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Utah Jazz Survivor ROUND 11

Which Jazz player would you vote off in Round 11?

  • Total voters
    52
  • Poll closed .
UGLI baby said:
You been butt chugging the Mary Jane again?
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Not sure how that's an absurd comparison. When Sap gets minutes he puts up pretty good numbers. He's put up 18/8 his past two seasons.

Or are you bashing the Terry comment? He was their second leading scorer during that playoff run, and didn't start a single game.
 
Nate505 said:
Not sure how that's an absurd comparison. When Sap gets minutes he puts up pretty good numbers. He's put up 18/8 his past two seasons.

Or are you bashing the Terry comment? He was their second leading scorer during that playoff run, and didn't start a single game.
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I actually just wanted to use that joke. I can see the validity in what you're saying. I love Millsap and if h'd embrace a bench role I'd probly love him more. Not everyone can do that though.

You should use the butt chugging thing in future weed/alchy debates. You're welcome.
 
UGLI baby said:
You should use the butt chugging thing in future weed/alchy debates. You're welcome.
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I owe you one brother!

And I also agree, that Sap's place in the future, provided Kanter and Favors live up to their potential, is a super sub and if he can't do it then yeah, he does need to go as sad as it would be.
 
Nate505 said:
Sure, but he could be a very critical backup. Jason Terry was a backup on the Mavs when they won it all, but arguably was the best player next to Dirk during their run.
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I'd buy that if I didn't recently see Millsap get neutralized by Boris Diaw.
 
neither enes nor alec are locks to live up to their potential, but if they both hit it, kanter will be far more valuable. scoring wings are an easier commodity in the NBA. a huge, immovable, defensive big man with good feet and a mid-range jumper is a pretty awesome commodity.

i can see voting for kanter, though. i really can. i just can't see how 13 people so far have voted for paul ahead of kanter and burks, two guys who could completely flame out. not only has paul been our best player for the last two seasons, but he also has a ridiculously tradable contract, making him a bigger asset than anybody on this team not named derrick.

and to those saying, "but kanter's still on his rookie deal!"... go look at what a rookie deal looks like for a #3 overall pick, then look at the amount of money still owed paul. if we look at actual dollars owed (and not cap hit), paul is almost as cheap as kanter is this year - seriously.

burks, then kanter. THEN maybe i'll consider paul before hayward since hayward has done more to show he's on the way to realizing his best-case scenario than the rooks have.
 
Should have been eliminated 3 rounds ago. Big Al, Mo and Marvin are more valuable then Kanter.
 
I voted Paul off, as he does not want to come of the bench and is not a starter on a championship team. He may be one the the Jazz best players, but I will never be happy with being an also ran every year.
 
jazzrule said:
I voted Paul off, as he does not want to come of the bench and is not a starter on a championship team. He may be one the the Jazz best players, but I will never be happy with being an also ran every year.
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i think he absolutely could be a starter for a champ... but not as the main guy. paul could absolutely be the 2nd or 3rd best player on a championship team.

also, i think he'll accept whatever role he has to if the jazz are winning and he's contributing.
 
theNBAnerd said:
i think he absolutely could be a starter for a champ... but not as the main guy. paul could absolutely be the 2nd or 3rd best player on a championship team.

also, i think he'll accept whatever role he has to if the jazz are winning and he's contributing.
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I can easily see Millsap as the 3rd best player on a championship team. 2nd best seems like a stretch unless it's a team like the 2004 Pistons where there a lot of very good players and no superstars.
 
theNBAnerd said:
neither enes nor alec are locks to live up to their potential, but if they both hit it, kanter will be far more valuable. scoring wings are an easier commodity in the NBA. a huge, immovable, defensive big man with good feet and a mid-range jumper is a pretty awesome commodity.

i can see voting for kanter, though. i really can. i just can't see how 13 people so far have voted for paul ahead of kanter and burks, two guys who could completely flame out. not only has paul been our best player for the last two seasons, but he also has a ridiculously tradable contract, making him a bigger asset than anybody on this team not named derrick.

and to those saying, "but kanter's still on his rookie deal!"... go look at what a rookie deal looks like for a #3 overall pick, then look at the amount of money still owed paul. if we look at actual dollars owed (and not cap hit), paul is almost as cheap as kanter is this year - seriously.

burks, then kanter. THEN maybe i'll consider paul before hayward since hayward has done more to show he's on the way to realizing his best-case scenario than the rooks have.
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Just because those between our posts disagree with you, doesn't mean you're not 100% correct. You are.
There's simply a divide over speculated results.
 
theNBAnerd said:
neither enes nor alec are locks to live up to their potential, but if they both hit it, kanter will be far more valuable. scoring wings are an easier commodity in the NBA. a huge, immovable, defensive big man with good feet and a mid-range jumper is a pretty awesome commodity.

i can see voting for kanter, though. i really can. i just can't see how 13 people so far have voted for paul ahead of kanter and burks, two guys who could completely flame out. not only has paul been our best player for the last two seasons, but he also has a ridiculously tradable contract, making him a bigger asset than anybody on this team not named derrick.

and to those saying, "but kanter's still on his rookie deal!"... go look at what a rookie deal looks like for a #3 overall pick, then look at the amount of money still owed paul. if we look at actual dollars owed (and not cap hit), paul is almost as cheap as kanter is this year - seriously.

burks, then kanter. THEN maybe i'll consider paul before hayward since hayward has done more to show he's on the way to realizing his best-case scenario than the rooks have.
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Because they're two guys who could also flame on? And yes, I fully believe they both will.

If we want Millsap after this season, we're going to have to pay him 12 per or so. I don't think he's worth that much. Pretty simple.
 
I had to vote for Burks. I'm a hold out on Kanter... the threads about him are legendary.
 
nightmare3983 said:
I can easily see Millsap as the 3rd best player on a championship team. 2nd best seems like a stretch unless it's a team like the 2004 Pistons where there a lot of very good players and no superstars.
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If Sap was on the Pistons team, he would probably be tied for 3rd or 4th best player.
 
UGLI baby said:
What NBA are you watching?
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nightmare3983 said:
I can easily see Millsap as the 3rd best player on a championship team. 2nd best seems like a stretch unless it's a team like the 2004 Pistons where there a lot of very good players and no superstars.
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spycam1 said:
Because they're two guys who could also flame on? And yes, I fully believe they both will.

If we want Millsap after this season, we're going to have to pay him 12 per or so. I don't think he's worth that much. Pretty simple.
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tell me which two guys from the piston's championship team were better than paul in overall terms. they won a championship with billups as their best player, followed by rip (one-dimensional guy who scored 17 per game), a 14-ppg version of sheed, tayshaun (who didn't even average double figures in the playoffs, and ben wallace. you could argue that billups was better overall than paul that season, but you absolutely couldn't convince me that any two guys were better. in fact, NOBODY on that team came even close to paul's 2011-12 PER of 22. the closest anybody came was sheed at 18.8.

paying paul 12M is not outrageous... unless we're also still paying al 15M.
 
theNBAnerd said:
tell me which two guys from the piston's championship team were better than paul in overall terms. they won a championship with billups as their best player, followed by rip (one-dimensional guy who scored 17 per game), a 14-ppg version of sheed, tayshaun (who didn't even average double figures in the playoffs, and ben wallace. you could argue that billups was better overall than paul that season, but you absolutely couldn't convince me that any two guys were better. in fact, NOBODY on that team came even close to paul's 2011-12 PER of 22. the closest anybody came was sheed at 18.8.

paying paul 12M is not outrageous... unless we're also still paying al 15M.
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Your problem is your basing it off of stats. The Pistons had 4 players who were all on equal footing offensively, while the Jazz currently only have 2 (Sap and Jefferson), that is a lot more sharing of the scoring load.

Like I said, he would probably be tied for 3rd or 4th best with someone like Prince or SHeed. You could make an argument that Wallace is better though because of his extreme defense and rebounding prowess and say Sap would be 4th or 5th best.
 
Cyrone Torbin said:
Your problem is your basing it off of stats. The Pistons had 4 players who were all on equal footing offensively, while the Jazz currently only have 2 (Sap and Jefferson), that is a lot more sharing of the scoring load.

Like I said, he would probably be tied for 3rd or 4th best with someone like Prince or SHeed. You could make an argument that Wallace is better though because of his extreme defense and rebounding prowess and say Sap would be 4th or 5th best.
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i hope you're joking cy...

chauncey 2004 - 16.9 pts, 5.7 ast, .394 shooting and a PER of 18.6
tayshaun 2004 - 10.3 pts, 4.8 reb, .467 shooting and a PER of 13.3
rip 2004 - 17.6 pts, 4.0 ast, .455 shooting and a PER of 16.8
sheed 2004 - 13.7 pts, 7.0 reb, .431 shooting and a PER of 18.8
wallace 2004 - 9.5 pts, 12.4 reb, .421 shooting and a PER of 17.3
paul 2012 - 16.6 pts, 8.8 reb, .495 shootings and a PER of 21.8

if you put paul on that 2004 pistons team in place of just about anybody on their team (except maybe chauncey, who was so core to their system and their personality as a team) they only get better.

the real strength of that pistons team was their depth. they had 10 guys with a PER of 13 or higher, which is basically unheard of (although last year's nuggets had something similar). but on an individual level, it's hard to argue that anybody other than chauncey was so good that they'd be better than what paul would provide as a hypothetical time machine replacement.

i think paul is the next recipient of the andrei kirilenko award, given to the guy whose own fans and team don't even realize how valuable he is.
 
theNBAnerd said:
i hope you're joking cy...

chauncey 2004 - 16.9 pts, 5.7 ast, .394 shooting and a PER of 18.6
tayshaun 2004 - 10.3 pts, 4.8 reb, .467 shooting and a PER of 13.3
rip 2004 - 17.6 pts, 4.0 ast, .455 shooting and a PER of 16.8
sheed 2004 - 13.7 pts, 7.0 reb, .431 shooting and a PER of 18.8
wallace 2004 - 9.5 pts, 12.4 reb, .421 shooting and a PER of 17.3
paul 2012 - 16.6 pts, 8.8 reb, .495 shootings and a PER of 21.8

if you put paul on that 2004 pistons team in place of just about anybody on their team (except maybe chauncey, who was so core to their system and their personality as a team) they only get better.

the real strength of that pistons team was their depth. they had 10 guys with a PER of 13 or higher, which is basically unheard of (although last year's nuggets had something similar). but on an individual level, it's hard to argue that anybody other than chauncey was so good that they'd be better than what paul would provide as a hypothetical time machine replacement.

i think paul is the next recipient of the andrei kirilenko award, given to the guy whose own fans and team don't even realize how valuable he is.
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There are certainly a lot of those that are coming through the woodwork. I would have to say that I will be one of them if Millsap demands a contract that pays him anything more than 10 million a year for 2 or 3 years.
 
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