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The *OFFICIAL* Russia Is About To Invade Ukraine Thread

Rubashov said:
The article said they Russians believe the SAS are operating out of Lviv. My guess is they were probably behind the attack on the Russian flag ship, probably not directly nut they likely planned and directed it. When you think about it, its hard to believe they would not have been present when you consider that Boris Johnson got a Eurail pass for a weekend and showed up in Kyiv. What a loss he would have been if the Russians got him?
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I think that's what they call a win-win?
 
The Thriller said:
It’s pretty amazing how nearly every single Russian conspiracy cited in this article has been used by @babe to justify Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. One would think that this would cause him to second guess his sources. But something tells me it won’t.

www.nytimes.com

Opinion | The Five Conspiracy Theories That Putin Has Weaponized

The gap between conspiracy theory and state policy has vanished.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com
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You continue to prove yourself to be neither an intelligent, thinking, reasoned participant in this discussion nor honest in your comments when the facts are on the table. But nevertheless, I believe you are pretty smart, or capable of being "smart" if you decided that was an important thing to be.

What you prove with remarks like this is that you are an unthinking activist for your little band of groupies.

I have stated my purpose is to present the best of what I can find to support or explain the Russian or Putin view, in their actual beliefs. I am not a propagandist. I look for what facts I can find, or find information on, to understand the other side. I post the source, the links, and the conclusions advanced.

I have also identified my position, personally, as opposing wars generally, and specifically opposing strong central governance. I am opposed the UN, opposed to NATO, opposed to dictators in toto, which includes Putin and Xi and the British and American oligarchs and other oligarchic (fascist) leveraged influence around the whole damn world.

Vladimir Pozner has written about Putin in fairly objective terms, and about the West. He notes in the video I posted above that "journalism" on both sides has degenerated and become more propaganda-driven, and less credible.

I understand he was raised Marxist, and moved to Moscow while Stalin was still in power. He is not in my opinion as great a thinker as Alexander Solzhenitsyn or Dostoyevsky.

Under overt communist ideological suppression, religion was systematically suppressed. One of the good things about Putin, in my view, has been his "state-supported" effort to build up the Russian Orthodox Church, even though his purpose is perhaps more like making it a sort of patriotic propaganda tool. At least it is a step away from hard communist ideology, and something that recognizes people's basic right of belief. Putin's main opponents inside Russia are the old communist party ideologues, and a contingent of Western-influenced Russians whom I would term ideologic "progressives" or "UN fascists".

Before Putin's big mistake of invading Ukraine, I was here trying to point out the need for a diplomatic resolution. It was Khruschev who in 1954 changed the Luhansk and Donetsk oblasts from Russian to Ukrainian regional classification. It was Catharine the Great and the Czars who systematically infused the Ukraine region with more Russian population, build Russian cities as outposts of Mother Russia. It was the historic front of Islamic aggression that many Slavic peoples united to resist through the middle ages. It was the British and Ottoman Empire combination that tried to push the Russian, Czarist, rule back through Ukraine, unsuccessfully.

I favor local governance in all cases where ever there is any chance of success. Accordingly, I reason, it would be a good move to partition some local areas like Donets and Luhansk if there are sharp lines of demarcation that could substantially improve people's control of their local government. It would be ideal if the US Constitutional principles of local sovereignty and Federal organization could be understood and respected.

I oppose the US Foreign Policy trend towards involvement in wars, regime change, and cartel establishments around the world, including China. Free Trade, to be free, has to be reasonably competitive, and free of deals like we do, even and especially Trump deals, that promote monopoly economics worldwide.


I consider at this point that the Ukraine war is a proxy war with the US vs Russia. Certainly our media and the Russian media prove that is the reality.

We should negotiate a settlement with Russia, and promote a settlement within the Ukraine region. There has been increasing ethnic oppression across the area since 1992 with suppression of political parties and human rigthts. Zelensky is guilty of this, and Zelensky took the bait of Western support and encouragement to withdraw from the Misnsk acvcord and refused to negotiate. Zelensky and NATO havfe their war-mongering and human rights violations here.

We should use our influence to promote a negotiated peace.

But instead, we are getting ourselves stuck in another unwinnable useless foreign war where the local people will be fighting for lifetimes. There is no way anyone can win this.

Until you realize that the NY Times is not real journalism, you will continue to be the dupe here.
 
stitches said:
Россияне восхитились...
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The New York Times' correspondent Durante justified Stalin's use of genocidal famine imposed on Ukraine, resulting in over 4 million Ukrainian deaths.

www.tabletmag.com

How ‘The New York Times’ Helped Hide Stalin’s Mass Murders in Ukraine

Journalism doesn’t have to stifle the truth in the service of fashionable causes and personal narcissism. It’s a choice.
www.tabletmag.com www.tabletmag.com

In the 1930s, Stalin's Russia was the shining vanguard of the dream of Progressivism at that time. Today, Putin's Russia is the stick in the mud slowing the progress. Documented sources reporting in any non-supportive manner to general political nature of Progressive, so called, politics since 1880 have been routinely labeled as uninformed or suspect, with perjorative labels in the media that is on board with "Progress". The fundamental support for the Progressive Era has been the wealthy, I should say the wealthiest, of the world's "robber barons", corrupt political financiers, cartel interests intent upon buying advantage through expanded government powers. Among the founding "great intellects" was Lord Cecil Rhodes, whose views of sociology and British supremacy generally gave him such grave concerns about the third world "coloreds" populace qualified him as a racist. The movement later embraced eugenics, and spawned Hitler. In Russia, it promoted the communist ideology as a means for regulating the populace, where there was no established industrial elite network to do the job.

During WWII, the Progressive elites decided to suppress China as a competitor in world commerce by favoring Mao over Chiang Kai Shek.

historynewsnetwork.org

A Closer Look at "Vinegar Joe" Stilwell

Americans rightly regard General Joseph W. Stilwell as a hero. Few know that he was a total failure with respect to his primary mission which was to be the Commander of American Forces in the China Burma India theater (CBI) and Chief of Staff to Generalissimo Chiang Kai-shek! That story has...
historynewsnetwork.org historynewsnetwork.org

The shift to open up China was influenced by William J. Fulbright's book "The Arrogance of Power", which laid out a subtle ruse on the world's people for setting up another puppet to blame for the world's woes in the coming century.

Today, both Russia and China are "wise" to the Western strategy, and even countries like India see the necessity to disbelieve our lying major Press, like the New York Times.

The war-mongers in Ukraine, the NATO proponents and Zelensky cult have done such an excellent job of disinformation, you look like Russians, really. The truth does not matter, it's the grand cause.

I have heard critics of Putin and Russia and the Russian Orthodox Church today lay out a sort of racist explanation that Russians are intrinsically or inherently conscienceless and immoral sub-cretins who alone commit all the atrocities of war.

I have not been in Ukraine to see for myself, but I think it likely that some of the "atrocities" are staged. Under communist indoctrination for a century, a large number of Ukrainians and Russians are sincere "materialists" who really have not been taught Christian precepts nor Western ideals like the Magna Carta or US Constitution, nor older "Eastern" nonviolent beliefs, which largely underlie the whole idea of human rights. Japanese soldiers in WWII, under heavy indoctrination, also lacked those ideals. War brings out the worst of human nature.

Rather than hype the alleged atrocities to justify more extreme war psychology, anyone who cares about humanity should demand peace negotiations and any settlement that will stand as a real settlement of the issues.

We begin by recognizing the valid concerns of the local populace and the facts on the ground. Some of that requires conceding the validity of Putin's "Russian Nationalism" that is represented by the national security of Russia. Recognition of the promises made and the destabilization we have caused by breaking those promises and treaty arrangements.

NATO and NATO-supported local belligerents might take Russia itself, along with various other national scraps of satellite states, but this process is not fundamentally democratic. It is Fascist. There will be no improvement under such regimes over what has been there in the last century. There will be continued genocides, economic disruptions, and suppression of people's opportunities in life.

NATO, under Western oligarchic governance, is Fascist, like the UN itself. India has long had substantial connections with Russia, with significant communist inputs. But Gandhi saw the evil of violence even in seeking whatever "worthy" ends, and marked an essential unity of British Imperialism imposing colonial rule with communist "revolution" by violent means in general. These are "Western" ideas.

today, Putin is opposing "Western" influence and building a "Russian" alternative, but still violent and "imperialistic" or colonial. China under Xi is also pushing back on Western ideals and culture, but also subject to the perverse forcible colonial expansion idea. This is the natural consequence of the UN global organization, which is the root cause of war today. Even India is building major military capacity, perhaps out of necessity.

We are headed for major change, hardly good change, because we are turning to propaganda, indoctrination of human beings, instead of education.

People who today push activist agendas with unthinking ideology or simply direct bullying, like we see in here so much, are working towards a worse world even than we have had.
 
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As I often do, todays survey of topics I'm interested in took me to the Jacobin.

jacobinmag.com

Aleksandr Dugin Is the Reactionary Prophet of Russian Ultranationalism

Most have never heard of Aleksandr Dugin or his obscure Traditionalist philosophy. But both have quietly become important influences on Russian politics over the past few decades.
jacobinmag.com jacobinmag.com

Aleksandr Dugin.

Ideological source embracing the basically false political schema of progressive "thinkers"

I call it push-back on British colonialism, much needed in general.

Putin being called a Nazi, like Trump. Putin is nominally "socialist", but mostly "pragmatic". Trump is nominally "pragmatic" but mostly buffoonish glad-hander nice guy.
 
The Thriller said:
Again, more Russian propaganda. Sounds exactly like some people on this board


View: https://twitter.com/biannagolodryga/status/1520861330651205633?s=21&t=ybZ5UunwJOPAfnRR5cyzpA
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simple minded comments here.

Some of Russia's worst leaders in the twentieth century may have been "Jews" by blood or ethnic background, but secular or materialist in their minds. Race really has nothing to do with it, when the issue is motives or ideas. Hitler ran his holocaust program on racial rhetoric, but the idea of "Aryan" or white supremacy was more than a program against "Jews". It was meant to consolidate financial control of the world, specifically. The reason for it was the British deal with some bankers to cut off funds for the Kaiser during WWI. The creation of the state of "Israel" as we call it today was the British end of that deal. Without it, some believe England would have lost the war, even with US help.

In politics, the use of terms often goes to a least common denominator sort of rhetoric that "wins" in the public mind because of "simplicity". Usually that means something more like "Stupid".

George Soros, a Jew, has been funding "Nazi" elements in Eastern Europe, not because his real aim is racist or to create another holocaust, but because it is useful as a tool. Soros is not "Stupid", he just knows there are a lot of people in Eastern Europe who can be used because of their stupidity.

Putin's rhetoric justifying his invasion of Ukraine is actually "accurate" only in the claimed symbolism of the Azov Battalion or Regiment, or of other "stupid" folks who think the title useful in their self-serving aims. The real aim is to drive Russian people out of Ukraine. That is indeed a genocidal campaign, but it's not directed at "Jews". The practical aim is not even that. The Russian ethnic folks are not so much the problem as Putin's non-compliant statist regime that is more like a nuisance to "Progress" globally.

Russian propaganda and Russian disinformation are real things, but of the same class as our media propaganda and disinformation.

One aspect of war is missiles, bullets, bombs and crap, an equally distasteful side of war is propaganda. "Stupid" rhetorical "bombs" like activist and partisan comments.

In the Ukraine war, the lead up was the Zelensky government deciding to refuse to negotiate as the previous Ukrainian government had promised, dismissing the Minsk accords as obsolete, while Zelensky's military leaders ramped up boasting about how they were going to run the Russians or "Separatists" out of the Donbas. Russia had some tanks do parades across the borders, and NATO did training exercises in Eastern Europe, with Ukrainian units invited.

I think Biden's comments revealed an intent to start a war like Madeline Albrights comments about Kuwait helped instigate the Iraq war. I don't know why Putin decided to invade. I think he was suckered into that huge mistake on purpose. But other than that, he might be participating in a "Bowery" War like the Aztecs used to host with their ostensible enemies. You agree to put on a war for show, for practice, for developing armaments and seeing how they work. Whatever. The Aztecs and their neighbor kings each got some new slaves from the exercise, plus a day of drinking in the shade on a hilltop where they could watch the show.

But I still think a more probable purpose behind this war might be to simply get rid of Putin and install a compliant pro-British rube. Other "good" purposes might be to create an oil crisis, or secure Russian oil in "friendly" Western-influenced hands.

But the fact that I can articulate Putin's professed views and factually discuss the basis for his claims does not make me a propagandist for anyone. Comments like this from Thriller hardly rise above the personal attack level of discussion.
 
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Here is a presentation by John Mearsheimer done several years ago, that jpretty much has proven accurate.aaaaaaaaaaa


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrMiSQAGOS4


I would add that the single driving cause of this war is the Western oil cartel which has been on board for the fake climate strategy for bringing in the US/UK led UN Fascist regime long on the planning charts. Puti's Russian state media has been poking holes in the climate claims, posting pics of Russian folks in little boats on the mud flat/marshlands of the receding Arctic ice mass/permafrost melt, pulling Wooley Mammoth tusks from the muck, proving these areas have been grasslands within the current interglacial warm period, within 15K to 20K years before the present.

In other words, our present Arctic meltoff is within normal events of interglacial warm periods like we are in. Thus the climate crisis is a hoax fostered by the West, specifically by Western oil monopoly interestrs who want to shut down competitor production. Russia has to be shut down as an oil producer.......until our guys own the place. Putin has to go.
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There where hints about it before but the rumors are getting louder that Putin has cancer.

I think bringing Ukraine into Russia was his legacy move and it isn't working. Sounds like he was being fed lies about support and actual sympathetic Russian sleeper cells inside Ukraine that were supposed to activate once the invasion started that never existed at all despite many millions of dollars being fed to his top FSB buddies to make it happen.
 
Gameface said:
There where hints about it before but the rumors are getting louder that Putin has cancer.

I think bringing Ukraine into Russia was his legacy move and it isn't working. Sounds like he was being fed lies about support and actual sympathetic Russian sleeper cells inside Ukraine that were supposed to activate once the invasion started that never existed at all despite many millions of dollars being fed to his top FSB buddies to make it happen.
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Oh its a legacy move all right. And exactly the legacy he deserves.
 
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babe said:
George Soros, a Jew, has been funding "Nazi" elements in Eastern Europe, not because his real aim is racist or to create another holocaust, but because it is useful as a tool. Soros is not "Stupid", he just knows there are a lot of people in Eastern Europe who can be used because of their stupidity.
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Just when I thought that I have seen all of debunked conspiracy nonsense come out of you already..... Show me at least one proven evidence of Soros funding any proven NAZI elements. And frankly, me being from Eastern Europe and for last 20 years living in Canada I could say that there is way more stupid people in N. America and USA in particular than in Eastern Europe. Not even close.
 
babe said:
I would add that the single driving cause of this war is the Western oil cartel which has been on board for the fake climate strategy for bringing in the US/UK led UN Fascist regime long on the planning charts.
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Seriously dude what are you smoking? Your posts are getting more and more ridiculous and plain stupid. Next you will start talking about Reptiloids and Hollywood satanists being a cause of the war. Seriously, and you dare calling Eastern Europeans stupid when you are pure embodiment of stupidity.
 
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