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Maul Pimpslap is killin it.

jimmy eat jazz said:
Actually, I'd say that was Memo. But I see what you're saying.
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You mean possibly the least able rim-protector the Jazz have ever regularly played at C and who played very poorly for big stretches of almost any given season, and whose pointless extension forced the Jazz to make some bad cost-saving decisions? And the guy who despite all that, seems to get nothing but love?

I disagree.
 
Core4 said:
I think most of us really loved the Millsap of 5-6 years ago, when he was still fighting for every loose ball.
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You mean when he wasn't very good at basketball? This is what drives me nuts about fans (or at least fanz); when a guy is given a serious load to carry and does it very well (Millsap for the last 3+ seasons), it will never be as impressive as some unidimensional hustle-player (what Millsap was).
 
NUMBERICA said:
You mean when he wasn't very good at basketball? This is what drives me nuts about fans (or at least fanz); when a guy is given a serious load to carry and does it very well (Millsap for the last 3+ seasons), it will never be as impressive as some unidimensional hustle-player (what Millsap was).
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Fans dig flashy, and winning. When we don't get one, we applaud the other. When we get both it is orgasmic. When we don't get either, we rag on the coach and best player at the time as being inadequate. Fickle fans.
 
Is there a more dynamic offensive big in the league than Millsap (unless you include LeBron/Melo...)?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zfj7A0tYBRs
 
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NUMBERICA said:
You mean possibly the least able rim-protector the Jazz have ever regularly played at C and who played very poorly for big stretches of almost any given season, and whose pointless extension forced the Jazz to make some bad cost-saving decisions? And the guy who despite all that, seems to get nothing but love?

I disagree.
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No, I mean the skilled big man who came through in the clutch time and time again and was one of the team's big play maker for years, who knew and played his role within the team offensive scheme very well, who one year was among the league leaders in double doubles and almost single handedly carried an otherwise bad team that year to respectability, who played, or tried to play, gamely through injuries, including coming back too soon from an Achilles tear which ended up curtailing his career, who was a great teammate and citizen, and who did not (despite claims otherwise) disappear for big stretches of season but, in tandem with other players, formed the nucleus of a very competitive 50+ win team over several years. Yep, that guy.

As opposed to, say, an undersized power forward with notable defensive liabilities against larger players, who inevitably faded during the course of a full year, who got schooled consistently during playoffs losses by bigger and more skilled big men, and who spent his last year on the team petulantly pouting about his role, and who could do no more when he was the one of the marquee players than lead the team to the 8th seed one year and outside the playoffs the next year?
 
jimmy eat jazz said:
No, I mean the skilled big man who came through in the clutch time and time again and was one of the team's big play maker for years, who knew and played his role within the team offensive scheme very well, who one year was among the league leaders in double doubles and almost single handedly carried an otherwise bad team that year to respectability, who played, or tried to play, gamely through injuries, including coming back too soon from an Achilles tear which ended up curtailing his career, who was a great teammate and citizen, and who did not (despite claims otherwise) disappear for big stretches of season but, in tandem with other players, formed the nucleus of a very competitive 50+ win team over several years. Yep, that guy.

As opposed to, say, an undersized power forward with notable defensive liabilities against larger players, who inevitably faded during the course of a full year, who got schooled consistently during playoffs losses by bigger and more skilled big men, and who spent his last year on the team petulantly pouting about his role, and who could do no more when he was the one of the marquee players than lead the team to the 8th seed one year and outside the playoffs the next year?
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Memo was consistently garbage in the playoffs AND was a worse team and individual defender than Millsap. He was also universally loved.

You're proving numb's point.
 
Jazz fanz love heroes that aren't very good but are luke-warm on actually good basketball players. How did so many people get on board with tanking to get real talent that might not scrap like Luke Harangody or give a great interview like Fesenko?
 
GVC said:
Memo was consistently garbage in the playoffs AND was a worse team and individual defender than Millsap. He was also universally loved.

You're proving numb's point.
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Memo had his weaknesses and so did Milsap. I don't think he was Bill Russell, but I liked him and enjoyed watching him and was sorry to see him go (though understood and supported it). I actually liked Millsap--a lot and was sorry to see him go (though understood and supported it).

In truth, I don't know if Memo was more under appreciated than Milsap, he may be or may not be, I don't care. It was just a stupid throw away line, so let's stop this before it crosses from banter to argument, as it appears to be on the verge of doing.

Actually, you got me curious, so I went and looked up Memo's playoff stats. Yep, not too great, if not quite garbage. Oh well.

Playoff Stats
Click on column header to sort
Year Team Lg G Min Pts PPG FGM FGA FGP FTM FTA FTP 3PM 3PA 3PP ORB DRB TRB RPG AST APG STL BLK TO
2002-03 DET NBA 17 323 94 5.5 35 80 .438 17 32 .531 7 13 .538 24 46 70 4.1 13 0.8 12 12 14
2003-04 DET NBA 22 252 82 3.7 31 66 .470 18 26 .692 2 5 .400 16 45 61 2.8 8 0.4 5 9 15
2006-07 UTA NBA 17 585 200 11.8 71 183 .388 33 42 .786 25 79 .316 37 95 132 7.8 30 1.8 24 16 24
2007-08 UTA NBA 12 462 185 15.4 66 156 .423 34 44 .773 19 51 .373 34 107 141 11.8 23 1.9 8 8 19
2008-09 UTA NBA 2 43 8 4.0 2 12 .167 3 4 .750 1 3 .333 2 8 10 5.0 4 2.0 0 1 2
2009-10 UTA NBA 1 11 7 7.0 2 2 1.000 2 2 1.000 1 1 1.000 1 1 2 2.0 0 0.0 0 0 1
Totals 70 1665 569 8.1 205 497 .412 105 148 .709 54 151 .358 113 301 414 5.9 78 1.1 49 46 74
 
jimmy eat jazz said:
Memo had his weaknesses and so did Milsap. I don't think he was Bill Russell, but I liked him and enjoyed watching him and was sorry to see him go (though understood and supported it). I actually liked Millsap--a lot and was sorry to see him go (though understood and supported it).

In truth, I don't know if Memo was more under appreciated than Milsap, he may be or may not be, I don't care. It was just a stupid throw away line, so let's stop this before it crosses from banter to argument, as it appears to be on the verge of doing.

Actually, you got me curious, so I went and looked up Memo's playoff stats. Yep, not too great, if not quite garbage. Oh well.

Playoff Stats
Click on column header to sort
Year Team Lg G Min Pts PPG FGM FGA FGP FTM FTA FTP 3PM 3PA 3PP ORB DRB TRB RPG AST APG STL BLK TO
2002-03 DET NBA 17 323 94 5.5 35 80 .438 17 32 .531 7 13 .538 24 46 70 4.1 13 0.8 12 12 14
2003-04 DET NBA 22 252 82 3.7 31 66 .470 18 26 .692 2 5 .400 16 45 61 2.8 8 0.4 5 9 15
2006-07 UTA NBA 17 585 200 11.8 71 183 .388 33 42 .786 25 79 .316 37 95 132 7.8 30 1.8 24 16 24
2007-08 UTA NBA 12 462 185 15.4 66 156 .423 34 44 .773 19 51 .373 34 107 141 11.8 23 1.9 8 8 19
2008-09 UTA NBA 2 43 8 4.0 2 12 .167 3 4 .750 1 3 .333 2 8 10 5.0 4 2.0 0 1 2
2009-10 UTA NBA 1 11 7 7.0 2 2 1.000 2 2 1.000 1 1 1.000 1 1 2 2.0 0 0.0 0 0 1
Totals 70 1665 569 8.1 205 497 .412 105 148 .709 54 151 .358 113 301 414 5.9 78 1.1 49 46 74
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No worries. FWIW, I loved Memo, and also understand why the Jazz cut Millsap loose.
 
Memo > Mansap (tiny margin tho)
I hate to disagree with GVC and Numberica, for they are knowledgeable bball fans (so this means I may be wrong)
 
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GVC said:
Memo was consistently garbage in the playoffs AND was a worse team and individual defender than Millsap. He was also universally loved.

You're proving numb's point.
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Memo was basically the reason we won a series against Houston with Yao Ming. I think saying that he was consistently garbage in the playoffs is a little dishonest. Did he suck more in the playoffs than he normally did? Yes. But there were some times in the playoffs that he killed it.
 
GVC said:
Yikes. Disagree.
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https://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/basketball/nba/2007-04-29-rockets-jazz-game4_N.htm I think this is the series that I was remembering. Okur played surprisingly good defense on Yao Ming in that series (I know, Okur, defense?) Anyway, he basically shut down Yao for a few games, and before that, it looked like we were going to lose the series. The following year in the playoffs, he averaged 15.4 points, and 11.8 rebounds in 12 games, so he was not always garbage in the playoffs.
 
NUMBERICA said:
You mean when he wasn't very good at basketball? This is what drives me nuts about fans (or at least fanz); when a guy is given a serious load to carry and does it very well (Millsap for the last 3+ seasons), it will never be as impressive as some unidimensional hustle-player (what Millsap was).
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Yes, like his third season when he averaged almost 14/9 off the bench. Or when he had all those double-doubles as Boozer's injury replacement. Maybe I stretched it a year too far, although he was a joy to watch as he developed. Seemed like he went after every loose ball and rebound. Last season was painful. Not all of that is his fault. And maybe my disillusionment with Millsap is misdirected after the Portland contract fiasco, when his agents told the Jazz Paul didn't want them to match the offer.

Of course, Paul is such a dominant player, Atlanta decided to bench him in favor of Ayon.
 
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