So much for hayward extension. Paul George got max deal

[Deleted member 848]

Are you clicking the "offense - plays" tab?

I can't find eFG%, and Dalamon's numbers are different than what I"m getting for iso (.76 ppp, rank 1200.

If Paul George wants to become an elite NBA player, an MVP candidate, he has to get better on the offensive side of the ball. He has to be able to take defenders one on one and score consistently. George ranked 69th in the NBA (minimum 100 plays) in isolation play types with a points per possession of .719, per Synergy Sports. His shooting suffered when isolated as his effective field goal percentage was 37.9 percent, his worst of any play type.

All of the elite offensive perimeter players in the NBA ranked in the top 20 in isolations. From forwards LeBron James and Kevin Durant to point guards Kyrie Irving and Tony Parker, they all posted points per possession over .90 on isolations. Even rookie Damian Lillard and aging Kobe Bryant were in the top 20.

George is regarded as an up and coming superstar, a true two way player that has shown the potential to be one of the next studs of the NBA. His defense is already at an all NBA level. Although he isn't perfect on defense. It is his offense that keeps him from reaching the top tier of NBA players. He hasn't shown the ability to take his man one on one and score consistently.

His first problem was turnovers. George turned the ball over on 14.6 percent of his isolations. Nobody in the top 20 turned it over that frequently. Although Durant had a turnover percentage of 12.4. What allowed Durant to overcome his turnovers was getting to the free throw line. Durant got to the line on 22.7 percent of his isolations.

George only got to the line 6.5 percent of the time, the third lowest percentage of players who had 100 isolations. Getting free throws is an instant upgrade to efficiency, and can help get the opponents’ key players into foul trouble. Getting LeBron James to foul out can be quite helpful.

https://www.indycornrows.com/2013/8...rges-isolation-game-hinder-the-Indiana-pacers

CBS sports later cited this article, and talked about Paul George's lack of iso-capabilities even further-- hence, I trusted their statistics as fairly accurate: https://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-o...should-paul-george-develop-his-isolation-game

 

[Jeffrey32]

The big difference is that at this stage on the open market, if Paul George went to RFA next season, he would have got a max deal offer from someone, including the Lakers. I don't think Hayward would get that same offer on the RFA market.

Also, George led his team deep into the playoffs last season, going pound for pound with the best player in the league and was an All Star. Hayward didn't even get into the playoffs. I really like Hayward and am glad that the Jazz drafted him. I think now that he has the reins he will prove that he is a borderline all star, but based on opportunity (and coaching), Hayward has not accomplished what George has thus far.

 

[Magic Spray]

As Jazz fans we desparately held on to the DWill is better than CP3 argument, and for a season we almost had an argument. I'm afraid to say Hayward hasn't brought enough to the table for us to make a legit argument.

So true. And today, all of us would say that CP3 is the superior player. Without reservation.

 

[Magic Spray]

The big difference is that at this stage on the open market, if Paul George went to RFA next season, he would have got a max deal offer from someone, including the Lakers. I don't think Hayward would get that same offer on the RFA market.

So much this. Am I wrong in thinking that it's not so much what GTime is "worth", but what he can command in the market. Would any other team max him out? I personally can only think of the Celtics as being a team that would have the cash + motivation (e.g. his old college coach) to pay Hayward more than the Jazz would be willing to match.

For the record, I love Hayward on the Jazz and think he makes a lot of sense. But Favors and Kanter are the two guys I think about maxing first, then Hayward. But Hayward deserves some big time scrilla for what he brings to Utah.

 

[Hotdog]

So true. And today, all of us would say that CP3 is the superior player. Without reservation.

Not me. I would stay take a healthy Dwill over CP3. Deron Williams was bad *** before all his injuries.

 

[framer]

Obviously, if a young player has a big playoff series against a tough opponent the right thing to do is to Max them. I mean they have proved all they need to on the big stage, right?
What could possibly go wrong?

 

[NUMBERICA]

Would any other team max him out?

Based on what he's done to date? Absolutely not. Based on what Paul George did last season, you can almost guarantee someone would've.

 

[Zulu]

Why Detlef SChrempf?

First name that popped into my head!!!

 

[Zulu]

Not me. I would stay take a healthy Dwill over CP3. Deron Williams was bad *** before all his injuries.

This CP3 has done nothing!!!

 

[GVC]

Are you clicking the "offense - plays" tab?

I was just curious if he had a link to a site where you could sort the stats, since that would more or less be required (without inputting the complete data set by oneself) to look at players with 100+ isos. I have a bunch of the team data in a spreadhseet, so I can calculate some team summary statistics and other fun stuff (albeit not terribly scientifically at this point). I have to make some corrections to the data (some may have been inputted during the playoffs, and mysynergysports adds the playoff stats to the regular season stats, so I might have to manually delete the stats from some games to correct the data), and maybe add a few more stats (I was mostly interested in shot type distribution by team and averages/standard deviations in PPP by shot type by team). If these stats were made available in a sortable format, the legwork could be avoided (I'm lazy, and won't make any money or friends from collecting the data). If individual stats were sortable, and included team PPP by initiated play type (that is, for example, with overall PPP for PnR ball handlers and PnR roll men, including team PPP when the offense is initiated through a pick and roll...this applies to isos and postups as well), even more fun could be had.

 

[franklin]

I didn't mean it to come across as a "hey dumbass are you trying this simple click" response. You and O_B (when motivated) are by far the go to stats gurus here and I wouldn't expect you to be so lax. I was just a little confused by Dalamon's slightly off numbers and the lack of eFG% for the free subscription.

Speaking of, I've been meaning to ask if the paid subscription is worth it with all the video breakdown. I've been waiting months for the paid subscription deadline to come. I think it's dumb that they have a hard date on renewals instead of a yearly premium starting the time you sign up.

 

[GVC]

I didn't mean it to come across as a "hey dumbass are you trying this simple click" response. You and O_B (when motivated) are by far the go to stats gurus here and I wouldn't expect you to be so lax. I was just a little confused by Dalamon's slightly off numbers and the lack of eFG% for the free subscription.

Speaking of, I've been meaning to ask if the paid subscription is worth it with all the video breakdown. I've been waiting months for the paid subscription deadline to come. I think it's dumb that they have a hard date on renewals instead of a yearly premium starting the time you sign up.

The format/data is the same, although you get access to the data from the last 3 seasons. You can basically watch any game from the last 3 seasons as well (although IIRC there are small pauses between plays). I used the video a bit to watch some Kawhi Leonard isos/postups/spot-ups. It isn't exactly what I thought it would be, but it's probably worth $45 to me.

 

[Jazz4ever]

So much this. Am I wrong in thinking that it's not so much what GTime is "worth", but what he can command in the market. Would any other team max him out? I personally can only think of the Celtics as being a team that would have the cash + motivation (e.g. his old college coach) to pay Hayward more than the Jazz would be willing to match.

For the record, I love Hayward on the Jazz and think he makes a lot of sense. But Favors and Kanter are the two guys I think about maxing first, then Hayward. But Hayward deserves some big time scrilla for what he brings to Utah.

Outside the old coach nostalgia it doesn't make a lot of sense for the Celtics right now. They just lost Pierce and Garnett, their first and second scoring options. Going into next year, their leading scoring option is Jeff Green at 12.8ppg, yikes. They can probably get 15ppg out of him before his efficiency falls off a cliff. They are also setting up to be the worst defensive front court in the NBA with Sullinger and Olynyk. Maxing Hayward along with Rondo's required max (coming in 2015) would really handicap them in addressing their bigger needs. Obviously the 2014 draft can change things for them.

 

[Picasso]

Been a long time reader.. I have always kept hope that what all y'all said was truthful. Deep inside my heart I knew PG would be the better of the two. But is safe to say we messed up again, Paul is looking like a top 10 player while Gordon looks to be a solid one.. Just revising this tread as many here weren't giving PG his props, Kid is worth every penny and he's looking like a effing super star. Wow, Why are we so snake bitten? We better land Parker here in Utah.. Our Mormon savior lol..