Report: Gordon Hayward, Utah Jazz discussing contract extension

[Jazz Spazz]

I don't know how the Jazz can determine contract value for either Hayward or Favors.

I don't think extensions happens unless the Jazz know they are getting a killer deal. Without extensions on the books, I believe the Jazz will have more cap-space next offseason than this one (provided that the cap number for Hayward and Favors are their qualifying offers).

THis.



Great point. It's 200% of the rookie scale for Favors (above average salary) -- $12mm. 250% for Hayward (below average salary) -- $8.63mm.

I don't think Favors is worth Ibaka money, and $9mm is around Hayward's value, so cap holds are moot IMO.

While I understand the reasoning here, I completely disagree with it. With Hayward and Favors getting the "keys to the car" so to speak, they are in for a huge jump in minutes and numbers. In the very least they will both get enormous offers from Portland, that we will have to match to keep them. If we lock them up now we will end up getting them for cheaper than waiting to match a restricted offer. Waiting to match a restricted offer is basically telling those two key players that the Jazz organization does not believe in them which will not only open the door for them to leave... it might even get them wanting to leave and go somewhere they are wanted. Not extending them now would pay off if they got some sort of serious injury, but you just can't plan for that. We're not talking Kirilenko money here.... but we might get closer to those numbers if we have to match offers.

I'm going on the record. I want both Hayward and Favors extended before the season starts.

If we let them enter free agency, is there honestly a chance we'd end up paying them less than we would right now?

I'm with spycam on this, extend them both now.

 

[ema]

JazzSpazz!!!

 

[franklin]

Why? Favors will score just as much (quite possibly more), block just as many shots, and rebound more than Ibaka. And that's when we're simply talking about how good Favors is right now. I'd bet a large amount of money that Favors will be better than Ibaka by the 14-15 season.

I'm not getting into that discussion on Jazzfanz. Anything less than comparing Favors to God and this place turns into the dungeon on Hostel.

But I will leave you with this nice picture. Favors' shot chart is so embarrassing that NBA won't put him on their advanced stats list. That's why he won't get Ibaka money.

 

[UGLI baby]

i'm not getting into that discussion on jazzfanz. Anything less than comparing favors to god and this place turns into the dungeon on hostel.

But i will leave you with this nice picture. Favors' shot chart is so embarrassing that nba won't put him on their advanced stats list. That's why he won't get ibaka money.

1minute/img][/quote]


biff

 

[Sexual Favors]

Extend them both, it will be a lot cheaper now.

 

[Jeffrey32]

The contract that Millsap just ended with the Jazz would be a fair deal for Hayward, minus the balloon upfront payment.

 

[Ferguson_Mellochill]

Extend them both, it will be a lot cheaper now.

I agree with this. Both Favors and Hayward are legit candidates for Team USA, and their stature is only going to go up. Hayward is a versatile 6'8" swingman who plays defense, makes passes, gets to the rim and shoots 3s among the top 10 in the league. It's worth putting an offer on the table to show commitment, if nothing else, and a deal in the $8 mil. range would be fair for Hayward. Favors is a bit of a wildcard, but he's already regarded as a significant defensive player. It's safe to predict he'll get offered more than Asik did, probably $10 mil range.

....Okay, I just saw Larry Sanders' extension for 4 yrs @ $44 mil.

 

[NUMBERICA]

While I understand the reasoning here, I completely disagree with it. With Hayward and Favors getting the "keys to the car" so to speak, they are in for a huge jump in minutes and numbers. In the very least they will both get enormous offers from Portland, that we will have to match to keep them.

I understand your point, but Portland won't be able to offer anything outrageous unless they completely dump quite a bit of salary (which is possible I guess).

The other possibility is that we find out that Favors isn't Jesus and Hayward hasn't improved and the Jazz pay on potential as well. As well as injury which is always there. There's also the possibility of a depressing RFA market because of how punitive the new tax ramifications are.

I'm not saying extending them is absolutely the wrong answer, but the idea that it's absolutely the right option is just as silly.

 

[LogGrad98]

I understand your point, but Portland won't be able to offer anything outrageous unless they completely dump quite a bit of salary (which is possible I guess).

The other possibility is that we find out that Favors isn't Jesus and Hayward hasn't improved and the Jazz pay on potential as well. As well as injury which is always there. There's also the possibility of a depressing RFA market because of how punitive the new tax ramifications are.

I'm not saying extending them is absolutely the wrong answer, but the idea that it's absolutely the right option is just as silly.

The point is someone will make the offers, be it Portland or whoever, and there is a real risk it will drive their price up over what it would be if we could extend them now. If we extend them now, it is unlikely we will vastly overpay, maybe overpay some, but likely not drastically, while if we wait until next season it becomes a much bigger risk. I would prefer the safer route of extending them now rather than potentially getting Mo'ed or Wes'ed again.

 

[spycam1]

If only we had actually played these guys so we could KNOW how much they're currently worth...

 

[NUMBERICA]

The point is someone will make the offers, be it Portland or whoever, and there is a real risk it will drive their price up over what it would be if we could extend them now. If we extend them now, it is unlikely we will vastly overpay, maybe overpay some, but likely not drastically, while if we wait until next season it becomes a much bigger risk. I would prefer the safer route of extending them now rather than potentially getting Mo'ed or Wes'ed again.

My point is that that is not necessarily safer. If they are not as good as everyone hopes or thinks they will be but the Jazz are paying for that then that is bad. Don't think for a second that Favors is oblivious to this being his year to get his money either and deciding to take $8 mil/year just because he knows he hasn't proven much yet.

I don't think this is as simple as everyone seems to be making this out to be or it would be done already.

Just like with everything else in life, everything is subject to everything.

 

[Sexual Favors]

If only we had actually played these guys so we could KNOW how much they're currently worth...

Yes, but then we wouldn't have the opportunity to underpay them via the "what have you done?" argument. If we sign these guys now and they blow up next season, the F/O is going to look like a bunch of geniuses. If Fav and Hay stay the same, at least we know they are decent players. Their agents will argue potential, and we'll argue history. Just so long as the contracts are inked somewhere in the middle, we'll be fine. Better than waiting until after a season of inflated stats. The injury argument doesn't hold weight for me, because Favors and Hayward could get injured 14-15 after their worth has been inflated, just the same. You have to pick your pieces at some point, or else you end up being a perennial bottom dweller.

 

[NUMBERICA]

Why does everyone assume that Favors or Hayward will take less now than they think they will be worth in free agency?

 

[LogGrad98]

Why does everyone assume that Favors or Hayward will take less now than they think they will be worth in free agency?

I think you are jumping to conclusions about us jumping to conclusions. It is about risk. Imo, and in the o of others, there is less risk signing them to an extension than waiting until next off-season. They are a known quantity right now and if we can extend them at a reasonable price for that quantity right now, that poses a lesser risk than waiting to see what they do this next season and finding out what the market will bear. Yes, it can go both ways, we get that, but I think the risk is greater if we wait than if we get them to sign extensions now.

 

[Sexual Favors]

Why does everyone assume that Favors or Hayward will take less now than they think they will be worth in free agency?

Because potential isn't present. They know that they could get injured next year and have their value decrease, additionally, both have said they like it here in Utah and want to stay. Favors recently bough a house, and Hayward recently said he is extremely happy here. I'm not saying it is certain a deal gets done this year, I just hope it does.

 

[The Midnight]

I think you are jumping to conclusions about us jumping to conclusions. It is about risk. Imo, and in the o of others, there is less risk signing them to an extension than waiting until next off-season. They are a known quantity right now and if we can extend them at a reasonable price for that quantity right now, that poses a lesser risk than waiting to see what they do this next season and finding out what the market will bear. Yes, it can go both ways, we get that, but I think the risk is greater if we wait than if we get them to sign extensions now.

This.

Because potential isn't present. They know that they could get injured next year and have their value decrease, additionally, both have said they like it here in Utah and want to stay. Favors recently bough a house, and Hayward recently said he is extremely happy here. I'm not saying it is certain a deal gets done this year, I just hope it does.

And this.

 

[orangello]

I'm not getting into that discussion on Jazzfanz. Anything less than comparing Favors to God and this place turns into the dungeon on Hostel.

But I will leave you with this nice picture. Favors' shot chart is so embarrassing that NBA won't put him on their advanced stats list. That's why he won't get Ibaka money.

This. I love Favors but Ibaka is the superior player right now without question.

 

[orangello]

If only we had actually played these guys so we could KNOW how much they're currently worth...

Yup

 

[orangello]

This.



And this.

This.

 

[Jazz Spazz]

My point is that that is not necessarily safer. If they are not as good as everyone hopes or thinks they will be but the Jazz are paying for that then that is bad. Don't think for a second that Favors is oblivious to this being his year to get his money either and deciding to take $8 mil/year just because he knows he hasn't proven much yet.

I don't think this is as simple as everyone seems to be making this out to be or it would be done already.

Just like with everything else in life, everything is subject to everything.

Why does everyone assume that Favors or Hayward will take less now than they think they will be worth in free agency?

Long story short, I think Hayward and Favors will be worth more after this year.

Short story long-vvv

Either way is a risk, in my opinion there is more benefit to signing them now if things work out the way I think things are more likely to turn out given the minutes and improvement I think are likely for those two. Is it a given, absolutely not. We have seen improvement out of Hayward every year so far and I have no reason to think it will not continue this year with more opportunities. With Favors I am less sure of what we he will do, but at the same time his ceiling may be higher so I personally like the idea of taking that risk. If he explodes next year and increases his "stock" dramatically an extension will save us some cash to put into other good players. Yes, I understand there is still risk that he will crap out and stay about the same, I just don't see that happening with him being a starter and getting every opportunity to show what he's got.

I really think not pursuing an extension sends a negative message to both of those players, and as the team wants them both to be the team leaders this year, we need to send them every positive message we can. If you think one or both will suck next year, that's a different story altogether, but I don't think that's the case.

I think you are jumping to conclusions about us jumping to conclusions. It is about risk. Imo, and in the o of others, there is less risk signing them to an extension than waiting until next off-season. They are a known quantity right now and if we can extend them at a reasonable price for that quantity right now, that poses a lesser risk than waiting to see what they do this next season and finding out what the market will bear. Yes, it can go both ways, we get that, but I think the risk is greater if we wait than if we get them to sign extensions now.

Because potential isn't present. They know that they could get injured next year and have their value decrease, additionally, both have said they like it here in Utah and want to stay. Favors recently bough a house, and Hayward recently said he is extremely happy here. I'm not saying it is certain a deal gets done this year, I just hope it does.

-both good posts imho