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Dame Time

No idea. I think with Lillard we are a 55-ish win team.
I guess I just don't see it. Part of it is... I'm probably lower on Lauri(as in... not low on what he showed, but more cautious about assuming this will be his level from now on into the future). I'm also lower on Agbaji than most seem to be. And I'm definitely lower on Collins than what some people seem to be...
 
I guess I just don't see it. Part of it is... I'm probably lower on Lauri(as in... not low on what he showed, but more cautious about assuming this will be his level from now on into the future). I'm also lower on Agbaji than most seem to be. And I'm definitely lower on Collins than what some people seem to be...
I'm not super high on Collins/Agbaji or anything, but they fit the team nicely.

I just dont see a huge need for a third star. The Jazz have the 3rd scoring option in Clarkson and Collins is a guy who can reliably get you 13-15 per game.

Who was the 3rd player for Denver? Who was the 3rd player for Miami?


Miami's 3rd/4th/5th guy were Max Strus, Caleb Martin, and Gabe Vincent?

I think we are letting perfection be the enemy of good at this point when we get too caught up in having the perfect lineup to compete.
 
The top response is

"He's the better scorer at this point.
Dame is a much better facilitator though"

With 36 votes. It was a conversation back then.
No it wasnt lmao.

If I start a thread that says "Is John Collins better than Lauri" I guess it would be a conversation too.
 
I get the distinct impression that Grant's extension probably caused Dame to bolt.
Hmmm, interesting take. They’re saying on NBA TV that it was a decision made by the organization to appease Lillard and that his subsequent trade request blindsided them because it will ostensibly force them to rebuild rather than compete.

One indication that the organization is indeed pissed is their announcement that Lillard has requested a trade. This kind of private in-house information is almost never revealed in these situations.
 
I have my doubts on if Dame can be the best player on a title team… his game may have some limitations at the highest levels… I think some of the stink in Portland obviously is his part. I just think we will have a hard time trading for any star… so if he’s willing to come here then I think we should see what the cost is and do all the due diligence.
 
I’m not necessarily on the “Dame or bust” train, but I do find it funny people are downplaying just how good Dame still is and will be for the next 3-4 seasons or flat out spreading misinformation just because they don’t want the Jazz to make the trade.

If Dame’s contract is too rich for your blood, or you don’t want Utah spending the assets it will take to get him, I get it, but don’t come in here with some weak-*** “He’s injury prone” take. Dame was in the league for 8 seasons before he appeared in less than at least 72 games in a season. He did have the major abdominal injury a couple years back, but over the last few seasons, a lot of the games Dame has missed while dinged up have been an agreed upon strategy between the team and player in an attempt to tank while still having him on the roster in hopes that they’d get lucky in the lottery- especially this past season.

Dame is still a legit superstar. One of the best pure scorers/shooters in the game. He can go and get you 55 when you need him too and he’s averaged nearly 8 assists the last 4 seasons. He’s a great teammate, great person, and a dominant basketball player. If Will Hardy can get a team on the threshold of the play-in with the likes of THT, you’re kidding yourself if you don’t think Hardy couldn’t take a team built around Dame/Lauri/Collins/Kessler deep into the playoffs.

Again, I’m not necessarily advocating for the trade without knowing exactly what the cost would be, but if Dame did end up landing in Utah, this team would be ready to go right now.
To ignore age and injuries is just flat out homerism. The odds of Lillard regressing gradually year by year over the next 4 years is extremely high. The odds of his body breaking down more often over the next 4 years is also extremely high. That is reality and to act like that is some weak *** argument is just stupid. It is a major concern that even the biggest Lillard homer should have.
 
I'm not super high on Collins/Agbaji or anything, but they fit the team nicely.

I just dont see a huge need for a third star. The Jazz have the 3rd scoring option in Clarkson and Collins is a guy who can reliably get you 13-15 per game.
I guess I don't think the first two stars are good enough, either. We've see Clarkson in the playoffs... we've seen Collins in the playoffs... they ain't it... Lillard has been great in the playoffs in general but as the single offensive initiator it hasn't been enough for his team. And we don't have a good second initiator. Lauri is more of a finnisher of offense than creator of offense.
Who was the 3rd player for Denver? Who was the 3rd player for Miami?
I mean... should I really outline the top difference in what Denver has vs what we would have? Lillard is not close to the player Jokic is.
Miami's 3rd/4th/5th guy were Max Strus, Caleb Martin, and Gabe Vincent?
Miami was a flukey team. I don't consider them legit contender. I think they were one of the luckiest finals teams in recent memory ...
I think we are letting perfection be the enemy of good at this point when we get too caught up in having the perfect lineup to compete.
I mean... I agree we would have a good team with Lillard... the question is - is "good" worth it? Is it worth it having a good team and being a second round exit team again after giving up half our assets? I want a great team, a team that has legit window for contention. I don't think Lillard is enough to make this team a legit contender.
 
Is it worth it having a good team and being a second round exit team again after giving up half our assets?
Brother just stop. Who is advocating for giving up half our assets (not me this whole time and not most people on this forum)? The Miami offer is currently two first, Herro, and one of Jovic/Jaquez.

The Jazz can match that in their sleep and still have over 3/4ths of their draft/rookie contract assets left. If it becomes a bidding war, you back out. No one is saying Utah should push all in for Dame.
 
Why wouldnt they win?

That's two guys averaged 58 ppg between the two. Add in Kessler if he's able to take a nice leap and you have an elite defender to go along with them. Collins/Hendricks give you lenght and athleticism w/ the ability to go small in the playoffs. Clarkson would be a great 6th man. Keyonte would be groomed to take over after Dame's contract is up. Ochai would be a perfect 5th starter.

I think it's a strong *** team. Would like to get another 3&D wing type to strengthen the perimter defense, but that's a strong team.
Agree.

I think a lot of people overlook roster construction after they get a star or stars and still not win.

Our team, with Dame, has A LOT of flexibility. You don’t have to just push your style and hope it’s enough. That roster has A LOT of flexibility and potential to work a lot of different angles, in playoff situations.

If all it took was a KD, Booker, Embiid, Kawhi, PG, Lebron etc etc etc, then why don’t all these dudes have rings at all or multiple? Roster construction. That’s how Denver won against those dudes.
 
The peak of Dame is better than Stockton. Stockton is as good as he is because of the longevity.
I strongly disagree. Defensively there isn't a comparison between the 2 and put prime Stockton in this era where he is encouraged to look for his shot more and I think he is probably a 25 point a game scorer while still giving you 12 assists and 2.5 steals on insane shooting percentages.
 
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