On the 47% who don't pay taxes

[babe]

He said he thinks he should pay more taxes, and that he currently pays a lower rate than his secretary. Period. He's not weaseling out of anything. The only people trying to weasel out of it are the ones saying "he didn't specifically say dividend taxes."

But he doesn't need to get the law changed, or get our permission, to pay more. He wouldn't be the first to donate something to our government or nation if he just sat down and wrote out a check he thought would be his greater responsibility.

Talk like this is poker chitchat. Count the cards and do your own thinking.

 

[SaltyDawg]

But he doesn't need to get the law changed, or get our permission, to pay more. He wouldn't be the first to donate something to our government or nation if he just sat down and wrote out a check he thought would be his greater responsibility.

Talk like this is poker chitchat. Count the cards and do your own thinking.

We don't know that he didn't do just that. The only facts we have are that he and now Bill Gates both think the wealthiest in the nation should be required to pay more.

 

[TroutBum]

But he doesn't need to get the law changed, or get our permission, to pay more. He wouldn't be the first to donate something to our government or nation if he just sat down and wrote out a check he thought would be his greater responsibility.

Talk like this is poker chitchat. Count the cards and do your own thinking.

I don't buy this.

If the Mormon Church didn't "require" a 10% tithe, how many people do you think would pay 10%? I'd put the number pretty much at zero. If there were no speed limit, how many people do you really think would go 65 on the freeway, or 25 in residentials? People, in general, need guidance -- or rather, want guidance. Not everyone, but I'd say most do. Lead someone, tell someone, enforce something, and you will get results. Do nothing and then expect people to do what you want, or what you think they need, will result in two things: Jack and Squat.


*edit* after reading this post, it sure sounds like I think I know what is best for everyone else. I don't even know what is best for me, so disregard that notion, and realize that I'm full of ****. <3.

 

[babe]

Yeah, I see Trout's point. I want the government to REQUIRE others to drive safely. And I drive so I don't have to look out for cops, and re-direct that energy to avoiding dangerous situations.

Bill Gates and Warren Buffet are wannabe "Right People": New Money trying to gain actual acceptance by the elites. I think they might be sincere, and trying to assert some new leadership style that maybe is a lot better than more established elites.

We might see how this all turns out when their kids, who might not remember being ordinary people, take over.

 

[SaltyDawg]

Yeah, I see Trout's point. I want the government to REQUIRE others to drive safely. And I drive so I don't have to look out for cops, and re-direct that energy to avoiding dangerous situations.

Bill Gates and Warren Buffet are wannabe "Right People": New Money trying to gain actual acceptance by the elites. I think they might be sincere, and trying to assert some new leadership style that maybe is a lot better than more established elites.

We might see how this all turns out when their kids, who might not remember being ordinary people, take over.

Yeah then their kids can call everyone who isn't rich lazy.

I value the opinions (on this subject) of the self made millionaires much more than the ones who inherited their money.

Bill Gates >>>>>>>> Mitt Romney or Donald Trump.

 

[LogGrad98]

Yeah then their kids can call everyone who isn't rich lazy.

I value the opinions (on this subject) of the self made millionaires much more than the ones who inherited their money.

Bill Gates >>>>>>>> Mitt Romney or Donald Trump.

Romney didn't inherit his money. What inheritance he did get was used to fund an endowment at BYU and that came in 1995 when Romney was already a multi-millionaire from his own business endeavors.

 

[SaltyDawg]

Romney didn't inherit his money. What inheritance he did get was used to fund an endowment at BYU and that came in 1995 when Romney was already a multi-millionaire from his own business endeavors.

He grew up rich. Whether he used his inheritance or gave it away, he was still born with a silver spoon in his mouth.

It's a lot easier to make millions when you've had millions your entire life.

 

[franklin]

Yeah then their kids can call everyone who isn't rich lazy.

I value the opinions (on this subject) of the self made millionaires much more than the ones who inherited their money.

Bill Gates >>>>>>>> Mitt Romney or Donald Trump.

Weren't you the horseshoe crab claiming nobody hates your mancrush Buffett?
Guess what stonehenge, Butfest was a son of congress.

With Ivy League connections.
Those hooked him up with Benjamin Graham.

I bet you're in love with Kenned too.
I make it rhyme for Spazz. A haiku?

 

[LogGrad98]

He grew up rich. Whether he used his inheritance or gave it away, he was still born with a silver spoon in his mouth.

It's a lot easier to make millions when you've had millions your entire life.

Does it make it easier to graduate summa *** laude with a dual degree in business and law from Harvard?

There are plenty of people who grow up with far more money than Romney did who do nothing with it at all.

 

[LogGrad98]

Oh, and just fyi, Gates grew up with every bit the silver spoon Romney did.

 

[One Brow]

My only concern is that they follow the US Constitution when making decisions. Not their ideology, heart or some letter written by a former president to a colleague.

I think both the most liberal and most conservative judges believe they are following the Constitution.

 

[Hantlers]

I'm pretty sure it's implied that is what he is talking about if that is the tax he is paying. He said he pays a lower tax rate than his secretary and he didn't think that was fair. He didn't have to break it down into what each tax is labeled.

Bill Gates said the same thing too.

Except for the fact that Buffet has flat out said the income tax rate should be raised but then goes ahead and never says anything about dividends. Obviously he's not a dumb man, but you're falling for his tricks.

 

[SaltyDawg]

Does it make it easier to graduate summa *** laude with a dual degree in business and law from Harvard?

Of course it does. Do you think the guy working nights to pay for his tuition, books, food, rent, clothes, etc, has as much of a chance to graduate summa *** laude as the rich kid who paid cash for his college and his parents also made huge donations?

There are plenty of people who grow up with far more money than Romney did who do nothing with it at all.

No doubt. That doesn't mean they didn't have an easier path. They just squandered their opportunity.

Oh, and just fyi, Gates grew up with every bit the silver spoon Romney did.

And Gates actually makes products. He innovated and got rich by making innovative products. Romney does not. There is a big difference there. One of them actually created a whole industry and used his innovation to get rich (hiring 10's of thousands of people along the way). He then agreed that it would be better for the country if rich people like himself were required to pay more taxes.

The other guy made his money by destroying other businesses. Among his tactics were buying a business, investing all of its money in Bain Stock, and then filing for bankruptcy- laying everyone (or at least a lot of them) off in the process. He then hid a lot of money in Swiss banks and the Cayman Islands and said rich people like himself should pay even less in taxes.

 

[SaltyDawg]

Except for the fact that Buffet has flat out said the income tax rate should be raised but then goes ahead and never says anything about dividends. Obviously he's not a dumb man, but you're falling for his tricks.

He's not trying to "trick" anyone. He said he felt the taxes should be raised. Period. If he wasn't also talking about the dividends most rich people make their money from, then he would have said as much.

 

[One Brow]

But he doesn't need to get the law changed, or get our permission, to pay more. He wouldn't be the first to donate something to our government or nation if he just sat down and wrote out a check he thought would be his greater responsibility.

Buffet is only worth about 4 billion. His check-writing won't even dent our deficit. There needs to be policy change if we are goingt o reduce the deficit.

 

[One Brow]

We might see how this all turns out when their kids, who might not remember being ordinary people, take over.

I don't know about Gates, but Buffet has said his kids won't inherit anything. It's all going to charity.

 

[One Brow]

Oh, and just fyi, Gates grew up with every bit the silver spoon Romney did.

Romney's parents were worth about $10 million, were they not? My understanding was that Gates my have been upper-middle-class, but not in that league.

 

[franklin]

Of course it does. Do you think the guy working nights to pay for his tuition, books, food, rent, clothes, etc, has as much of a chance to graduate summa *** laude as the rich kid who paid cash for his college and his parents also made huge donations?

Your logic says America should give all her wealth to poor China to make things nice and fair. Of course parents try to leave their posterity better off, just as you expect the previous generation to leave you. You probably hate American-Jews for their disproportionate sucess too.
They are by-and-large the entitled class, and you are making the exact same argument Hitler supporters made.

And Gates actually makes products. He innovated and got rich by making innovative products. Romney does not. There is a big difference there.

Right, and labor is worthless too because they don't innovate, huh.

The other guy made his money by destroying other businesses. Among his tactics were buying a business, investing all of its money in Bain Stock, and then filing for bankruptcy- laying everyone (or at least a lot of them) off in the process.

Debunked, but go on with your tirade.

He then hid a lot of money in Swiss banks and the Cayman Islands and said rich people like himself should pay even less in taxes.

You want a president to be an idiot who doesn't take advantage of what is given to him?

 

[LogGrad98]

Of course it does. Do you think the guy working nights to pay for his tuition, books, food, rent, clothes, etc, has as much of a chance to graduate summa *** laude as the rich kid who paid cash for his college and his parents also made huge donations?

No doubt. That doesn't mean they didn't have an easier path. They just squandered their opportunity.

And Gates actually makes products. He innovated and got rich by making innovative products. Romney does not. There is a big difference there. One of them actually created a whole industry and used his innovation to get rich (hiring 10's of thousands of people along the way). He then agreed that it would be better for the country if rich people like himself were required to pay more taxes.

The other guy made his money by destroying other businesses. Among his tactics were buying a business, investing all of its money in Bain Stock, and then filing for bankruptcy- laying everyone (or at least a lot of them) off in the process. He then hid a lot of money in Swiss banks and the Cayman Islands and said rich people like himself should pay even less in taxes.

You have completely strayed from your original argument, which was that Gates was better than Romney because Gates did not inherit his entire wealth and Romney did. I am glad you recognized that argument was fatally flawed, so you built up a couple straw men to argue against. Fine.

One point I would contend is that it makes it easy to graduate summa *** laude from Harvard. I do not care how much money you have, to get through an institution like that with grades that high and abilities that strong requires an incredibly high level of intelligence and hard work. You make it sound like all Forrest Gump needed was the millions to get into Harvard and he too would have been a summa *** laude graduate of business and law.

Also, Romney finished his education. Gates dropped out. Which one do you think is the more reliable path to success? Gates success is as much a product of luck and guile as it is his own ingenuity and hard work. Right place, right time, right money.

But, as you never do, do not let anything like facts and logic get in your way. Continue to rail against the evils of Romney's unearned millions and the holy status of St. Gates. Gates and his illegal business practices that stifled competition and killed many medium and small businesses did at least as much damage to other people as Romney's job ever did.

 

[LogGrad98]

What is funny is that Salty will think I am arguing that I love Romney and hate Gates, which is absolutely not true. I think both of them are very similar people and I am really pretty neutral. I was simply pointing out the flawed logic that somehow Gates is better than Romney, or that it unequivocally makes Romney a bad guy that he didn't immediately jump on the "tax me more" bandwagon that Gates did.