Trump removed from 2024 ballot in Maine (this one is real)

[fishonjazz]

It’s literally their job to ensure that candidates on the ballot not be guilty of inciting insurrection. Why is this so controversial? If Obama or Clinton had done what Trump did, none of these clowns defending Trump would be defending Obama or Clinton. We all saw with our very eyes what Trump did following his November 2020 defeat.

If Trump is allowed to be on the ballot then he could win. He then could pardon himself and escape justice.

Now the argument is, then let’s have a trial. But we can’t, because Trump keeps delaying the trial. His hope is to choke out the clock so he can pardon himself/kill of the cases once he takes control of the DOJ.

This wouldn’t be a problem if:

1. Senate Republicans had fulfilled their duty. Instead, they didn’t want to tick off his base and lose the 2022 midterms (which they did anyway).
2. If GOP primary voters weren’t insane.
3. If a large segment of the population still had any trace of civic responsibility.
4. If enough Sec of State in key battleground states can leave him off the ballot. Which is required of them since enforcing the constitution should matter. If Trump is allowed to run then why shouldn’t Obama be allowed to run again? The same constitution that prevents Trump from being on the ballot because he incited an insurrection also prevents Obama from being on the ballot since he’s already served two terms. If the constitution doesn’t matter anymore then let’s be upfront and honest about it.

I don’t buy into the argument that his base will be emboldened if their candidate is left off the ballot. I find just the opposite. Appeasing these folks emboldens them. Appeasement is how fascists takeover. True Americans should stand up for their constitution.

Good post.
Especially the part about Obama and the very last paragraph.

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[fishonjazz]

Ahead of Jan. 6, poll flashes warning signs about 2024 election aftermath

A USA TODAY/Suffolk Poll finds 52% of Trump supporters express "no confidence" in an accurate vote count in November. Would they accept a loss?

www.yahoo.com

The USA TODAY/Suffolk University Poll found a 52% majority of Trump supporters said they had no confidence that the results of the 2024 election would be accurately counted and reported. Just 7% expressed high confidence that they would be.
In contrast, 81% of supporters of President Joe Biden were "very confident" about this year's election returns; just 3% were "not confident." Another 15% of Biden voters and 38% of Trump voters were "somewhat" confident
The findings spotlight the political schism and a deep skepticism among Trump supporters about whether this year's election results could be trusted and should be accepted − some of the same attitudes that in 2021 fueled the nation's most serious insurrection since the Civil War.

The view among most Trump supporters that the 2020 presidential election was "rigged" has persisted even after reviews by election officials and state legislatures across the country have consistently concluded that allegations of widespread miscounts, misconduct, stuffed ballot boxes and ineligible voters were without merit.

More than 60 cases brought by Trump and his allies seeking to overturn the results have been defeated in federal and state courts. Those decisions were handed down by Democratic-appointed and Republican-appointed judges alike, including federal judges who were appointed by Trump.

But in the poll, two-thirds (67%) of those supporting Trump said they didn't believe Biden had been legitimately elected in 2020, a debunked assertion that Trump has continued to trumpet at rallies and on social media. That view has little traction among other voters: 98% of those supporting Biden and 82% of those supporting a third party said he was legitimately elected.
.

Supporters of Donald Trump − who generally accept his unsubstantiated claims that the 2020 election was fraudulent − are prepared to believe those allegations again in 2024, setting the stage for protests and worse if the former president runs and loses in November.

 

[Keefe]

@Keefe i think people like you are being played.

When Trump was president we couldn’t prosecute him because he was president. At least, that’s what Republicans said.

When he stopped being president, republicans told us to refrain from prosecuting him since he was out of office. Just let him go away and let’s move on.

But he refused to go away. Now that he’s back and we’re prosecuting him for the crimes he clearly committed (incited an insurrection, attempted to steal the election in GA, and kept documents in Florida) we’re told by Republicans that this is election interference.

But if he wins, he can and will commit judicial interference by killing the investigations against him.

Keeping him off the ballot is one of the few legal things our system provides to keep this wannabe autocrat and criminal out of power since his party has decided to do everything in their power to keep him in power and influence.

Don’t you see how you’re being played by the worst actors in America? These people don’t care about American rule and law. They merely care about keeping their boy in power.

I’m not sure why you say I’m being played. I never voted for him and I’m not voting for him.

 

[fishonjazz]

I’m not sure why you say I’m being played. I never voted for him and I’m not voting for him.

But you are upset that some states are following the Constitution to keep him off the ballot.

Does it also upset you that Obama isn't being allowed on the ballot, or just that trump isn't being allowed?

I really liked this from the thriller: I don’t buy into the argument that his base will be emboldened if their candidate is left off the ballot. I find just the opposite. Appeasing these folks emboldens them. Appeasement is how fascists takeover. True Americans should stand up for their constitution.
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[str8line]

Ahead of Jan. 6, poll flashes warning signs about 2024 election aftermath

A USA TODAY/Suffolk Poll finds 52% of Trump supporters express "no confidence" in an accurate vote count in November. Would they accept a loss?

www.yahoo.com

The USA TODAY/Suffolk University Poll found a 52% majority of Trump supporters said they had no confidence that the results of the 2024 election would be accurately counted and reported. Just 7% expressed high confidence that they would be.
In contrast, 81% of supporters of President Joe Biden were "very confident" about this year's election returns; just 3% were "not confident." Another 15% of Biden voters and 38% of Trump voters were "somewhat" confident
The findings spotlight the political schism and a deep skepticism among Trump supporters about whether this year's election results could be trusted and should be accepted − some of the same attitudes that in 2021 fueled the nation's most serious insurrection since the Civil War.

The view among most Trump supporters that the 2020 presidential election was "rigged" has persisted even after reviews by election officials and state legislatures across the country have consistently concluded that allegations of widespread miscounts, misconduct, stuffed ballot boxes and ineligible voters were without merit.

More than 60 cases brought by Trump and his allies seeking to overturn the results have been defeated in federal and state courts. Those decisions were handed down by Democratic-appointed and Republican-appointed judges alike, including federal judges who were appointed by Trump.

But in the poll, two-thirds (67%) of those supporting Trump said they didn't believe Biden had been legitimately elected in 2020, a debunked assertion that Trump has continued to trumpet at rallies and on social media. That view has little traction among other voters: 98% of those supporting Biden and 82% of those supporting a third party said he was legitimately elected.
.

Supporters of Donald Trump − who generally accept his unsubstantiated claims that the 2020 election was fraudulent − are prepared to believe those allegations again in 2024, setting the stage for protests and worse if the former president runs and loses in November.

All that's left is for Trump to begin preparing the kool-aid so when he's sentenced to prison he can give his cult members one last order.

 

[Sardines]

All that's left is for Trump to begin preparing the kool-aid so when he's sentenced to prison he can give his cult members one last order.

fingers crossed

 

[Keefe]

But you are upset that some states are following the Constitution to keep him off the ballot.

Does it also upset you that Obama isn't being allowed on the ballot, or just that trump isn't being allowed?

I really liked this from the thriller: I don’t buy into the argument that his base will be emboldened if their candidate is left off the ballot. I find just the opposite. Appeasing these folks emboldens them. Appeasement is how fascists takeover. True Americans should stand up for their constitution.
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Following the Constitution how? Thriller said he’s guilty of inciting an insurrection. I think he is as well but my opinion doesn’t matter. What matters is a court of law and to this point, to my knowledge, he has not been found guilty of inciting insurrection in a court of law.

As far as Obama, no I’m not upset. Because there’s a two term limit.

I could be very well wrong about some of my points. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong. I honestly was only adding an original comment. If I’m wrong based on facts and concepts of substance I’ll accept that and own it. Thriller made some very strong points. Others I think can be questioned.

Having said all that, I wasn’t looking to get into an argument with anyone. Just to make a point I felt valid at the time. The board is a microcosm of our society. Extremely divisive and nauseating in that sense.

If it’s about Jazz basketball, sure, let’s argue away. But to get way too serious and nasty about Trumpf, no thanks.

I have too many fond memories on this board. To piss that away over politicians just isn’t worth it to me.

 

[Karen]

Following the Constitution how? Thriller said he’s guilty of inciting an insurrection. I think he is as well but my opinion doesn’t matter. What matters is a court of law and to this point, to my knowledge, he has not been found guilty of inciting insurrection in a court of law.

As far as Obama, no I’m not upset. Because there’s a two term limit.

I could be very well wrong about some of my points. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong. I honestly was only adding an original comment. If I’m wrong based on facts and concepts of substance I’ll accept that and own it. Thriller made some very strong points. Others I think can be questioned.

Having said all that, I wasn’t looking to get into an argument with anyone. Just to make a point I felt valid at the time. The board is a microcosm of our society. Extremely divisive and nauseating in that sense.

If it’s about Jazz basketball, sure, let’s argue away. But to get way too serious and nasty about Trumpf, no thanks.

I have too many fond memories on this board. To piss that away over politicians just isn’t worth it to me.

This is a great response. I have another board I’m a member of and the division is so draining. Really concerns me how visceral we have gotten as a society that most discourse is no longer helpful. Makes me wonder if this is driving what some republicans call for in civil war. I hate seeing our country get this way. People can no longer have their own views without attacking others or being attacked.

 

[fishonjazz]

Following the Constitution how? Thriller said he’s guilty of inciting an insurrection. I think he is as well but my opinion doesn’t matter. What matters is a court of law and to this point, to my knowledge, he has not been found guilty of inciting insurrection in a court of law.

As far as Obama, no I’m not upset. Because there’s a two term limit.

I could be very well wrong about some of my points. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong. I honestly was only adding an original comment. If I’m wrong based on facts and concepts of substance I’ll accept that and own it. Thriller made some very strong points. Others I think can be questioned.

Having said all that, I wasn’t looking to get into an argument with anyone. Just to make a point I felt valid at the time. The board is a microcosm of our society. Extremely divisive and nauseating in that sense.

If it’s about Jazz basketball, sure, let’s argue away. But to get way too serious and nasty about Trumpf, no thanks.

I have too many fond memories on this board. To piss that away over politicians just isn’t worth it to me.

Fair enough.
I will just say one thing. The Constitution doesn't require a conviction to keep him off the ballot
Just like Obama wasn't convicted of anything yet he can't be in the ballot. A 3rd term is not allowed. Insurrection also isn't allowed.
Obama isn't allowed.
Neither is trump.

I have heard the slippery slope argument before but haven't heard a good example of how the slippery slope could happen. I'm all ears to any hypothetical anyone has to provide.

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[One Brow]

Following the Constitution how? Thriller said he’s guilty of inciting an insurrection. I think he is as well but my opinion doesn’t matter. What matters is a court of law and to this point, to my knowledge, he has not been found guilty of inciting insurrection in a court of law.

The 14th Amendment says nothing about a guilty verdict.

As far as Obama, no I’m not upset. Because there’s a two term limit.

Has Obama been found to be a two-term President in a court of law?

Others I think can be questioned.

My SWAG is that SCOTUS will overturn both Colorado and Maine on the grounds that POTUS and VPOTUS are not officers of the United States.

If it’s about Jazz basketball, sure, let’s argue away. But to get way too serious and nasty about Trumpf, no thanks.

Agreed.

 

[Sardines]

The 14th Amendment says nothing about a guilty verdict.


Has Obama been found to be a two-term President in a court of law?


My SWAG is that SCOTUS will overturn both Colorado and Maine on the grounds that POTUS and VPOTUS are not officers of the United States.


Agreed.

What do you mean by SWAG in this context?

 

[The Thriller]

Following the Constitution how? Thriller said he’s guilty of inciting an insurrection. I think he is as well but my opinion doesn’t matter. What matters is a court of law and to this point, to my knowledge, he has not been found guilty of inciting insurrection in a court of law.

As far as Obama, no I’m not upset. Because there’s a two term limit.

I could be very well wrong about some of my points. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong. I honestly was only adding an original comment. If I’m wrong based on facts and concepts of substance I’ll accept that and own it. Thriller made some very strong points. Others I think can be questioned.

Having said all that, I wasn’t looking to get into an argument with anyone. Just to make a point I felt valid at the time. The board is a microcosm of our society. Extremely divisive and nauseating in that sense.

If it’s about Jazz basketball, sure, let’s argue away. But to get way too serious and nasty about Trumpf, no thanks.

I have too many fond memories on this board. To piss that away over politicians just isn’t worth it to me.

A court of law…

That Trump can delay until after the election?

A court of law…

That Trump can kill if he wins the election?

Where in the 14th amendment does it say you must be found guilty of insurrection in order to be ineligible to run?

This is why I say that you’re being played. Or those who make these arguments are being played. Trumpists whine about him not being found guilty of anything then support his delaying of the trial. And will undoubtedly support his pardoning of himself/appointing an AG that will kill the cases against him. That’s being played. Heads, he wins tails you lose.

If the board is a microcosm of society then I hope we realize that most of us believe in law and order. We don’t always agree on every specific policy but we agree on basics like following the constitution. It’s only a handful of cultists who don’t believe that laws should apply to them and their candidates. Why should society bend to them? Trump incited insurrection. We should follow the constitution and leave his *** off the ballot. Repubs should find another candidate.

 

[str8line]

This is a great response. I have another board I’m a member of and the division is so draining. Really concerns me how visceral we have gotten as a society that most discourse is no longer helpful. Makes me wonder if this is driving what some republicans call for in civil war. I hate seeing our country get this way. People can no longer have their own views without attacking others or being attacked.

Welcome to the board Karen, it's cool to have you here.

There's a lot of division out there but I don't think there's too much division here. Probably because only a few of us are willing to engage in political discussion. We have disagreements but there's not a lot of division. I actually wish Republican members here were more involved; real Republicans not Trumplicans. I consider myself to be a member of neither party and would like it if more of us could share our views. Share our views on the shades of gray not just the black and white. I like learning from those smarter than me.

I agree with you that civil discourse should be the goal, but it's kind of difficult to have a civil discourse when it comes to Trump. Could you have had a civil discourse with a Hitler supporter? A Kim Jong Un supporter? Any other dictator you can think of? Trump supporters are brainwashed. They are unwitting members of a cult, as all cult members are. It's very sad but that's the reality. You can support Trump's policies(although I don't think he really has much in the way of policies, just political panderings) but you cannot in good faith support the man unless you are a victim of his cult. It's actually a cult of hate. I wish I were wrong but I honestly feel that Trump's most ardent supporters could be convinced to kill their fellow Americans just for Trump. That makes civil discourse tough.

 

[One Brow]

What do you mean by SWAG in this context?

Strictly Wild *** Guess

 

[The Thriller]

Welcome to the board Karen, it's cool to have you here.

There's a lot of division out there but I don't think there's too much division here. Probably because only a few of us are willing to engage in political discussion. We have disagreements but there's not a lot of division. I actually wish Republican members here were more involved; real Republicans not Trumplicans. I consider myself to be a member of neither party and would like it if more of us could share our views. Share our views on the shades of gray not just the black and white. I like learning from those smarter than me.

I agree with you that civil discourse should be the goal, but it's kind of difficult to have a civil discourse when it comes to Trump. Could you have had a civil discourse with a Hitler supporter? A Kim Jong Un supporter? Any other dictator you can think of? Trump supporters are brainwashed. They are unwitting members of a cult, as all cult members are. It's very sad but that's the reality. You can support Trump's policies(although I don't think he really has much in the way of policies, just political panderings) but you cannot in good faith support the man unless you are a victim of his cult. It's actually a cult of hate. I wish I were wrong but I honestly feel that Trump's most ardent supporters could be convinced to kill their fellow Americans just for Trump. That makes civil discourse tough.

Good post.

It’s hard for the majority to find common ground with a minority of voters who live in a completely different reality. A reality where:

Trump won in 2020.
Jan 6 Insurrectionists are heroes and patriots; the police and prosecutors are villains.
Trump is supported by god (see the latest campaign video I posted in the Trump thread).
Russia is good, western allies are bad.
Vaccines cause disease, not help prevent/minimize them.

Perhaps it’s time for trumpers to get outside of their media silos and talk with Biden voters? Maybe it’s they who have lost touch with real America?