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CP3 on John Stockton

It's simple, if a there's a player who was never discussed as the best player in the league at any point in his career, then he is not one of the best of all time.
 
Alfalfa said:
It's simple, if a there's a player who was never discussed as the best player in the league at any point in his career, then he is not one of the best of all time.
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No, i like the narrative better that stats, awards, and accomplishments don't matter if you played a long time without injury and had a good teammate.

LeBron has been too healthy and played with Wade and Irving so he doesn't qualify.

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Alfalfa said:
PFs are way better than centers at getting you assists. Kareem doing his post moves then taking a hook shot did nothing for Magic's stats. Stockton and Malone PnR is an easy shot or an assist for Stock every other possession.
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If you are correct, we should see a rise in assist numbers for PGs who play with great PFs (like Malone) and drop when they play for others.

Howard Eisley (the first person I checked) had better assist numbers playing for the NYKs after he heft the Jazz than playing for the Jazz. Was that due to playing with powerhouses like Clarence Weatherspoon and Othella Harrington?
 
One Brow said:
If you are correct, we should see a rise in assist numbers for PGs who play with great PFs (like Malone) and drop when they play for others.

Howard Eisley (the first person I checked) had better assist numbers playing for the NYKs after he heft the Jazz than playing for the Jazz. Was that due to playing with powerhouses like Clarence Weatherspoon and Othella Harrington?
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A backup who only played a few minutes a game with Malone. He played more minutes in that one season in NY where he averaged more assists a game. Also, that's a weird example. Take Nash/Stoudemire. Do you think if Nash didn't have such a perfect PnR partner he'd average as many assists? Of course not. I'm not making a divine proclamation. There is no physical law that says if you have a good PF, your assists will skyrocket. But if you're a good passing PG, then a good scoring PF (as it was defined until very recently) is perfect to accumulate assists. You can lob to a center, but most of the time, you feed it inside and the center will battle in the post to score. Having an elite perimeter scorer is not as good because of the lower % on the shots. Having a PF who can roll and pop is amazing.
 
Alfalfa said:
A backup who only played a few minutes a game with Malone. He played more minutes in that one season in NY where he averaged more assists a game. Also, that's a weird example. Take Nash/Stoudemire. Do you think if Nash didn't have such a perfect PnR partner he'd average as many assists? Of course not. I'm not making a divine proclamation. There is no physical law that says if you have a good PF, your assists will skyrocket. But if you're a good passing PG, then a good scoring PF (as it was defined until very recently) is perfect to accumulate assists. You can lob to a center, but most of the time, you feed it inside and the center will battle in the post to score. Having an elite perimeter scorer is not as good because of the lower % on the shots. Having a PF who can roll and pop is amazing.
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Tony Parker played for 17 season, most with Tim Duncan who is arguably the best PF ever. His total assists to this point are just over 7K.

Are you bored Alfalfa?
 
Jazz Spazz said:
Tony Parker played for 17 season, most with Tim Duncan who is arguably the best PF ever. His total assists to this point are just over 7K.

Are you bored Alfalfa?
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Duncan plays like a center. He scores with post moves. Malone mostly rolls to the basket or pops for a mid range shot.
 
Alfalfa said:
Duncan plays like a center. He scores with post moves. Malone mostly rolls to the basket or pops for a mid range shot.
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So basically we can only find a comparison in someone that played their whole career with Malone.
K... lets compare Stockton to Stockton. Exactly the same. Not inflated.
Done.
Thanks.
 
Jazz Spazz said:
So basically we can only find a comparison in someone that played their whole career with Malone.
K... lets compare Stockton to Stockton. Exactly the same. Not inflated.
Done.
Thanks.
Click to expand...

Well, Malone is the best PF of all time, and he could score in a way that perfectly complimented Stockton's shooting/passing ability. Sorry!

Like I said, Stockton was great. Just not an all time great. CP in Stockton's place would've done just as well.
 
One interesting thing to look at would be games that Malone missed that Stockton still played in while Stockton was in his prime of course.

Does a game like that exist?

Also, as I stated earlier, there is probably a game or two where Stockton was out but Malone played. How many assists did Stockton's backup/replacement get?

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using JazzFanz mobile app
 
Alfalfa said:
Well, Malone is the best PF of all time, and he could score in a way that perfectly complimented Stockton's shooting/passing ability. Sorry!

Like I said, Stockton was great. Just not an all time great. CP in Stockton's place would've done just as well.
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So let me get this straight... you argue that Malone inflated Stockton’s assists numbers, yet you say Malone is the best PF of all time (is he?), because he perfectly complemented Stockton’s abilities.

So Stockton is NOT an all time great because of Malone. But Malone is the best PF of all time because he complemented Stockton’s abilities. Got it. Makes perfect sense.
 
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