Yeah, that's not true. Agents can dictate a lot. Plus there are players who have to workout for everyone because they can't afford to pick and choose.
Still A Harsh Reality... Players not wanting to play in Utah
- Thread starter 416Klawzz
- Start date
Tell that to Austin Reaves
416Klawzz
Well-Known Member
Donovan fought for equality but was shut down... But that's on Utah, his efforts were observed by many around the league thus the perception remains ...
The Jazz Wonderbra
Well-Known Member
Bummer they didn't allow the video to continue for 15 more seconds. The opinion from the second speaker was all about how great Utah was but they cut it off. Whoever posted this has an agenda.
Probably pissed at Danny Ainge and trying to fire back or something.
Probably pissed at Danny Ainge and trying to fire back or something.
The Jazz Wonderbra
Well-Known Member
And honestly, there is a lot to NOT like about New York. Traffic is terrible. Weather is not great. The media is cutthroat. The organization sucks. But to a 19 year old, it has appeal.
New Orleans is a hole. OKC is a small version of Dallas and Dallas is a big version of San Antonio. Minnesota is frigid. Charlotte sucks historically. LA weather is fantastic, but that traffic!
The biggest beef on Utah is that 19 year olds don't know it's a gem compared to many other NBA destinations. Vets often STAY in Utah long after their careers. I think the guys in trucks with huge Trump flags and AK-47 stickers give us a bad wrap but that's all over the west folks. It's probably more prevalent in rural Illinois and Indiana from my travels. But we seem to be louder. It's a bummer because it doesn't speak for most of the population.
New Orleans is a hole. OKC is a small version of Dallas and Dallas is a big version of San Antonio. Minnesota is frigid. Charlotte sucks historically. LA weather is fantastic, but that traffic!
The biggest beef on Utah is that 19 year olds don't know it's a gem compared to many other NBA destinations. Vets often STAY in Utah long after their careers. I think the guys in trucks with huge Trump flags and AK-47 stickers give us a bad wrap but that's all over the west folks. It's probably more prevalent in rural Illinois and Indiana from my travels. But we seem to be louder. It's a bummer because it doesn't speak for most of the population.
Sean
Well-Known Member
I think a big reason the Millers sold the Jazz is that they knew it was becoming increasingly difficult to attract and keep talent.
The reality is, the NBA, more than any professional sport, is culturally urban and Utah is decidedly not.
Basketball has generally been a big city, urban-centric sport. The nature of the game has always favored that general demographic. A demographic that just doesn't exist in Utah.
It's why I think the Millers are going all-in on the MLB. That's a sport that isn't so tied to urban demographics. There are a lot of white baseball players. Certainly white players make up a much larger percentage of MLB rosters than they do in the NBA. In fact, according to a study done at the start of the MLB season, only 6% of players on opening-day rosters were Black. Contrast that to the NBA, where 72% of players are Black and it becomes pretty clear why, especially now, especially with the off the court activism (that didn't really exist in the 80s and 90s) that it clashes with the local political landscape.
It's not just nightlife, it's players feeling they're not only a minority in color but thought. That's a tough barrier to overcome.
Utah is a great place to live if you're okay with the conservative politics that define everything from policy to entertainment. Maybe not so great if you're a 24 year old single Black guy who is interested in using your star power to advance social causes, while also having some fun after a home game.
It's why I think the MLB can work in Salt Lake. Same with the NHL. The Jazz have done good with their limits but I think it's clear our ceiling as a franchise, beyond getting two Hall of Fame players to commit to 10+ years with the team, is probably coming up just short of the NBA Finals (Stockton was in his 13th season with the Jazz when they finally made the Finals, Malone his 12th).
The reality is, the NBA, more than any professional sport, is culturally urban and Utah is decidedly not.
Basketball has generally been a big city, urban-centric sport. The nature of the game has always favored that general demographic. A demographic that just doesn't exist in Utah.
It's why I think the Millers are going all-in on the MLB. That's a sport that isn't so tied to urban demographics. There are a lot of white baseball players. Certainly white players make up a much larger percentage of MLB rosters than they do in the NBA. In fact, according to a study done at the start of the MLB season, only 6% of players on opening-day rosters were Black. Contrast that to the NBA, where 72% of players are Black and it becomes pretty clear why, especially now, especially with the off the court activism (that didn't really exist in the 80s and 90s) that it clashes with the local political landscape.
It's not just nightlife, it's players feeling they're not only a minority in color but thought. That's a tough barrier to overcome.
Utah is a great place to live if you're okay with the conservative politics that define everything from policy to entertainment. Maybe not so great if you're a 24 year old single Black guy who is interested in using your star power to advance social causes, while also having some fun after a home game.
It's why I think the MLB can work in Salt Lake. Same with the NHL. The Jazz have done good with their limits but I think it's clear our ceiling as a franchise, beyond getting two Hall of Fame players to commit to 10+ years with the team, is probably coming up just short of the NBA Finals (Stockton was in his 13th season with the Jazz when they finally made the Finals, Malone his 12th).
3 of the last 5 NBA champions are franchises that did not rely on stars from free agency at all to win their title.
homeytennis
Well-Known Member
Maybe trading for Dame would help solve part of this problem.
SoberasHotRod
Well-Known Member
Somewhat related, but my personal advice to anyone that is young in their career would be to just focus on the job that is going to be the best for your career and don't worry about location. Almost any place is livable for a period of time. Wherever you live is going to have positives and negatives. There are usually nice pockets of livable areas within commuting distance of any place you work.
As you progress in your career you should be able to be more picky when it comes to location. Eventually towards the end of your career location might be more important than job.
As you progress in your career you should be able to be more picky when it comes to location. Eventually towards the end of your career location might be more important than job.
Release the Kraken
Well-Known Member
As a former denizen of SLC and a person that has lived in a total of six states all suburban, I would posit that SLC is among the most physically attractive. The combination of open roads (esp. after 10pm), clean air (non inversion), clean streets, low crime, majestic peaks and conveniently accessible outdoor recreation opportunities is hard to beat. Most outdoor recreation there is not even monetized. True, the pervasive Mormon culture can be oppressive and cultish, but by and large it is inconspicuous to outsiders. Overall, easy four star rating bore out by many best places to live polls.
Now does all of that appeal to young adult black males in a predominantly white bread city with certain night life restrictions? Of course not! It’s an acquired taste. But for those in the know, retreating to the hills and lakes on off days and having easy access to the arena on work days definitely has its’ perks. I get the impression that a lot of former players have a real soft spot for the place.
Fosto
Well-Known Member
Like you said, none of those upsides matter to a millionaire teenager.
Release the Kraken
Well-Known Member
True, initially at least. Gotta be a little Country I guess. Seems like Kessler, Agbaji, Sexton and THT have adapted and embraced it. I guess the hope is that the culture spreads to the rooks and other newcomers.
The Jazz Wonderbra
Well-Known Member
Agreed with everything here but the oppressive language...
Mormon culture can come across as uncomfortable, inclusive, uppity, holier than thou, and a lot of things, but oppressive is a bit over the top. I went to Saudi Arabia 2 months ago where hands are cut off for stealing and heads are cutoff for selling drugs. People sell reeds in the streets... the purpose... to whip any woman who exposes her legs. If you don't veil your head you are seen as lessor than...
I lived in Hawaii where if you aren't native, you are outcast. Dude peed on my car just because I was a tourist (even though I lived there).
I lived in Mexico where terms unnacceptable to most are extremely common and where people pee in bags to throw them at opposing players on the soccer pitch.
When I lived in Alberta, Canadians wouldn't interact with me because they felt I was there to steal their jobs (similar perspective as many here in the US treat Mexicans and many Mexicans treat Guatamalans). Cold shoulder treatment at lunch, in meetings. Very uncomfortable, but clearly not oppressive.
Most places have some level of cultural discomfort, but perspective makes a big difference. Oppressive is a bit over the top methinks.
Perhaps we have seen each other retreating in the hills and lakes btw. I wouldn't know... I was too busy practicing wicken.
Fosto
Well-Known Member
I don't think millionaire American teenagers would have much interest in living in Riyadh either.
Release the Kraken
Well-Known Member
I have to give you a qualified like for your assessment as your points are definitely very valid and well stated. I could say that you took my statement out of context but I see that I was probably a little ambiguous in my delivery. As an insider it was oppressive for me. Had a cousin that lost a prestigious Professor position at BYU because he’s Gay. I did qualify my position that the Mormon culture is “inconspicuous” for outsiders however.
PS Best wishes on those incantations!
homeytennis
Well-Known Member
Adrian Dantley said "there isn't much for a young black dude to do here" when he was first traded to the Jazz from the Lakers some 40 years ago. Unfortunately that image still persists.
No.
Then you're wrong, Sean. The Millers sold the Jazz because they lost a ******** of money during the pandemic and had to right the ship.
416Klawzz
Well-Known Member
Toronto is the complete opposite it's literally one of the melting pots of the World