Looking for a new team

[fishonjazz]

The jazz were 10th in the entire nba in point differential (+1.81). Ahead of indiani, miami, detroit, portland, houston, and dallas (all playoff teams).

I decided to do a little research on a game by game basis for the jazz last year.

The Jazz only lost by more than 10 points in 10 games total last year. Those 10 losses? at home to portland, home to okc, at san antonio, at golden state, at san antonio, at portland, at washington, home against san antonio, at golden state, and at okc.
So 7 of those games were against golden state, okc, and sa antonio. The cream of the crop in the nba. 9 of them were to playoff teams. Only one loss last year out of 82 games was by more than 10 points to a non playoff team (on the road against washingtion) (and many of those losses came while we were very short handed due to injury)

You know what that data tells me? We were very close to being quite good. Better health, a little more experience for our players and coaching staff (the coaches are young and developing too remember), or a little better bench (yes naos, adding a few free agents last summer would have helped) and suddenly the jazz make the playoffs with ease and everyone is happy.

We are very very close to having this rebuild payoff and this cake taste so good but some of you think the sky is falling and the jazz suck and only want to discuss negatives about the team.

 

[Deleted member 848]

The jazz were 10th in the entire nba in point differential (+1.81). Ahead of indiani, miami, detroit, portland, houston, and dallas (all playoff teams).

I decided to do a little research on a game by game basis for the jazz last year.

The Jazz only lost by more than 10 points in 10 games total last year. Those 10 losses? at home to portland, home to okc, at san antonio, at golden state, at san antonio, at portland, at washington, home against san antonio, at golden state, and at okc.
So 7 of those games were against golden state, okc, and sa antonio. The cream of the crop in the nba. 9 of them were to playoff teams. Only one loss last year out of 82 games was by more than 10 points to a non playoff team (on the road against washingtion) (and many of those losses came while we were very short handed due to injury)

You know what that data tells me? We were very close to being quite good. Better health, a little more experience for our players and coaching staff (the coaches are young and developing too remember), or a little better bench (yes naos, adding a few free agents last summer would have helped) and suddenly the jazz make the playoffs with ease and everyone is happy.

We are very very close to having this rebuild payoff and this cake taste so good but some of you think the sky is falling and the jazz suck and only want to discuss negatives about the team.

1) very obvious that this team was a playoff team if we had had only ONE player not have an injury that he did.
2) I'm quite glad we spent the year to assess the talent that we had before we spent big-money on contracts for players that might have been obsolete given the players we now have. Would we rather have Lyles on a Rookie contract or Tobias Harris on a max? I'd rather spend the Tobias Harris money on two mid-level players like Crabbe and PJ Tucker
3) I hope the crazy string of injuries makes sure the players realize the importance of getting in shape before the season starts (Hayward alluded to this) especially if they plan on making a playoff run.

-2017 is the season. I've said this all along. This is the year to load up and make our run. I think the litmus test of the rebuild will be this coming season. If we falter, it falls apart-- and I can't see Hayward staying. We need to go hard at fielding the best possible team we can manage. We NEED good point guard play. I'm honestly scared of just thrusting the reigns towards Dante, cuz we can't really **** around this season IMO. The PG play needs to simply be better. It's so obvious how much it would lift the production of Hayward, Hood, and particularly Favors.
- our management needs to decide what to do with Alec Burks. If we think he can excel in that 3rd guard role behind Hood and Hayward, then fine. Otherwise he needs to get traded and big money needs to be thrown at an Allen Crabbe or the like ( i suppose he could be kept on the team even with a Crabbe signing)


Dante/Mack/Neto/
Hood/Burks
Hayward/Ingles
Favors/Lyles
Gobert/Withey/Pleiss

- Chris Johnson, BJ Burke, and Trevor Booker are either gone or they should be gone (hopefully we can get something out of Trey, I can see him succeeding elsewhere where the demand from PG play isn't as important).
- it's very obvious we need two more rotation players at the 2/3 and 3/4. God DAMN we need someone like PJ Tucker IMO. Ultimate replacement for Trevor Booker. Or sign Crabbe and pick up a long 3 in the draft, call it a night. Hopefully we can snipe the 12th pick.

 

[Boris]

From another jazzfanz poster
3. The Jazz really do have a good thing going. They have 4 of the 60 or so players in the league with 6 or more win shares last year (Basketball Reference), for example. All of them were 25 or under (according to BR's age scale). Only 27 players 25 and under had that level of win shares. That's less than one per team, on average. We had four. It's easy to argue that this group deserves a chance to see what it can put together with Exum and Burks back, better injury luck, and stronger attention to building a bench.

Hopefully that makes you feel a little better about our team.

I already tried to make you guys feel better before though so I assume more proof/information won't help any and you will still think the jazz team sucks and management are a bunch of dumbasses but I figured I wouldn't give up on you guys yet.

I just care too much.

Great great post. Can I offer minor critique? I hate the notion that Jazz bench sux. Like how do u believe Booker Ingles Burke Burks is not good bench? Those guis are all solid NBAers. How u think we upgrade are bench on a budget? We are not San Antonio that everyone wants to play for minimum $.

First time caller long time listener. I will hange up the telephone now and listen to ur answer.

 

[Ron Mexico]

I think Trevor Booker is a keeper. He does so much for this team. If we can keep him for a decent price we should. Although I want Lyles to play more minutes. Booker should play 5 to 10 minutes a game unless he is hot.

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[Coach Ellis]

For a good stretch there, the bench was awful. Jazz starters would outplay their opponents in the 1st quarter, often to the tune of a double-digit lead. Then they'd sub them out and the bench would promptly lose that lead and be down at halftime. 3rd quarter would be about staying near them in the score and then the group sent out to close the game would roar back and either win. . . or more likely, make a critical youthful mistake at the end that would cost them the game. Clutch time defense this season was atrocious.

Booker is an awesome dude, but mistake prone and struggles to shoot. Burke is out of the rotation. Johnson never should have been in it. Neto should be a 3rd PG. Lyles was hot trash to start the season and hot **** to finish it. I'm really excited about his future. Withey did well, but is obsolete if everyone is healthy. Pliess spent the year in Idaho.

Gobert, Favors, Hayward, Hood, Exum looks solid on paper, and I like the bench potential for Burks (if healthy), Lyles and Mack. That's 8 solid players. Jingles as a glue guy and Neto as the 3rd PG. That's 10 spots pretty well filled. Add the #12 pick - which I think will provide a decent developmental bench player.

If they can add an Alpha player, great. If not, let Booker leave, trade Burke and Pliess (frees up $6 million) and then add the best 4/5 players you can get your hands on to round out the bench. Pau Gasol is a guy that I'd make a run at. Think he'd fit the team well and has a good relationship with Snyder.

 

[Boris]

For a good stretch there, the bench was awful. Jazz starters would outplay their opponents in the 1st quarter, often to the tune of a double-digit lead. Then they'd sub them out and the bench would promptly lose that lead and be down at halftime. 3rd quarter would be about staying near them in the score and then the group sent out to close the game would roar back and either win. . . or more likely, make a critical youthful mistake at the end that would cost them the game. Clutch time defense this season was atrocious.

Booker is an awesome dude, but mistake prone and struggles to shoot. Burke is out of the rotation. Johnson never should have been in it. Neto should be a 3rd PG. Lyles was hot trash to start the season and hot **** to finish it. I'm really excited about his future. Withey did well, but is obsolete if everyone is healthy. Pliess spent the year in Idaho.

Gobert, Favors, Hayward, Hood, Exum looks solid on paper, and I like the bench potential for Burks (if healthy), Lyles and Mack. That's 8 solid players. Jingles as a glue guy and Neto as the 3rd PG. That's 10 spots pretty well filled. Add the #12 pick - which I think will provide a decent developmental bench player.

If they can add an Alpha player, great. If not, let Booker leave, trade Burke and Pliess (frees up $6 million) and then add the best 4/5 players you can get your hands on to round out the bench. Pau Gasol is a guy that I'd make a run at. Think he'd fit the team well and has a good relationship with Snyder.

I just got served

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

I think Trevor Booker is a keeper. He does so much for this team. If we can keep him for a decent price we should. Although I want Lyles to play more minutes. Booker should play 5 to 10 minutes a game unless he is hot.

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Booker isnt going to sign a contract to play 5-10 mpg. He is still young, he wants to play.

 

[Ron Mexico]

Booker isnt going to sign a contract to play 5-10 mpg. He is still young, he wants to play.

Probably not but I think the jazz should pursue resigning him. He will probably cost to much though but if they could get him on the same contract as before they should.

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[Aneurism]

Oh noes, franklin might end up being a fan for another team,.. we might have to let him go for nothing... lets try to trade him before he goes. We'll trade him for another true fan who can bring us to a championship level fan base.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Probably not but I think the jazz should pursue resigning him. He will probably cost to much though but if they could get him on the same contract as before they should.

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The comments Booker made post season where very "I loved playing here and I know Lyles is the future, thanks for having me".

I don't think he really wants to come back to be a 3rd PF, unless we overpay, which would be unwise IMO.

 

[fishonjazz]

Great great post. Can I offer minor critique? I hate the notion that Jazz bench sux. Like how do u believe Booker Ingles Burke Burks is not good bench? Those guis are all solid NBAers. How u think we upgrade are bench on a budget? We are not San Antonio that everyone wants to play for minimum $.

First time caller long time listener. I will hange up the telephone now and listen to ur answer.

Lyles is a bench player too and isn't that bad. So is mack if the team is healthy.

We have a bench rotation when healthy of mack, burks, and lyles with a tiny bit of booker. That's not too bad.
(Assuming you go with a 9 man rotation and always have a few starters on the court)

 

[NAOS]

1)2) I'm quite glad we spent the year to assess the talent that we had before we spent big-money on contracts for players that might have been obsolete given the players we now have. Would we rather have Lyles on a Rookie contract or Tobias Harris on a max? I'd rather spend the Tobias Harris money on two mid-level players like Crabbe and PJ Tucker

Background: Tobias Harris signed his current contract with the Orlando Magic. He's currently on the Detroit Pistons. He was traded.

Question: With respect to the signing of Tobias Harris, which team is better off today, the Orlando Magic or the Utah Jazz?

More background: Harris was traded in the first year of his new contract, with pretty much the maximum number of dollars and years committed relative to the day he became tradable.


I look forward to your answer.