourth $5 million and above: $3.25 on every dollar.

It's not know at this time if the union has accepted this rate, though it's clear they're not happy with that idea (or any of these, really).

Then there's what's being called the "recidivist tax" or "repeater tax." The idea is that if a team spends above the luxury tax threshold in three out of a five-year span, it needs to be taxed additionally. The league has proposed the following structure:

First $5 million in salary spent over luxury tax threshold (including standard tax listed above): $2.50
Second $5 million: $2.75
Third $5 million: $3.50
Fourth $5 million: $4.25

That's an incredibly steep tax for repeat offenders. To put this in perspective, Storyteller's Contracts shares this information: in the past ten years, the Knicks, Lakers, Mavericks, Celtics, Cavaliers, Suns, and Pacers all paid the tax in at least three consecutive years. Due to no tax being collected in 2005, another five teams (the Timberwolves, the Blazers, the Nets, the Sixers and the Raptors) would have narrowly ducked it. That's a huge percentage of teams this would have impacted, and the corresponding impact on spending would have been significant.

That's why the union wants the following structure:

First $5 million: $2.00
Second $5 million: $2.00
Third $5 million: $3.50
Fourth $5 million: $3.50

That's a huge gap, considering in the last "stanchion" (as David Aldridge of NBATV described it Thursday night) would make for over a $9 million differential if the team spent all the way to $20 million over the tax threshold (the Lakers, for example, were $30 million over the threshold last season and would have been in the repeater tax. Close to $10 million from one team on just one level. That's a lot of dough.

So clearly this remains a big dividing point.

Sign-and-Trade

Berger reports that the league may have softened on the limitations on teams in the tax using the sign-and-trade, but there is still some sort of structure in the current offer that deals with it. For the players, this was a big issue, and it's surprising the league didn't just concede on this considering it has been used just three times in the past decade by teams in the tax. But then, the league isn't conceding something. What else is new?

ESPN.com reports that the owners have relented on the issue and that teams in the tax will be able to sign-and-trade players. That had to have been a concession for the big-market owners as well as playrs.

Player contract length

This issue has been agreed upon. Previous limits were five years without Bird rights and six years with. The new proposal which the players have agreed to is four years for non-Bird and five years with Bird. So it's a minor win for the players that they only lost a year, really.

Escrow

Via SI.com, the league wants the escrow pushed to 10 percent, where it was five years ago, up from 8 percent last year and the last few prior years. The players want an 8-10 percent band.

Salary floor

The salary floor under the previous deal was set at 75 percent. The owners have agreed to raise it to 85 percent, according to multiple reports.

Length of CBA deal

The league has granted a concession to the players to allow them to opt-out of the proposed deal after the sixth year, which is notable for its coincidance with the end of the NBA television deals.

Etc.

The amnesty clause, "stretch" exception," and length of time a team can match an offer in restricted free agency for a player have all been agreed to.

There's more to discuss, including Bird rights, age limit, etc. Some are huge issues, some are small. But the reality is that while the two sides appear very close together, in reality, the players consider themselves very far apart. Reports flooded in Thursday night and Friday morning about upset agents and players, livid with the deal, saying nothing was granted of substance. If that proves to be the mood of the entire union, it's unlikely a vote will even see the light of day, much less an acceptance of the deal. That means decertification, that means lawsuits, and that means the loss of the entire 2011-2012 season.

There's no more room to give, and it would appear the gap is still too wide.
 
Wow, those taxes could be huge for us in that they may deter some of the larger market teams from going above the LT, at least consistently, and I would guess, make it harder for teams to sign 2-3 studs because they would swallow up such a huge amount of the cap that it would be almost inevitable for said team to go over the LT year to year.
 
Wow, those taxes could be huge for us in that they may deter some of the larger market teams from going above the LT, at least consistently, and I would guess, make it harder for teams to sign 2-3 studs because they would swallow up such a huge amount of the cap that it would be almost inevitable for said team to go over the LT year to year.
That luxury looks excessively restrictive. If the owners wanted to concede on something, it seems that they could concede on that. I think that $1.50 on the first five million over the cap and $2.00 on anything above $5 milion is already plenty a deterrent.

In either case, I would anticipate that teams--even the wealthy ones--will be far more reluctant to pay more than a few million.

And as has been said elsewhere, it might backfire on the small teams--limiting the LT to the uber wealthy teams in the league relative to the dollar-for-dollar days where at least the smaller market teams could think about entering the luxury-tax zone.
 
https://arizona.sbnation.com/phoenix-suns/2011/11/11/2554181/nba-lockout-2011-cba

NBA Lockout: It's Time For Players To Sign

by Seth Pollack • Nov 11, 2011 8:58 AM MST

The NBA lockout has been a roller coaster for fans and certainly the players as well. Most, like Phoenix Suns Channing Frye, have been sitting on the sidelines waiting for a deal to emerge from hundreds of hours of negotiations between the union and owners.

Even though the slightly revised deal that came out of the latest (and possibly last) negotiating session might not be everything they want, the point has come to for the players to sign and get back on the court.

Let me be clear, the owners are responsible for this lockout.

They started the process two-years ago with a laughable proposal so far away from reality that it wasted valuable time getting to this point.

They pleaded poverty using losses inflated by accounting tricks, didn't share enough revenue between teams and repeatedly made bad business decisions.

That's their problem and shouldn't be solved on the backs of the players.

The players are the talent. They are the product. No one pays to see Robert Sarver play basketball. NBA players are the 450 best individuals in the world at what they do and it's their talent that generates the revenue to begin with.

They deserve to be WELL paid.

But here we are with an agreement to split the revenue pie 50/50 and an apparent disagreement over two fundamental issues: How big of slice each of the 450 players get and how much control players have over where they will play.

On both issues, the hard-line players and their agents pushing for the nuclear option (decertifcation of the union) are wrong.


Losers and winners under new system

Under the proposed new system the combination of increased penalties and restricted access to free agents via the mid-level exception for luxury tax paying teams have the effect of driving down the market value for SOME free agents. (The details about the revised deal can be found here.)

Consider the case of Channing Frye last summer. Frye was a free agent and clearly had value in the market. The Suns wanted to pay him $16m but other teams were able to offer him the MLE which drove up his contract value to $30m over five years.

Under the new rules a veteran mid-tier free agent like Frye would be able to get the MLE from non-luxury tax paying teams and it would be max out at about $15m for three years. Frye didn't take the MLE because he stayed in Phoenix but the MLE market clearly drove up his contract value and netted him an additional two-years of guaranteed money.

It's pretty obvious why a guy like Frye would prefer the old system. It's also pretty obvious from a fan perspective why having a shorter contract length on mid-tier players is beneficial. Max contract guys like Gilbert Arenas are often the poster boys for bad contracts but there are FAR more under-performing deals for these types of players.

(Btw, I'm not saying Frye is a bad contract, just using him as an example.)

But here's the thing -- just because Frye isn't getting that money doesn't mean it goes away. The owners will still be spending 50% of BRI on players.

The effect of shorter and smaller deals on mid-tier guys is more money available for lower tier-players. We would see a leveling out of the salary distribution within the band of players who are off their rookie deals but not in the "star" category.

That's not a bad thing.

Freedom (of movement) isn't free

The other point the players make is about freedom of movement. The restrictions on lux-tax paying teams shrinks the free agent market to some degree (how much, we don't know but 11 teams paid luxury tax last season under the older rules with a lower tax).

The means that it would be harder for teams like the Lakers, Mavericks, Heat or Knicks to keep adding free agents each season. The league rightly calls this a competitive balance issue. If all the best free agents are continuously going to the top teams it becomes very difficult for the rest of the league to improve.

Some argue that super teams and dynasties are good for the sport. I disagree. While it generates more national hype, it dramatically reduces fan interest in local markets. No one wants to see their team mired in mediocrity for decades which has been exactly the case in many places.

The proposed new rules help prevent that.

The final point the players make is about their freedom to decide where they want to live and work. This is certainly something we can all appreciate. But as someone who spent eight years in the Army getting sent where ever Uncle Sam wanted me I have no sympathy. You can be damned sure I didn't choose to live in El Paso, TX for two years and spend six months of that time in a tent in Bosnia.

NBA players are well paid and deservedly so. If they have to spend seven months of the year in Minnesota or Milwaukee instead of Miami or Los Angeles, that's too bad. Many people make difficult decisions about moving their families to places they don't want to go. Very few of them have the resources NBA players have to make the situation as comfortable as possible.

You are not going to find any sympathy for the players on this one. If the hardship of having to play in one market over another is too difficult, feel free to go play in Europe, China or perhaps Iraq.

Player-friendly provisions

The deal also has player-friendly provisions like the amnesty clause and more importantly, the "stretch" provision that allows teams to waive players and spread out their cap hit over an extended period of time. The player still gets paid and gets to sign somewhere else and essentially be double-paid and a new roster slot is created.

This will free up more opportunities for player movement as well.

Time to sign

So here we are. The players have a deal on the table that they clearly don't love. They've been forced into giving back at least $300 million per year in salary and they don't like the new rules. It's not ideal but it is certainly not worth blowing up the season and perhaps ending up with a lesser deal in the end.

It's time to suck it up, agree to the deal and play basketball.
 
That luxury looks excessively restrictive. If the owners wanted to concede on something, it seems that they could concede on that. I think that $1.50 on the first five million over the cap and $2.00 on anything above $5 milion is already plenty a deterrent.

In either case, I would anticipate that teams--even the wealthy ones--will be far more reluctant to pay more than a few million.

And as has been said elsewhere, it might backfire on the small teams--limiting the LT to the uber wealthy teams in the league relative to the dollar-for-dollar days where at least the smaller market teams could think about entering the luxury-tax zone.

Just make it a hard cap.
 
That is certainly a step towards a hard cap. As long as NBA contracts are still largely guaranteed this will make bad management an even bigger suicide pill to teams.
 
Heck I'd be fine if they lowered the hit for first year offenders but increased it for the repeaters (since players will never except a hard cap).
 
I would think just like the owners assume the financial risk (BRI argument) the GM's still need to assume a lot of the risk of signing bad contracts. Even though I still like the idea of non or partially guaranteed contracts but with stipulations and limits but that is a whole other can of worms on that.
 
That is certainly a step towards a hard cap. As long as NBA contracts are still largely guaranteed this will make bad management an even bigger suicide pill to teams.

with a hard cap they wouldnt be full guarantees...it would be impossible. i think the new cba, while it doesnt ban guaranteed contracts, also doesnt require them.

also @ricbucher says
New proposal would allow teams to send players to NBDL first 5 years of career and reduce pay to pro-rated 75K. Talk about non-starters.


if thats true...its a poison pill.

Also, free agency agency is an american value. Restricting it, and player choice, the way this deal essentially does is really unamerican.

i dont think the players should give on the BRI, but they've dropped all they way down to 50-50 - far lower than baseball, football and hockey. If the owners still want to make these punitive changes just because they're butt-hurt that lebron left cleveland for a warmer weather small market team thats too bad, and the players shouldnt let them get away with it.
 
I don't care about the revenue split. I want a system that limits the player's power to create their own dream teams. Hard cap, non-guaranteed contracts, franchise tag, etc. I'm a hardliner so part of me kinda wants the players to get their panties in a bunch and push to play the decertification card. I'm perfectly happy having more time to focus on NCAA ball. BUT rather than the players go thru with decertifying I want them to eventually be humbled and realize they can't win and that even the hardliner's offer is a better than nothing.

the ncaa is completely dominated by player-created dream teams, but nobody gets mad because they dont get paid.
 
Go ahead and give 'em back some of the BRI. But keep the restrictions on free agency. They get to play in the NBA. That is something to be grateful for - even if you're in Minnesota or Utah.
 
the ncaa is completely dominated by player-created dream teams, but nobody gets mad because they dont get paid.

NCAA is where I look for potential studs for the Jazz to draft. I don't have a team I root for (except Jazz) so I don't care about NCAA being fair or not.
 
Go ahead and give 'em back some of the BRI. But keep the restrictions on free agency. They get to play in the NBA. That is something to be grateful for - even if you're in Minnesota or Utah.
Yep been saying the same thing for awhile now and that's what made me realize the owners are only using the "system" for PR and are really only interested in $$$$
 
with a hard cap they wouldnt be full guarantees...it would be impossible. i think the new cba, while it doesnt ban guaranteed contracts, also doesnt require them.

also @ricbucher says
New proposal would allow teams to send players to NBDL first 5 years of career and reduce pay to pro-rated 75K. Talk about non-starters.


if thats true...its a poison pill.

Also, free agency agency is an american value. Restricting it, and player choice, the way this deal essentially does is really unamerican.

i dont think the players should give on the BRI, but they've dropped all they way down to 50-50 - far lower than baseball, football and hockey. If the owners still want to make these punitive changes just because they're butt-hurt that lebron left cleveland for a warmer weather small market team thats too bad, and the players shouldnt let them get away with it.

Those really sound like your personal values. Don't push them on the rest of us by pretending that your view is the "American" way.
 
Also, free agency agency is an american value. Restricting it, and player choice, the way this deal essentially does is really unamerican.

They still have all the freedom in the world to quit the NBA and take up another profession. Just like I have signed a contract not to work for a competitor they can't just pack up and go play for another team. They are free however to go get another job.
 
Yep been saying the same thing for awhile now and that's what made me realize the owners are only using the "system" for PR and are really only interested in $$$$

I fear you are correct. System won't really be fixed but the players will make less / owners will make more = fans lose. This sucks hard cap.
 
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