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Rumor: Jazz prepared to match 'any offer' for Hayward.

[size/HUGE] fixed [/size];859374 said:
Due diligence. Saying this helps drive down the interest other teams have.
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This. They need to say this. If for no other reason than to scare away potential bidders.
 
A max offer of any type would suck to match because it goes up and the cap is likely to increase by a lot over the next few years. Anything short of the max we match. We can always move him later to get our flexibility back. We could work out a sign and trade and likely get good assets back because we really hold all the cards here... If a team wants him they'll have to give us something good so that we don't match.
 
GVC said:
Oof.

1. 25% of the cap (less, actually) for players with 0-6 years of service time is the "full max".

2. 30% of the cap (again, slightly less than this) is only the max for players with 7-9 years of service time (or certain players coming off rookie-scale contracts) who made less than 1/1.05 X 30% of the cap prior to receiving their max contract.

3. For players with 10+ years of service, the max is at least 35% of the cap (once again, it's slightly less than this). It could be more if 30% of the cap is less than 1.05X what the player made in the previous season.

"Full max" is as misleading as "mini max".
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I think mini max and full max were the terms owners used when negotiating the new cba. At any rate, the original question was comparing the max deal that Hayward would get to what kirilenko got, as some posters seem to not understand that Hayward is only eligible for a contract that caps out under 25% of the current salary cap, while kirilenko a was far bigger and did a lot more to tie the organizations hands than a 4 year max contract for Hayward would.

Personally I think Hayward gets near or at the 4 year max contract. Whether he is actually worth it is not entirely relevant though, because as you mentioned int this thread, the jazz have invested a ton in him, and are not likely to get a better free agent this summer, or at least not one who is as young and still has potential to goes with the team.
 
b_line said:
Hayward is only eligible for a contract that caps out under 25% of the current salary cap, while kirilenko a was far bigger
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Kirilenko was also only eligible for a contract that started at (just under) 25% of the cap.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
A max offer of any type would suck to match because it goes up and the cap is likely to increase by a lot over the next few years.
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Max raises are 7.5% and 4.5% of the first year salary for own and other team free agents, respectively, regardless of what happens to the cap over time.
 
GVC said:
Kirilenko was also only eligible for a contract that started at (just under) 25% of the cap.
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Don't know specifics, was the cap higher back then? I remember ak's contract ending at like 18.25 mil or something, and I thought Hayward's would end at like 15 mil if he got the max?
 
Genessy already tweeted out what the deals would look like: https://twitter.com/DJJazzyJody/status/483392641451978752/photo/1

Basically: Utah Max is 5 years starting at 14.8 and running to 19.2; Other team's Max is 14.8 running to 16.9. No idea how accurate, but I'm sure it's pretty close.

I refuse to believe DL would match either of those offers. At that point, you reclaim as much value in an S&T a you can get and cut your losses.

Edit: Obviously he wouldn't offer the Utah Max so that's off the table. He'd only have to match another team's MAX sheet, which is only 4 years, but I still refuse to believe he would do it.
 
b_line said:
Don't know specifics, was the cap higher back then? I remember ak's contract ending at like 18.25 mil or something, and I thought Hayward's would end at like 15 mil if he got the max?
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Kirilenko's extension was signed under the 1999 CBA (just before the 2005 CBA). As such, his extension added 6 years onto his rookie deal, and he was eligible for raises of 12.5% of the first year salary.

Under the 2005 CBA, extensions (and other contracts) were shortened by a year, and max raises for own team free agents were reduced to 10.5% of the first year salary.

Under the 2011 CBA, extensions (and other contracts) have been shortened by another year, and max raises for own team free agents is 7.5% of the first year salary.


So Kirilenko's contract was troublesome because it was 6 years long and contained yearly increases equal to 12.5% of the first year salary, which was less than $11mm.
 
GVC said:
Oof.

1. 25% of the cap (less, actually) for players with 0-6 years of service time is the "full max".

2. 30% of the cap (again, slightly less than this) is only the max for players with 7-9 years of service time (or certain players coming off rookie-scale contracts) who made less than 1/1.05 X 30% of the cap prior to receiving their max contract.

3. For players with 10+ years of service, the max is at least 35% of the cap (once again, it's slightly less than this). It could be more if 30% of the cap is less than 1.05X what the player made in the previous season.

"Full max" is as misleading as "mini max".
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How about this......
Hayward cant get as big of a contract as lebron, kobe, or d-wade could get
 
billyshelby said:
Genessy already tweeted out what the deals would look like: https://twitter.com/DJJazzyJody/status/483392641451978752/photo/1

Basically: Utah Max is 5 years starting at 14.8 and running to 19.2; Other team's Max is 14.8 running to 16.9. No idea how accurate, but I'm sure it's pretty close.

I refuse to believe DL would match either of those offers. At that point, you reclaim as much value in an S&T a you can get and cut your losses.

Edit: Obviously he wouldn't offer the Utah Max so that's off the table. He'd only have to match another team's MAX sheet, which is only 4 years, but I still refuse to believe he would do it.
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First year salary looks about right, and the 4.5% raises on the other team offer looks right. There seems to be a small error in the Contract the Jazz can offer Gordo and in totals.


Cap: $63.2mm
First year salary = 25% of cap X 42.14 / 44.74 = $14,881,806
Own team annual raise = 7.5% of first year salary = $1,116,135.45
Other team annual raise = 4.5% of first year salary = $669,681.27


Own Team 0-6 Max Contract
$14,881,806
$15,997,941.45
$17,114,076.90
$18,230,212.35
$19,346,347.80

Total: $85,570,384.50 (average salary = $17,114,076.90)


Other Team 0-6 Max Contract
$14,881,806
$15,551,487.27
$16,221,168.54
$16,890,849.81

Total: $63,545,311.61 (average salary = $15,886,327.90 1/2)
 
The Jazz gave hayward every chance to be a superstar and he doesn't have it. At best he's the third best player on a championship squad. You don't pay those players 13+ million. I've always thought 11 million a year for four years was fair. 12 is pushing it, but I could see the Jazz matching an offer of 12 million.
 
I have always thought he would get about what favors got. So yeah, around 12 per year. Max scares me.
 
Sign him to a deal that makes him tradeable, that's all I ask. Don't want to be stuck with a toxic contract that we can't get rid of.
 
gregbroncs said:
This. They need to say this. If for no other reason than to scare away potential bidders.
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It might scare away potential bidders. Or it might just make people make a rather large offer.

A very different tactic might be just as effective: leak to the press that the Jazz won't match anything over $10 mill/year. And then when a team offers $10.5 mill, bam! Match!
 
By the way, that's why I doubt any such rumor actually originated from the Jazz. There's really nothing to be gained either way. It's not like other teams will really make their offers based on a rumor like this. Or at least not if they have any intelligence.
 
However this breaks, Lindsey and Zanick are going to earn their money, and possibly derail their careers with this move.
 
oldtimer said:
The Jazz gave hayward every chance to be a superstar and he doesn't have it. At best he's the third best player on a championship squad. You don't pay those players 13+ million. I've always thought 11 million a year for four years was fair. 12 is pushing it, but I could see the Jazz matching an offer of 12 million.
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You want to bet on that? I don't, really, but I'd bet Hayward gets the upper end of the 12.5 split.
 
Jazz say this whether or not they intend to actually match. They hope it scares off other teams so they can sign Hayward to a less than max deal. Might be true, might just be a bluff.
 
What would be an acceptable haul for Hayward in a sign and trade. I think we could get two 2015 1sts out of phx. They own LAs next year and their own. Is that good enough?
 
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