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I also think if you did like Collins you could wait Atlanta out. They should have been more desperate than us. They also have that Kings low level first rounder they might have ended up throwing in there. Think we were high on our own supply.

The other thing I don't like about the deal is when a player is paid that much its hard to move them out of a starting role... ego and trade value and the thought that you might "lose him" is real imo. I'd rather have a $10M rotation filler guy that you can yank in and out of the lineup as you please and as fit demands.

It’s just tough for anyone to look good when the whole team is ****. I don’t think we have an amazing roster or anything, but I do think the sum is less than the total of our talent.

If nothing changes, I think this team will improve over time. But like last season I think the franchise quits and we just hide under a rock for the second half of the season. You could argue that this has already started.
 
Can we reserve a little judgement before we see what the end result is?
Us having John at $27M a year is the end result unless we flip him for a bigger contract (Lavine). I'm fine not giving a final grade until we see what happens but at midterms its an F to me and much of it is for the same reasons I stated I didn't like it to start the season. Individually John has done about as well as can be expected, but he's not an unknown player and his *** been on the trading block for 3 years... so we kinda know what the league thinks of him. If someone gets desperate I could see us getting an expiring and some seconds but it was always a deal that seemed like the risk reward ratio was skewed against us.
 
It’s just tough for anyone to look good when the whole team is ****. I don’t think we have an amazing roster or anything, but I do think the sum is less than the total of our talent.

If nothing changes, I think this team will improve over time. But like last season I think the franchise quits and we just hide under a rock for the second half of the season. You could argue that this has already started.
Yeah I just think if this was the plan you needed to make getting a setup guy pg a priority. It was obvious to me at the time we had very little passing and mostly finishers in the starting lineup... so needed to achieve some balance. Instead we ran with JC and THT in the backcourt and it was just a mess.
 
Us having John at $27M a year is the end result unless we flip him for a bigger contract (Lavine). I'm fine not giving a final grade until we see what happens but at midterms its an F to me and much of it is for the same reasons I stated I didn't like it to start the season. Individually John has done about as well as can be expected, but he's not an unknown player and his *** been on the trading block for 3 years... so we kinda know what the league thinks of him. If someone gets desperate I could see us getting an expiring and some seconds but it was always a deal that seemed like the risk reward ratio was skewed against us.
The hypothetical falls apart when you actually envision the ceiling and ask yourself what grade that ceiling gets. It’s like NWG. We put this emphasis on keeping course because, hey, you may develop him into the next Neto. Okay, cool. How valuable is that really and why not just sign the actual Neto?

The absolute best case scenario on Collins is like a C+. When we keep it open-ended of a mystery of what it could be, it appeals to that part of us that thinks it could be like discovering plutonium on accident, or when your company sends you the Jelly of the Month Club and before opening it, you think, “I bet it could be a Ferrari!”
 
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The hypothetical falls apart when you actually envision the ceiling and ask yourself what grade that ceiling gets. It’s like NWG. We put this emphasis on keeping course because, hey, you may develop him into the next Neto. Okay, cool. How valuable is that really and why not just sign the actual Neto?
Yeah I think they saw it as "we may be able to get a first for this guy" when in reality it was maybe a couple seconds... and we could have easily gotten that with our 18M in space this year (and 26M next year... and the year after). I think they also liked the player but to really maximize all the players we have we needed at least a stop gap vet game manager pg to add to the mix.

I really think they were trying to recreate the Lauri glow up... but that is like looking for Rudy Gobert with the 27th pick... its kind of a 1 of 1.
 
Yeah I think they saw it as "we may be able to get a first for this guy" when in reality it was maybe a couple seconds... and we could have easily gotten that with our 18M in space this year (and 26M next year... and the year after). I think they also liked the player but to really maximize all the players we have we needed at least a stop gap vet game manager pg to add to the mix.

I really think they were trying to recreate the Lauri glow up... but that is like looking for Rudy Gobert with the 27th pick... its kind of a 1 of 1.
It’s also funny to think about the ceiling of two seconds when you contrast it with how many deals DA left seconds on the table or unnecessarily included them. There’s like at least 6 seconds there.
 
Here are the things I think:

I think we are either going to get involved with the Lavine trade (or some other star I don't see coming right now) or we trade Lauri at draft night if we don't land a top 1/2 pick to get THEE guy we want (lets say its Topic). At that point we would know where the draft fell and could get a lotto pick plus additional picks... but you will see the board and understand the value of at least one of the picks.

Still a chance they want to see the summer pan out and sign Lauri to an extension... but the 2025 draft should be worth tanking for and if you don't have a second star or a big time star prospect coming up it is tough to see us maximizing a 3-4 year window with Lauri. I think Lauri would re-sign and would be okay staying... but I'm not sure I see enough other promise to say we can hold up our end of the bargain.
 
dumb but reasonable trade.

KO to Philly for Marcus Morris and we get like 2-3 second round picks (they would be in 2029-30 range as that is when Philly has some). This would get Philly out of the tax. We bank a couple seconds. We cut Morris and open up some minutes.
 
dumb but reasonable trade.

KO to Philly for Marcus Morris and we get like 2-3 second round picks (they would be in 2029-30 range as that is when Philly has some). This would get Philly out of the tax. We bank a couple seconds. We cut Morris and open up some minutes.
I mean, why not? We have a tendency to get all my guys just a couple years too late. But I'd do it because we need to clear out some space. Wouldn't be such a problem if we hadn't traded for Collins this summer but, hey, that move will cost you KO, DA.
 
I mean, why not? We have a tendency to get all my guys just a couple years too late. But I'd do it because we need to clear out some space. Wouldn't be such a problem if we hadn't traded for Collins this summer but, hey, that move will cost you KO, DA.
Just trade everyone that’s getting in the way of more Taylor Hendricks minutes.
 
Just trade everyone that’s getting in the way of more Taylor Hendricks minutes.
The most obvious one will be very hard to move. But maybe that's where DA will come to the rescue with his LaVine move. Swallowing a cat to get the mouse.
 
The most obvious one will be very hard to move. But maybe that's where DA will come to the rescue with his LaVine move. Swallowing a cat to get the mouse.
Here's the shot I'm going to call... I believe in it like 10% but this is the prediction...

Lavine/Patrick Williams/Jevon Carter for Collins/Clarkson/a first either the Lakers one or a top 4 protected 2025 pick.

Williams has disappointed and needs to be paid this offseason. Would still have value but not sure anyone gives a good first for him... maybe one of the garbage ones that NY owns. We see what we have and maybe he pops... we can justify adding the pick with him in there since its clear teams aren't offering a first for LaVine. Bulls get to save some face in the press conference and get to stay mid-AF which is clearly their goal. They also save some money going forward to stay mid and get further away from the tax this year.

We re-arrange some deck chairs to see "is this something?"
 

View: https://twitter.com/esidery/status/1732879625217302798


Here is another semi-interesting Lauri suitor. Take the best pick they get in 2024.. they have their own and another one but it is likely OKCs... so two late picks most likely... don't want them both... just give us the best one.

Picks in 24/26/28/30 - swaps in 27/29 (with other picks we own and our own)... Could we get Mathurin too? Not a huge fan but he's got some promise as a scorer.

Call Indiana and OKC and see how far they would go.
 

View: https://twitter.com/esidery/status/1732879625217302798


Here is another semi-interesting Lauri suitor. Take the best pick they get in 2024.. they have their own and another one but it is likely OKCs... so two late picks most likely... don't want them both... just give us the best one.

Picks in 24/26/28/30 - swaps in 27/29 (with other picks we own and our own)... Could we get Mathurin too? Not a huge fan but he's got some promise as a scorer.

Call Indiana and OKC and see how far they would go.

Jarace would also be a candidate for inclusion. Maybe moreso than Mathurin.
 

View: https://twitter.com/esidery/status/1732879625217302798


Here is another semi-interesting Lauri suitor. Take the best pick they get in 2024.. they have their own and another one but it is likely OKCs... so two late picks most likely... don't want them both... just give us the best one.

Picks in 24/26/28/30 - swaps in 27/29 (with other picks we own and our own)... Could we get Mathurin too? Not a huge fan but he's got some promise as a scorer.

Call Indiana and OKC and see how far they would go.


You think Lauri commands that big of a package?
 
You think Lauri commands that big of a package?
I’d want a monster package. I think Jarace plus three picks is reasonably high. You’d have to sell them on how great they will be for the next 5 years and how Lauri is kind of a perfect star for their market… so because the picks will be bad then we need 4 and Jarace. If we move Lauri it needs to be a heist for us.
 
I’d want a monster package. I think Jarace plus three picks is reasonably high. You’d have to sell them on how great they will be for the next 5 years and how Lauri is kind of a perfect star for their market… so because the picks will be bad then we need 4 and Jarace. If we move Lauri it needs to be a heist for us.
For me it doesn't make sense to trade Lauri to the pacers because they only have their own picks to trade. Lauri and Hali would be dominant duo for a long time which diminishes the value of those picks.
 
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For me it doesn't make sense to trade Lauri to the pacers because they only have their own picks to trade. Lauri and Hali would be dominant duo for a long time which diminishes the value of those picks.
Over 6 years a lot can happen but yeah it’s not ideal… it’s also what you get in draft centered trade… no team will give up their whole draft future if they think they gonna be ***.

An OKC package would be better if they brought the other picks they own to the table. I think I like Jarace and Benny more than someone like Giddy… especially now since his recent troubles. Would be nice to get a high end prospect AND a boatload of picks.
 
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