The Udoka pick is the worst in team history

[sojodave]

Raul Lopez over Tony Parker was an extremely bad pick

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I like Bane, but Herb Jones is a perfect compliment to any team. He defends, can run a little offense, defends as well as anybody in the league and can play SF, PF or C. He would have fit our needs very, very well.

I agree... I just think guys like Herb are in a lot of drafts... just they can't turn the theory into production like he has... if that makes sense. So it may be a draft miss but at least it makes sense. The Udoka pick never made sense and was a miss. I generally will be less forgiving if I understand the general premise behind the pick. Drafting is hard.

Bane/Jones.... Give me either guy and I'd be happy. I don't consider JB a miss.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

What makes it even worse is that right after the draft we used our $9.5 million MLE on Derrick Favors. So, we wasted our first-round pick and all our cap space on backup centers, when backup center is the cheapest and easiest position to fill. You can get a very good backup center for the minimum, just look at Whiteside.

It was the simplest thing to mess up. Like when docs amputate the wrong leg.... You performed the hardest part of this job very well... but you effed up with the sharpie marker.

 

[jom2003]

Wouldn't matter, neither would get any PT.

If Forrest can get PT why wouldn't Herb get PT.

 

[LoPo]

I agree... I just think guys like Herb are in a lot of drafts... just they can't turn the theory into production like he has... if that makes sense. So it may be a draft miss but at least it makes sense. The Udoka pick never made sense and was a miss. I generally will be less forgiving if I understand the general premise behind the pick. Drafting is hard.

Bane/Jones.... Give me either guy and I'd be happy. I don't consider JB a miss.

That makes sense. Drafting Udoka is a lot worse than not drafting Herb. Teams miss on good players, but taking a player we really didn't need was a poor decision.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

That makes sense. Drafting Udoka is a lot worse than not drafting Herb. Teams miss on good players, but taking a player we really didn't need was a poor decision.

I know lots of folks just want to say those late picks don't matter but if you picked Hart or White instead of Tony Bradley or took Bane/McDaniels/Quickly instead of Doke then you are in an amazing position. Herb instead of JB would be quite helpful if Quin actually played him too.... We went full stupid on two of those picks... JB over Jones at least made sense.

 

[LogGrad98]

If Forrest can get PT why wouldn't Herb get PT.

Because Forrest is getting the PT. That is why we don't see Butler and never saw anyone else very much until injuries set in. Forrest is the guy in the system. This will not change until Quin decides he isn't the guy in the system any more.

 

[homeytennis]

I know lots of folks just want to say those late picks don't matter but if you picked Hart or White instead of Tony Bradley or took Bane/McDaniels/Quickly instead of Doke then you are in an amazing position. Herb instead of JB would be quite helpful if Quin actually played him too.... We went full stupid on two of those picks... JB over Jones at least made sense.

The Books not closed on Dok yet. He played the Joker to a dead heat and showed something in doing that. If the surgery repairs his defects and he can get into better physical condition, perhaps there is a backup center there.

 

[infection]

Burks over Kawhi. Completely surprised he ended up on the board and thought he was the no brainer pick. Was disappointed, then even more mad when SA traded for him and knew he’d be good. I tried to like Burks’ game but never did. I think this one is bad because it’s not really just a hindsight bias guiding it. Kawhi was the guy I wanted when we had the 6th pick or whatever before we jumped to 3, then was thinking we’d get to walk out with both the guys I wanted (Kanter and Kawhi). Can’t knock the Kanter pick at the time because he’s who I wanted.

 

[LoPo]

I know lots of folks just want to say those late picks don't matter but if you picked Hart or White instead of Tony Bradley or took Bane/McDaniels/Quickly instead of Doke then you are in an amazing position. Herb instead of JB would be quite helpful if Quin actually played him too.... We went full stupid on two of those picks... JB over Jones at least made sense.

JB over Jones never made sense to me. We all knew we needed and still need defense in the worst way. Our SF/PF spots are so thin. JB was extremely redundant to me since we are already spending $60 million on small score first backcourt players (Don, Mike and Clarkson).

Of course I see it differently since I saw his enormous impact on Alabama last season. I knew he was one of those excellent leaders who was also a "glue guy". He just does all the things people take for granted.

Huge mistake not drafting him when we had the chance.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

I agree... I just think guys like Herb are in a lot of drafts... just they can't turn the theory into production like he has... if that makes sense. So it may be a draft miss but at least it makes sense. The Udoka pick never made sense and was a miss. I generally will be less forgiving if I understand the general premise behind the pick. Drafting is hard.

Bane/Jones.... Give me either guy and I'd be happy. I don't consider JB a miss.

He's also not that good. Anyone saying Butler over Herb is worse than Doka over Bane is beyond stupid.

Bane is going to be a starter on very good teams for a while.

Herb is a solid rotation guy. Butler will be better than him soon when given minutes.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

I know lots of folks just want to say those late picks don't matter but if you picked Hart or White instead of Tony Bradley or took Bane/McDaniels/Quickly instead of Doke then you are in an amazing position. Herb instead of JB would be quite helpful if Quin actually played him too.... We went full stupid on two of those picks... JB over Jones at least made sense.

In hindsight the Jazz should have just traded more picks instead of actually using them. The Conley deal was the best move we made because we actually got value out of the first round picks unlike a few of the ones we actually used to draft.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

If Forrest can get PT why wouldn't Herb get PT.

He probably would be now that there are more front-court injuries, but he would have been buried on the bench most of the season behind Bogey/Gay

He's also being incredibly overrated on here. He wouldn't really fit this team. His 3pt % is already dropping from a fluke start. He's a good defender, bad offensive player. He would be worse in Utah on offense than he is on the Pelicans due to the personnel and playstyle differences.

*If* we keep Jared Butler, he's going to be the starting PG in a few years time. Not all 1st round picks give you instant gratification.

 

[homeytennis]

I think the worst pick ever was Eric Maynor out of VCU. He got outplayed in Summer League by Kevin Kruger (now the UNLV coach) and that was the beginning of the fun. He eventually got traded in a salary dump. The guy was worthless in a Jazz uni.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Because Forrest is getting the PT. That is why we don't see Butler and never saw anyone else very much until injuries set in. Forrest is the guy in the system. This will not change until Quin decides he isn't the guy in the system any more.

Uhh, it will change, but players have to actually perform when given minutes in place of Trent.

NAW has a lot of mental mistakes and is generally terrible on offense.

Butler is certainly the most skilled, but he's also very shoot first on a team that doesnt really need that ATM and he gets absolutely cooked on defense by anyone with size.

Forrest certainly sucks because of his huge shooting shortcoming, but he plays leaps and bounds better than NAW and Butler in most other aspects of the game.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

And obviously Burke over Giannis is the worst pick of all time for teh Jazz.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

JB over Jones never made sense to me. We all knew we needed and still need defense in the worst way. Our SF/PF spots are so thin. JB was extremely redundant to me since we are already spending $60 million on small score first backcourt players (Don, Mike and Clarkson).

Of course I see it differently since I saw his enormous impact on Alabama last season. I knew he was one of those excellent leaders who was also a "glue guy". He just does all the things people take for granted.

Huge mistake not drafting him when we had the chance.

I just don't believe in drafting a guy for a current need. Especially in the second round. I also think theres a chance if Quin committed early that we could have had JB in a place to replace some of what JC gives us. I also think you give a guy 8 minutes a night his rookie year then you can move other pieces if they show they are good.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

In hindsight the Jazz should have just traded more picks instead of actually using them. The Conley deal was the best move we made because we actually got value out of the first round picks unlike a few of the ones we actually used to draft.

Lot of ways to get value there. I think the draft is so critical to team success, especially in small markets that I prefer to just draft better... but yeah make a basketball move with those picks and see if you can't find the guy you need.

 

[LoPo]

I just don't believe in drafting a guy for a current need. Especially in the second round. I also think theres a chance if Quin committed early that we could have had JB in a place to replace some of what JC gives us. I also think you give a guy 8 minutes a night his rookie year then you can move other pieces if they show they are good.

When drafting in the very late first or 2nd round, I look for guys with an elite trait. Herb Jones is an elite defender. Not many other guys in the 2nd round showed me an elite skill like that. I don't think a team can have too many wing defenders these days so I don't think taking him was as much "drafting for need" as much as "drafting for what every team needs".

Butler might end up being a solid pro, but I don't think he has any elite traits.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Uhh, it will change, but players have to actually perform when given minutes in place of Trent.

NAW has a lot of mental mistakes and is generally terrible on offense.

Butler is certainly the most skilled, but he's also very shoot first on a team that doesnt really need that ATM and he gets absolutely cooked on defense by anyone with size.

Forrest certainly sucks because of his huge shooting shortcoming, but he plays leaps and bounds better than NAW and Butler in most other aspects of the game.

If we are healthy House will assume all the Forrest minutes... Donovan, JC, Mike can all take a bit too... I just thought since it is kind of a coin flip between Forrest/JB that JB should get the minutes because he is a higher ceiling guy and needs some time to develop. I understood once Forrest picked up his play why he was getting the time.

We all need to come to the realization that NAW is a potential 3 and D guy BUT... and this is a big BUT... he likely thinks he is more JC than 3 and D. He is actually okay from the corners on three and could help on the break. Outside of that he should pretend he is Royce on offense. He played his role okay for a couple games and made some shots... then he immediately broke character.

For JB to have an actual real role there needs to be some roster rebalancing... but the skills are there.