Democracy after Trump

[gandalfe]

Exactly. And it's funny you say that.

My college roommate's Dad was in the secret service assigned to Mrs. Clinton. The Dad said he would never in a million years vote for Hillary Clinton. He said the things he saw and the level of her power hungry corruption made him sick.

So when everything was leaked about Bernie, the Trump rally stuff, etc., he was not shocked one bit. And Hillary being Hillary cost her an election she should have won going away.

No secret service person should EVER say ANYTHING about their assignees. Maybe years later, but not while they're assigned.

 

[fishonjazz]

[

At the end of the day, I want my president to do his job. I want him to help create the policies which allow more Americans to be successful. I want him to help create a country that more people can make a living and support their families. Sure Trump is a jackass and he embarrasses us through his tweets and mannerisms, but I don't rate his job on those things. I rate his job on the economy, if we aren't at war with any other country, how much I bring home each month, etc. Those are the things that really matter to me.

Tell me about these policies he created to help more people be more successful. And how he is helping more people support their families.

I know he has helped the rich get richer big time. (of course)
And my paycheck got about 12 dollars bigger per week while everything I use my money to buy went up in cost as well giving me a net loss. While the deficit balloons hurting the future of my daughter and the earth environment gets worse hurting the future of my daughter. While he says racist and sexist crap which hurts the country. While he says and does things which divide the citizens of our country more than ever.
Sure he has been great about not starting any wars in other countries (while ever increasing military spending lol) but he is lighting a spark in our own country that is turning the left against the right and vice versa more than ever. He is basically declaring war on "the left"/liberals/Dems by the things he says and does. And he seems to be at war with decency and truth as well.

Those things don't matter to you apparently as long as you have a job and your paycheck is a bit bigger. You are easy. I think you should demand more than that from your president.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using JazzFanz mobile app

 

[One Brow]

Just my two cents....
- both political parties are corrupt so don't try the all high and mighty from either side.

Agreed.

- both parties do their best to rig elections. Whether it's voter suppression or registering dead people, it's wrong.

Who's registering dead people? Do these dead people vote? Voter suppression is real and affects elections.

- race relations have been an issue long before Trump. He doesn't help things but also the media slants everything negative anyway. The guy could cure cancer but the media would say he only wanted to cure it for white people. The media sucks.

Trump actively hurts, as opposed to just "not helping".

- if people want to complain about global warming, don't drive your car. Once you stop that, I can take you seriously.

I take the train (electric commuter rail) to my day job.

 

[LoPo]

No secret service person should EVER say ANYTHING about their assignees. Maybe years later, but not while they're assigned.

It was years later. And he told his son who told one of his best friends.

Much like the Democrats complaining about the Russians who released their dirty secrets. Who cares if he told me, his son, anybody or not? Isn't the information more important than how the information was made known? He didn't say any specifics but clearly said - I know her and I would never vote for her.

 

[Zombie]

Hard to take anyone seriously who claims both sides are the same but spends all their time minimizing the actual crimes of one group while blowing out of proportion the intraparty squabbles of the other.

 

[LoPo]

[



Tell me about these policies he created to help more people be more successful. And how he is helping more people support their families.

I know he has helped the rich get richer big time. (of course)
And my paycheck got about 12 dollars bigger per week while everything I use my money to buy went up in cost as well giving me a net loss. While the deficit balloons hurting the future of my daughter and the earth environment gets worse hurting the future of my daughter. While he says racist and sexist crap which hurts the country. While he says and does things which divide the citizens of our country more than ever.
Sure he has been great about not starting any wars in other countries (while ever increasing military spending lol) but he is lighting a spark in our own country that is turning the left against the right and vice versa more than ever. He is basically declaring war on "the left"/liberals/Dems by the things he says and does. And he seems to be at war with decency and truth as well.

Those things don't matter to you apparently as long as you have a job and your paycheck is a bit bigger. You are easy. I think you should demand more than that from your president.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using JazzFanz mobile app

I said I want my president to do his job more than win a popularity contest. As for his success, it's still too early to tell. Republicans could claim the economy, unemployment rates, etc. as wins for the President, but I think it's too soon to tell. Democrats will tell you that Obama is to credit for that, but there is no coincidence that the economy spiked and has stayed strong since Trump got elected. I will make my personal decision on his effectiveness in a couple years when I vote.

The deficit is flawed anyway. I just hope like hell that the US dollar stays as the world currency or we are screwed. As long as we print money to pay bills, we are in a flawed system. But I get what you are saying. I have three kids myself.

I think the "racist Trump" narrative is overblown. At the end of the day, I don't think Trump gives a rats *** about any group. He cares about green. If the media liked him or if he was a Democrat, the racist stuff wouldn't exist. It's a terrible plan by the media left, but their whole plan is to paint this picture that he is some old cranky white guy who hates all minorities. A good example - he said that drug dealers and rapists come into the country from Mexico when we don't have secure borders. Somehow, the media made it seem like he called all Mexicans drug dealers and rapists. Stuff like that has to be taken into context of the source and their spin.

As for race relations at large, our country was a tipping point before he was ever a presidential candidate. We could get into that debate later, but the country was already in social chaos although I'm disappointed that he hasn't done more to calm the waters.

I'm not satisfied with Trump but I'm also not 100% disappointed either. He is the non-politician who is trying to do things differently. It was always going to be tough because of all the factors. He is rocking every boat, and people absolutely hate change. We have all worked in places where it's easier to complain about the change than see how things might be better in some respects due to the change.

 

[LoPo]

Hard to take anyone seriously who claims both sides are the same but spends all their time minimizing the actual crimes of one group while blowing out of proportion the intraparty squabbles of the other.

I never said both sides are the same. I said they are both imperfect.

I brought up the DNC shenanigans as an example because the thread is obviously slanted in that direction.

 

[Rubashov]

Wonder if anyone at the pentagon and secret service are discussing a Dallas like scenario...

 

[fishonjazz]

I never said both sides are the same. I said they are both imperfect.

I brought up the DNC shenanigans as an example because the thread is obviously slanted in that direction.

No one ever said a side is perfect. Right now there is definitely a worse side though.

Lol at your comment that if trump was liked by the media or was a democrat that his racism wouldnt be an issue. He says racist **** frequently. If he were a democrat he would definitely get called out for the racist **** he says. Maybe even more so.

 

[LoPo]

No one ever said a side is perfect. Right now there is definitely a worse side though.

Lol at your comment that if trump was liked by the media or was a democrat that his racism wouldnt be an issue. He says racist **** frequently. If he were a democrat he would definitely get called out for the racist **** he says. Maybe even more so.

Liked was maybe a strong word. Tolerated was probably what I was going for.

I would like to know though, what has he said that was racist? I'm just curious. In how everything is today, you use a common phrase like "beat a dead horse" and the next thing you know you hate all animals.

 

[Gameface]

No one ever said a side is perfect. Right now there is definitely a worse side though.

Lol at your comment that if trump was liked by the media or was a democrat that his racism wouldnt be an issue. He says racist **** frequently. If he were a democrat he would definitely get called out for the racist **** he says. Maybe even more so.

To me it is not even so much a worse side. There is a very unique situation that is especially troublesome, and that is Trump. Of course, the Republicans, seeing that their base will absolutely turn on them if they stand up to Trump are being completely impotent in their response to his unacceptable behaviour. I believe that there will be a breaking point at which the Republicans will call on Trump to step down, because I think from what we've seen so far out of the Mueller investigation there will be unequivocal evidence that Trump committed multiple felonies leading up to the 2016 election and most likely has continued to commit felonies, other than plain old obstruction of justice, since being elected.

 

[Gameface]

Liked was maybe a strong word. Tolerated was probably what I was going for.

I would like to know though, what has he said that was racist? I'm just curious. In how everything is today, you use a common phrase like "beat a dead horse" and the next thing you know you hate all animals.

Before the election I would have allowed room for doubt that Trump had sympathy towards racist ideas. Since the election I don't think there is any doubt at all that he is sympathetic to White Nationalism. For one, he stated that he was a nationalist, which has and always has had racial/ethnic/cultural connotations. He has repeatedly referred to a group of families coming to the U.S. for asylum criminals, diseased, dishonest. You can argue that is not an outright racist comment if you want, but since this has been his habit and it has always been directed at brown people I'm going to make the obvious leap here and say that it has racial connections. He has referred to countries that have brown people in them as "**** hole countries" and expressed that we don't want people coming here from those countries, as though the people who happen to be born there are lower quality people. Why are they undesirable? We don't know anything about them on an individual basis, and I'd suggest that any person with the sense and ambition to leave a **** hole country is showing themself to be very possibly a good person who wants an opportunity to live a good life away from corruption and inescapable poverty. He referred to a white nationalist rally as having good people on both sides, specifically refusing to condemn what was explicitly a racist rally. So he feels that a person can be good and can also be in the KKK, or be a neo-Nazi, or be a white nationalist who advocates for a country of and for white people.

The fact that you ask for these examples as if you are not aware of them because "everything is called racist nowadays" makes you look dumb as **** to be perfectly honest with you.

 

[LoPo]

It's unfortunate that our voted officials have spent two years trying to find some link between Russia and Trump rather than do something productive. It is more likely that the Obama Administration broke the law by using Federal Agencies to spy on the Trump Campaign than Trump getting in trouble for potential felonies.

But hey, we all get it. The left hates Trump.

 

[Gameface]

It's unfortunate that our voted officials have spent two years trying to find some link between Russia and Trump rather than do something productive. It is more likely that the Obama Administration broke the law by using Federal Agencies to spy on the Trump Campaign than Trump getting in trouble for potential felonies.

But hey, we all get it. The left hates Trump.

More likely that Obama broke the law? You are being willfully ignorant, again...

Our voted officials have been doing their jobs much like they have always done them. Mueller, whose sole job it is to find out about Russian interference in the elections, has been hard at work focused on his given task.

 

[LoPo]

Before the election I would have allowed room for doubt that Trump had sympathy towards racist ideas. Since the election I don't think there is any doubt at all that he is sympathetic to White Nationalism. For one, he stated that he was a nationalist, which has and always has had racial/ethnic/cultural connotations. He has repeatedly referred to a group of families coming to the U.S. for asylum criminals, diseased, dishonest. You can argue that is not an outright racist comment if you want, but since this has been his habit and it has always been directed at brown people I'm going to make the obvious leap here and say that it has racial connections. He has referred to countries that have brown people in them as "**** hole countries" and expressed that we don't want people coming here from those countries, as though the people who happen to be born there are lower quality people. Why are they undesirable? We don't know anything about them on an individual basis, and I'd suggest that any person with the sense and ambition to leave a **** hole country is showing themself to be very possibly a good person who wants an opportunity to live a good life away from corruption and inescapable poverty. He referred to a white nationalist rally as having good people on both sides, specifically refusing to condemn what was explicitly a racist rally. So he feels that a person can be good and can also be in the KKK, or be a neo-Nazi, or be a white nationalist who advocates for a country of and for white people.

The fact that you ask for these examples as if you are not aware of them because "everything is called racist nowadays" makes you look dumb as **** to be perfectly honest with you.

With all due respect, I don't care what I look like to you. But hey, call me dumb. Call me names. I see that it works. For some....

I didn't ask for examples because I didn't believe you. I asked for examples of what the worst stuff was. Once again, I'm being devil's advocate. I worked in higher education for years so I know when a narrative is being forced. Trump has created some of the narrative based off poor words/messages and some of the narrative has been attributed to him unfairly.

I don't like what he said during the Charlottesville stuff. He was incorrect to say what he said and in the manner that he said. I don't believe what he said makes him a White Nationalist, but I agree that he was wrong. It makes him poor in his wording. He has clearly come out numerous times against racism shown by those groups.

Calling a country a **** hole isn't racist. He didn't say the people were terrible. That's like me saying there is a bar down on Bourbon Street that's a **** hole. I'm talking about the bar. I could walk in the bar but I choose not to. Doesn't mean I'm a piece of **** for walking into it. If Obama would have called some rural area or other country a **** hole, I wouldn't think it was a racist comment at all and I doubt the media would either.

I think a lot of what he says is twisted to have more connotation than it does. Just because he said LeBron is an idiot doesn't mean he's an idiot because he's black or an athlete. But hey, that's what Lemon wants you to think. People call Steven A Smith an idiot all the time but nobody calls them racist.

But this is worth noting. Trump's First Ever National Monument was recognizing an African American Civil War training site in Kentucky. https://www.washingtonpost.com/ener...rican-american-troops/?utm_term=.40ab0571bbb8 And of course the Washington Post has to question the motive as political. However, would a White Nationalist create a National Monument for African American soldiers who fought against the Confederacy?

 

[Gameface]

With all due respect, I don't care what I look like to you. But hey, call me dumb. Call me names. I see that it works. For some....

I didn't ask for examples because I didn't believe you. I asked for examples of what the worst stuff was. Once again, I'm being devil's advocate. I worked in higher education for years so I know when a narrative is being forced. Trump has created some of the narrative based off poor words/messages and some of the narrative has been attributed to him unfairly.

I don't like what he said during the Charlottesville stuff. He was incorrect to say what he said and in the manner that he said. I don't believe what he said makes him a White Nationalist, but I agree that he was wrong. It makes him poor in his wording. He has clearly come out numerous times against racism shown by those groups.

Calling a country a **** hole isn't racist. He didn't say the people were terrible. That's like me saying there is a bar down on Bourbon Street that's a **** hole. I'm talking about the bar. I could walk in the bar but I choose not to. Doesn't mean I'm a piece of **** for walking into it. If Obama would have called some rural area or other country a **** hole, I wouldn't think it was a racist comment at all and I doubt the media would either.

I think a lot of what he says is twisted to have more connotation than it does. Just because he said LeBron is an idiot doesn't mean he's an idiot because he's black or an athlete. But hey, that's what Lemon wants you to think. People call Steven A Smith an idiot all the time but nobody calls them racist.

But this is worth noting. Trump's First Ever National Monument was recognizing an African American Civil War training site in Kentucky. https://www.washingtonpost.com/ener...rican-american-troops/?utm_term=.40ab0571bbb8 And of course the Washington Post has to question the motive as political. However, would a White Nationalist create a National Monument for African American soldiers who fought against the Confederacy?

Trump is the one driving the narrative, by repeatedly saying the things he says.

I didn't call Trump a white nationalist. I pointed out that Trump himself claimed to be a nationalist and nationalism is by nature an ideology that places specific races/ethnicities/cultures over others. What I did say is that Trump has undeniably shown sympathy for white nationalists and the white nationalist movement.

When the only countries he calls **** holes are ones populated by brown people you can begin to make the connection...

I am not listening to interpretations of what he says, I'm listening to what he says. This line that we're all being manipulated into thinking he's saying things that he's not saying is not true. Ask yourself who is being manipulated? I'm listening to the words coming out of his mouth and making a judgement, you're listening to his apologists and agreeing that he's not really saying what he is very clearly saying...

I do nice things for my cat. I don't think my cat is equal to me.

 

[gandalfe]

It's unfortunate that our voted officials have spent two years trying to find some link between Russia and Trump rather than do something productive. It is more likely that the Obama Administration broke the law by using Federal Agencies to spy on the Trump Campaign than Trump getting in trouble for potential felonies.

Dude, even Alex Jones has given up that conspiracy theory.

BTW, are you able to provide citations for recent cases of voter fraud, as I asked upthread? Specifically you mentioned registering the dead.

 

[Gameface]

Dude, even Alex Jones has given up that conspiracy theory.

BTW, are you able to provide citations for recent cases of voter fraud, as I asked upthread? Specifically you mentioned registering the dead.

Actual investigations into Trump's baseless claims of voter fraud have been conducted. spoiler alert: the voter fraud Trump claims has gone on cannot in any way shape or form be substantiated.

 

[LoPo]

Dude, even Alex Jones has given up that conspiracy theory.

BTW, are you able to provide citations for recent cases of voter fraud, as I asked upthread? Specifically you mentioned registering the dead.

This was from 2016 and I have heard this was only the tip of an iceberg: https://www.tennessean.com/story/ne...-reports-voter-fraud-tennessee-2016/97038324/

 

[LoPo]

It all doesn't matter. The left is going to complain about the right and vice versa. We aren't going to become socialist (shut up Republicans) and not every Republican is some racist (shut up Democrats).

I wish they would just leave the stupid Russia thing that exposed the DNC corruption and move on to something that actually matters. You lose Democrats and you won Republicans, move the f on.