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The Night Of

Also, that shootout scene with naked Gyp is ****ing Epic.
 
Siro said:
Also, that shootout scene with naked Gyp is ****ing Epic.
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My favorite scene was in the first episode where we really see him for the first time. In the basement, with the other gangsters, he just lays into each of them. "You smug **** midget, creepin' around like a dentist with the ether."
 
My buddy and I have been bouncing ideas/theories on who did and I feel very confident in what happened.


Spoilers.


Petey did it via Omar from The Wire. She owed money, probably a lot so Omar sent him to collect. He did but things got out of hand and he killed her.

Once Naz was arrested and incarcerated and Omar found out why and put two and two together, he has been subtly manipulating him ever since. Totally playing him. He is the "subtle beast" as the last episode was entitled.
 
Cunning Linguist said:
My buddy and I have been bouncing ideas/theories on who did and I feel very confident in what happened.


Spoilers.


Petey did it via Omar from The Wire. She owed money, probably a lot so Omar sent him to collect. He did but things got out of hand and he killed her.

Once Naz was arrested and incarcerated and Omar found out why and put two and two together, he has been subtly manipulating him ever since. Totally playing him. He is the "subtle beast" as the last episode was entitled.
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I think the step-father hired Dwayne to kill her.
 
I'm really dissapointed in this show though. It started out with promise, but has really turned to meh. The prison scenes are all super cliche and the trial scenes dont have enough detail. In the end you have a mix between Law and Order and a prison show.

Oh, and that stupid kiss between Nas and his lawyer? WTF was that? Cheapened the entire series for me.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
I'm really dissapointed in this show though. It started out with promise, but has really turned to meh. The prison scenes are all super cliche and the trial scenes dont have enough detail. In the end you have a mix between Law and Order and a prison show.

Oh, and that stupid kiss between Nas and his lawyer? WTF was that? Cheapened the entire series for me.
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I absolutely love the show and while I tend to agree with you, it hasn't disappointed because it is shot and acted so damn well.

That said, yes, much of it is cliched. More importantly, it doesn't feel detailed enough like you said. Then during the trial, the prosecutor was just talking to that one witness all casually for like two minutes without any objection from the defense or warning from the judge. Seemed a little off.

But I still love the show and where I think it's headed. Very, very Shakespearian and tragic in the ultimate of ways and done so fairly subtly in a way that is an indictment of discrimination, the system, etc.
 
Cunning Linguist said:
I absolutely love the show and while I tend to agree with you, it hasn't disappointed because it is shot and acted so damn well.

That said, yes, much of it is cliched. More importantly, it doesn't feel detailed enough like you said. Then during the trial, the prosecutor was just talking to that one witness all casually for like two minutes without any objection from the defense or warning from the judge. Seemed a little off.

But I still love the show and where I think it's headed. Very, very Shakespearian and tragic in the ultimate of ways and done so fairly subtly in a way that is an indictment of discrimination, the system, etc.
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I still like it I guess, I just saw so much more potential for it than what has been delivered. If it wasnt for Tutorro this show might not even be watchable honestly. If they can knock it out of the park with this finale, then that would be great.

Kind of hoping Naz just did it. I think that would be a good ending in a way.

What I hope doesnt happen is that some brand new character is introduced and they are the murder.

It's either the step-father, Dwayne, the funeral home owner, or Naz.

How did you feel about the kiss though? Did it not feel entirely out of place to you?
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
I still like it I guess, I just saw so much more potential for it than what has been delivered. If it wasnt for Tutorro this show might not even be watchable honestly. If they can knock it out of the park with this finale, then that would be great.

Kind of hoping Naz just did it. I think that would be a good ending in a way.

What I hope doesnt happen is that some brand new character is introduced and they are the murder.

It's either the step-father, Dwayne, the funeral home owner, or Naz.

How did you feel about the kiss though? Did it not feel entirely out of place to you?
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They really haven't examined the other possible killers enough to pin it on them at this point. I do find the Omar (whatever his name is) idea interesting, but even that would be kind of out there and not developed well enough.

If it was some random new character it would cut my opinion of the show in half.

The kiss was a total wtf moment. Heck, maybe the lawyer has had a crush on Naz for years and she killed the girl in a jealous rage. That's kind of how far the show has sunk from my initial expectations.

I'm glad they spent so much time humanizing the male lawyer with the whole eczema and cat allergies stuff, though. Really helped develop the overall plot a ton. Anyone wanna bet whoever wrote this has eczema?
 
Gameface said:
They really haven't examined the other possible killers enough to pin it on them at this point. I do find the Omar (whatever his name is) idea interesting, but even that would be kind of out there and not developed well enough.

If it was some random new character it would cut my opinion of the show in half.

The kiss was a total wtf moment. Heck, maybe the lawyer has had a crush on Naz for years and she killed the girl in a jealous rage. That's kind of how far the show has sunk from my initial expectations.

I'm glad they spent so much time humanizing the male lawyer with the whole eczema and cat allergies stuff, though. Really helped develop the overall plot a ton. Anyone wanna bet whoever wrote this has eczema?
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The thing though, that is the best part of the show. Turtorro kills those scenes and they are actually entertaining to watch.

Every prison scene makes me roll my eyes with how many cliches it has and the court scenes are kind of the same way.

Anyone have a theory on the cat? I'd assume it's suppose to be some kind of turning point in the case with him taking care of it.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
I still like it I guess, I just saw so much more potential for it than what has been delivered. If it wasnt for Tutorro this show might not even be watchable honestly. If they can knock it out of the park with this finale, then that would be great.

Kind of hoping Naz just did it. I think that would be a good ending in a way.

What I hope doesnt happen is that some brand new character is introduced and they are the murder.

It's either the step-father, Dwayne, the funeral home owner, or Naz.

How did you feel about the kiss though? Did it not feel entirely out of place to you?
Click to expand...

I'll be surprised tbh if it's the stepdad, Duane, or the funeral guy. I'd guess they're red herrings. I'd be curious who the inheritance would go to, should the stepdad not acquire it. The accountant possibly? Maybe he killed her and is offering up info on the stepdad so readily because there is motive there and he would inherit it (for whatever reason) should it bypass the stepdad?

Anyway, I would be cool with Naz doing it so long as they presented it in some intelligent way. I think that would be very tough to pull off though. What would be the reason? Years of hatred and discrimination created an enraged monster? I doubt it. That shoe wouldn't fit given his behavor earlier imo.

If it's a new character, that's dumb. The gay cross-dresser in episode one? Dumb. The lunatic on angel dust in the precinct in episode one? Hmmpph. Meh.

That said, I think all the acting is superb. The kid is great and gonna be a star. He was Gyllenhall's partner in Nightcrawler, and is in Rogue One and another big movie with Rooney Mara and Ben Mendelsohn coming out. The parents are tremendous, their eyes telling everything. The prosecutor is so good in a very simple, NYC way. And yes, Turturro is phenomenal and I would guess would be a frontrunner for an Emmy or Golden Globe.

Having said all that, I am sticking with my Petey story. We first see him at the 43 minute mark in episode one as Naz is being hauled in. Between the time of the murder and right then would be an approximate 2-3 hours I would think as Naz woke up a good time after the murder, fled, was pulled over, taken to the crime scene where he sat in the backseat for quite some time, and then was taken back to headquarters. We know Petey and his mom were indebted to Freddy in some way and it's my guess that Freddy sent Petey (or his mom) to collect. **** went really bad and the 22 stab wounds aren't a crime of passion but rather one of panic and fending off a drugged up chick. For whatever reason (that we yet haven't been told), Petey was arrested shortly thereafter.

Once we see Petey a couple episodes later for really the first time, we always see him look at Naz in a very transfixed, sad way. A way that correlates to feeling almost awful for Naz being there for something he or his mom did. We've always thought it's the sexual abuse but it's more the guilt. As the trial begins and nears a conclusion, Petey is found dead, apparently of suicide. It could have been more than just the abuse. It could've been that he confided his guilt to Freddy and Freddy had to kill him. Or Freddy just knew he couldn't let Petey ever say the truth so he killed him. It could've been guilt over Naz and how he knew Freddy was Naz's puppeteer so he killed himself over that.

It all makes sense in an awfully tragic, sort of existential way. Their paths cross, lives altered and destroyed, as if Freddy is some God controlling their fates. And no one will ever know or the truth will never come out because the system is flawed. The prosecution is content with making things fit rather than displaying the truth. The parents have no money for a good defense. The jury, and us as human beings as a sort of bigger audience, are very biased at how we not only look at people for their skin color but what they wear, how they stand, how people respond to them. We see this best when Naz' mom exits the court room. His verdict is practically already written. And that's tragic. He's a better kid than that. But they'll never know. And I suspect Freddy will tell him the ****ed up truth near the end (that he sent Petey or his mom to do it) and finish by telling Naz that he can't do anything about it, the drugs in Naz' system from prison, the tattoo of Sinbad on his fingers, Freddy seeing Naz slit their buddy's throat (even though Freddy did it, Naz was just feet away and Freddy could say he saw him do it but was scared to say anything), Naz finding Petey dead, and so forth. All of that has been Freddy's doing as he pulls the strings and orchestrates all of that and more to create Naz' ultimate look of guilt as a sort of back-up plan to destroy his character should it come to that in court.

Finally, regarding the kiss. Yeah, I was sort of on the fence about it. I'm sure it actually happens a decent amount. But for me, it would feel more right if Naz did do it. If he's trying to manipulate her in some way. But I don't think that's the case. I think Petey via Freddy did it and Freddy is a simply scary antagonist. Regarding GF's comment about that not being developed enough, I completely beg to differ. For seven episodes, that's all Freddy's been doing. And we still have two hours left.
 
Cunning Linguist said:
I'll be surprised tbh if it's the stepdad, Duane, or the funeral guy. I'd guess they're red herrings. I'd be curious who the inheritance would go to, should the stepdad not acquire it. The accountant possibly? Maybe he killed her and is offering up info on the stepdad so readily because there is motive there and he would inherit it (for whatever reason) should it bypass the stepdad?

Anyway, I would be cool with Naz doing it so long as they presented it in some intelligent way. I think that would be very tough to pull off though. What would be the reason? Years of hatred and discrimination created an enraged monster? I doubt it. That shoe wouldn't fit given his behavor earlier imo.

If it's a new character, that's dumb. The gay cross-dresser in episode one? Dumb. The lunatic on angel dust in the precinct in episode one? Hmmpph. Meh.

That said, I think all the acting is superb. The kid is great and gonna be a star. He was Gyllenhall's partner in Nightcrawler, and is in Rogue One and another big movie with Rooney Mara and Ben Mendelsohn coming out. The parents are tremendous, their eyes telling everything. The prosecutor is so good in a very simple, NYC way. And yes, Turturro is phenomenal and I would guess would be a frontrunner for an Emmy or Golden Globe.

Having said all that, I am sticking with my Petey story. We first see him at the 43 minute mark in episode one as Naz is being hauled in. Between the time of the murder and right then would be an approximate 2-3 hours I would think as Naz woke up a good time after the murder, fled, was pulled over, taken to the crime scene where he sat in the backseat for quite some time, and then was taken back to headquarters. We know Petey and his mom were indebted to Freddy in some way and it's my guess that Freddy sent Petey (or his mom) to collect. **** went really bad and the 22 stab wounds aren't a crime of passion but rather one of panic and fending off a drugged up chick. For whatever reason (that we yet haven't been told), Petey was arrested shortly thereafter.

Once we see Petey a couple episodes later for really the first time, we always see him look at Naz in a very transfixed, sad way. A way that correlates to feeling almost awful for Naz being there for something he or his mom did. We've always thought it's the sexual abuse but it's more the guilt. As the trial begins and nears a conclusion, Petey is found dead, apparently of suicide. It could have been more than just the abuse. It could've been that he confided his guilt to Freddy and Freddy had to kill him. Or Freddy just knew he couldn't let Petey ever say the truth so he killed him. It could've been guilt over Naz and how he knew Freddy was Naz's puppeteer so he killed himself over that.

It all makes sense in an awfully tragic, sort of existential way. Their paths cross, lives altered and destroyed, as if Freddy is some God controlling their fates. And no one will ever know or the truth will never come out because the system is flawed. The prosecution is content with making things fit rather than displaying the truth. The parents have no money for a good defense. The jury, and us as human beings as a sort of bigger audience, are very biased at how we not only look at people for their skin color but what they wear, how they stand, how people respond to them. We see this best when Naz' mom exits the court room. His verdict is practically already written. And that's tragic. He's a better kid than that. But they'll never know. And I suspect Freddy will tell him the ****ed up truth near the end (that he sent Petey or his mom to do it) and finish by telling Naz that he can't do anything about it, the drugs in Naz' system from prison, the tattoo of Sinbad on his fingers, Freddy seeing Naz slit their buddy's throat (even though Freddy did it, Naz was just feet away and Freddy could say he saw him do it but was scared to say anything), Naz finding Petey dead, and so forth. All of that has been Freddy's doing as he pulls the strings and orchestrates all of that and more to create Naz' ultimate look of guilt.

Finally, regarding the kiss. Yeah, I was sort of on the fence about it. I'm sure it actually happens a decent amount. But for me, it would feel more right if Naz did do it. If he's trying to manipulate her in some way. But I don't think that's the case. I think Petey via Freddy did it and Freddy is a simply scary antagonist.
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Dude the girl was on horse tranquilizers, whoever killed her didnt have a hard time. 22 wounds were either an act of passion, or set up to look like an act of passion. No way it was from panic.

I don't think Petey killed anyone. The dude was sucking dick in prison.

If anything, Freddy might be connected to Dwayne or the step-father in someway.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Dude the girl was on horse tranquilizers, whoever killed her didnt have a hard time. 22 wounds were either an act of passion, or set up to look like an act of passion. No way it was from panic.

I don't think Petey killed anyone. The dude was sucking dick in prison.

If anything, Freddy might be connected to Dwayne or the step-father in someway.
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The 22 stab wounds is insignificant. The one witness said as much, that he's seen a very large number of stab wounds on victims in which the crimes were not crimes of passion.

As far as the drugs go, fair enough. She may have just been a crazy bitch, may have used the N word, may have been stabbed to make it look like a crime of passion. Doesn't really matter. I still think Petey did it. Duane, the funeral dude, the stepdad, they all feel like red herrings to me and offer no real interesting resolution to the plot in a basic or thematic way.
 
Two things.

1) I hope we find out who did kill Andrea and not that Naz is simply found guilty.
2) Where's the knife? That's the crucial piece of evidence.
 
Cunning Linguist said:
The 22 stab wounds is insignificant. The one witness said as much, that he's seen a very large number of stab wounds on victims in which the crimes were not crimes of passion.

As far as the drugs go, fair enough. She may have just been a crazy bitch, may have used the N word, may have been stabbed to make it look like a crime of passion. Doesn't really matter. I still think Petey did it. Duane, the funeral dude, the stepdad, they all feel like red herrings to me and offer no real interesting resolution to the plot in a basic or thematic way.
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Yeah, I said it either was an act of passion or set up to look like one.

Petey doesnt seem like the kind of guy you send in to do that kind of job. No way did he instruct him to go to her house to "collect". You send a big, intimidating person to do those things. Not a small skinny kid.
 
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