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The Knicks are at the Cross Section of Hope and Desperation

Handlogten's Heros said:
There is wanting out and demanding out... I think if you gave him truth serum and said where would you like to be in 18 months he'd say not Utah.

I would prefer the top 4 pick I think, but the absence of that pick would mean you could ask for everything else unprotected... i think you might be able to get the top 4 pick and a couple others unprotected and maybe the Dallas pick... and I'd take that. It isn't a deal killer for me because I think it would lead to them paying more in other ways that might have more upside. I like the draft this year but at #4 I think there is a drop off... if I could get Smith I'd be super excited.
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Sure. If he wants out or demands out, doesn't matter to me. If he's out, we trade him now. No need to wait. If he wants to stay, you don't trade him for a bunch of picks that likely won't be in the top 10 ever.

If you switched out Don and Fournier, and we got a ton of picks, I think the Knicks are a playoff team next year. They were a playoff team without Fournier last year. And who knows, maybe Don does recruit somebody in the future to join him.
 
LoPo said:
Sure. If he wants out or demands out, doesn't matter to me. If he's out, we trade him now. No need to wait. If he wants to stay, you don't trade him for a bunch of picks that likely won't be in the top 10 ever.

If you switched out Don and Fournier, and we got a ton of picks, I think the Knicks are a playoff team next year. They were a playoff team without Fournier last year. And who knows, maybe Don does recruit somebody in the future to join him.
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They might make the playoffs... but are an injury away from being a bottom 5 team... getting those picks unprotected over multiple years and I will be at least half are in the lotto. Knicks gonna Knick.

Having Donovan on a big deal and RJ... and Randle plus Robinson maybe? and then having no picks to help grease the wheels will limit how much they can really do in FA. I also don't think Don is going to have the kind of pull they might.

When you bet on downside its like Russian Roulette great because it only takes one bullet for bad **** to happen... so they may get like 4 things right and still end up losing the game. I'm trying to think of the last heavy unprotected pick trade that went bad for the team getting the picks. They have a way of working out.
 
LoPo said:
Sure. If he wants out or demands out, doesn't matter to me. If he's out, we trade him now. No need to wait. If he wants to stay, you don't trade him for a bunch of picks that likely won't be in the top 10 ever.

If you switched out Don and Fournier, and we got a ton of picks, I think the Knicks are a playoff team next year. They were a playoff team without Fournier last year. And who knows, maybe Don does recruit somebody in the future to join him.
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I don't think they would be better. That would be one horrendous defensive team.

DM will recruit all of his loser NBA buddies.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
They might make the playoffs... but are an injury away from being a bottom 5 team... getting those picks unprotected over multiple years and I will be at least half are in the lotto. Knicks gonna Knick.

Having Donovan on a big deal and RJ... and Randle plus Robinson maybe? and then having no picks to help grease the wheels will limit how much they can really do in FA. I also don't think Don is going to have the kind of pull they might.

When you bet on downside its like Russian Roulette great because it only takes one bullet for bad **** to happen... so they may get like 4 things right and still end up losing the game. I'm trying to think of the last heavy unprotected pick trade that went bad for the team getting the picks. They have a way of working out.
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If we got 5 unprotected 1st round picks, yes, it sounds super sexy. I'm just saying that if we got the picks, we won't get any valuable players. So probably wouldn't even get Fournier. We'd probably get back Rose, Burks, Kemba, etc.

I think it's a risk.
 
Hearsky said:
I don't think they would be better. That would be one horrendous defensive team.

DM will recruit all of his loser NBA buddies.
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I think they are better if healthy but not by so much that the pick is in the 20s. They ended up 6 games outside of the play in and they won a bunch of meaningless games at the end of the year when teams gave up... because.... Thibs.

I think he may have a year where he misses a bunch of games because of injury... or other guys get hurt. I don't think he will magically be committed to defense and make some huge improvement. They are a bad organization and I like betting against bad organizations...

There is also the chance he gets in and after 3 years has had enough of that ****.
 
LoPo said:
If we got 5 unprotected 1st round picks, yes, it sounds super sexy. I'm just saying that if we got the picks, we won't get any valuable players. So probably wouldn't even get Fournier. We'd probably get back Rose, Burks, Kemba, etc.

I think it's a risk.
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I think you could snag Quickley and Toppin... probably Reddish for sure. I would prefer getting Burks/Kemba to Fournier because their contracts end a year earlier. I think Burks is better than Fournier too.

Everything is a risk and I know its a bet... if I am betting against the Knicks over the long term I feel ****ing great about that bet.
 
I’d like to swap Quin and Thibs in any deal. Not because I necessarily want Thibs, but I figure if we’re going to be running certain guys into the ground with their minutes, we may as well be demanding they play defense.
 
Thee Idiotic Minivan K said:
Personally, I don’t think they’d just give all those picks up with no protections. I’d love to get RJ and two picks.
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They shouldn't... but they still believe a little bit in what they are building because they made the playoffs two years ago (in a big outlier season for them for a multitude of reasons) and its clear they REALLY want Donovan... so they may do something dumb... especially if they can keep RJ and pair him with Donovan.

Their front office is basically run by CAA... Donovan is with CAA... if their front office can't get that guy then they end up unemployed.

Let them start a dialogue and just see how far they will go. They traded their best player on a whim a couple years ago because they thought they had a chance at KD/Kyrie.
 
There is just so much value we can get if we are willing to blow it up. There are some desperate situations... and even if you land picks from teams finishing in the 8-14 range those picks now have real chances to jump in the top 4. I doubt teams will give those out much longer once one or two end up becoming top 4 picks.

Hell OKC is out of cap space so that opens up opportunities to be the salary dumping grounds too.
 
LoPo said:
If we got 5 unprotected 1st round picks, yes, it sounds super sexy. I'm just saying that if we got the picks, we won't get any valuable players. So probably wouldn't even get Fournier. We'd probably get back Rose, Burks, Kemba, etc.

I think it's a risk.
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If we got Burks back fish would be doing backflips! That's his bromance. But seriously, if Thibbs is still coaching NY Donovan would give him a heart attack on d.
 
Pretty simple IMO.

Trade Donovan for a zillion picks, do the same with Rudy, and hire Sam Hinkie to work his magic.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
There is just so much value we can get if we are willing to blow it up. There are some desperate situations... and even if you land picks from teams finishing in the 8-14 range those picks now have real chances to jump in the top 4. I doubt teams will give those out much longer once one or two end up becoming top 4 picks.

Hell OKC is out of cap space so that opens up opportunities to be the salary dumping grounds too.
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Why would we do that when we can run it back a year older and not add any defenders or expect our current players to play defense?
 
bigmike said:
Pretty simple IMO.

Trade Donovan for a zillion picks, do the same with Rudy, and hire Sam Hinkie to work his magic.
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Hinkie didn't even do an amazing job on the picks... He just tanked and collected his own picks while swindling dumb teams here and there. We'd be so far ahead of the tanking sixers if we got a zillion picks.
 
I like the haul that NOLA got for Anthony Davis. It included a high lottery pick, plus two solid young players in Ingram and Ball, plus future draft capital. They really put the Lakers through the ringer. I'd take half that package for Gobert.

If the Knicks move up in the lottery and offer that and future picks to the Jazz for Mitchell, then things become a bit interesting. If the Blazers end up with a top 6 or so pick, I could see them offering it in a deal for Gobert.
 
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