GOP Debate Threads

[♪alt13]

We just wrapped up 9 years of conservative rule. Let's hope Trudeau's liberals are more eco-conscious

The pipeline will be built and renamed the Exxon-Trudeau-Trump line.

 

[colton]

when bernie becomes president he will give away free stuff and the money has to come from somewhere

I agree with that!

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

I think claiming that the media is "dominated" by liberal voices is a stretch. Keep in mind that I'm in my mid-30s and Fox News has been the #1 rated cable news source for my entire adult lifetime. The most influential truly liberal voice we've had was probably John Stewart/Stephen Colbert and that was on a comedy network for one hour a night four nights a week. Colbert didn't even make sense without knowledge of Bill O'Reilly and Hannity.

If you defined everything to the left of Fox as "liberal" then the volume of stories are definitely "left of fox," but to be honest that just isn't the way the world works. Most newspapers try very very hard to have balance and say that both sides have valid points. This, paradoxically, has the effect of creating a right-ward slant because if you have to pretend that one side is making points that are just as valid as the other, even when they are not, it gives legitimacy and a greater voice to the weaker side. John Oliver did an excellent job demonstrating this effect as it pertains to Global Warming debates on television about a year ago and the Obama administration has had a nearly decade long problem with respect to the effect of long-term debt accumulation on this issue. Newspapers have been giving equal time to people predicting runaway inflation that has never materialized and we all pretend Paul Ryan is some kind of conservative budget genius because we need to create the illusion of balance. That illusion, created by pressure from people who constantly cry "liberal bias" actually creates a slightly rightward tilt.

Did you just say that the media is biased to the right because the right is stupid? While funny, that statement is also moronic.

 

[Deleted member 848]

The only reason you have no problem with a liberal media bias and that you are sick of the issue is that you are liberal. If the media was dominated by conservative voices I am certain you would see it as a problem.

There is a very valid reason why no conservative candidate has been asked for their birth certificate. There has never been a candidate where asking this question would make any sense. If one arises I guarantee you the question will be asked by the left, and if that candidate refuses to provide an answer I guarantee you that the question will be asked again and again. Politically it must have been worth more to Obama to leave this question unanswered because that's what he chose to do when he could have simply put it to rest on day one. Has a political candidate on the left ever been widely lampooned for claiming he/she could see Russia from their house (despite the fact that the quote was made by a satirist and never by the candidate)? No. Politicians and partisans from both sides are going to attack the opposition with anything available to them. That's the way our political system works.

Ted Cruz wasn't born in America.

 

[Deleted member 848]

I agree with that!

yeah lets just keep spending on making sure that corporations still have their tax loopholes I mean that seems to be a bigger priority than the health of American citizens

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Ted mother ******* Cruz says hi.

Hi Ted mother ****ing Cruz.

 

[b_line]

Hi Ted mother ****ing Cruz.

Aren't you going to elect him president then go on a 7 year tirade demanding a long form birth certificate?

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Aren't you going to elect him president then go on a 7 year tirade demanding a long form birth certificate?

I don't anticipate electing him president but if I did I wouldn't be the one going on a tirade. I was never on an Obama tirade either. I'm confident that no matter who gets elected someone will be going on a tirade, though.

 

[One Brow]

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

From you, I expect laughter as a substitute for evidence.

 

[One Brow]

Whether or not the attack was motivated by the video is irrelevant. The important part of the difference between the story that Clinton told the victim's families and the American public was whether or not it was a planned attack.

I notice that the importance of these communications occurring at different times, with different amounts of intelligence, does not seem to factor in your analysis of why there were different conclusions.

The facts are that we know without question

Today.

that it was planned. We also know that the ambassador requested military support and that aircraft were initially deployed but then told to stand down by the Hillary led State Department.

Please provide any evidence of Clinton's involvement of some order to stand down.

There are plenty of articles available about all the aspects of this debacle if you want to learn. Here are some examples from mainstream sources:
https://www.cnn.com/2015/03/27/politics/hillary-clinton-personal-email-server/

Trey Gowdy's statement has been proven false. The very next link you offered showed it was a lie. Does it bother you at all that you present known lies as evidence?

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/report-fbi-pulls-deleted-emails-from-hillary-clintons-server/
https://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2015...s-email-to-chelsea-stars-in-benghazi-hearing/

Neither of these offer any answers to my questions.

There is even more damning information from right wing sources which I will not bother showing you because I know you would discount them.

I believe in evidence, regardless of the source. If your sites offer evidence instead of propaganda, rhetoric, or rumors, I'll believe it. If you have more Trey Gowdy quotes, you need not bother on my account.

If, like the majority of liberals, you believe that the mainstream media is centrist,

Fox News is centrist?

BTW, I'm sure that if a conservative politician was ordered to turn over documents but responded by instead deleting them, asserting that they had the right to determine what was personal and what was not, you would be perfectly fine with that, right?

People of either party are foolish if they think deleting actually means anything. Outside of that, why would I care?

The bottom line is that you are attempting to take a stance that many people already believe is impossible to support, and which I believe that you (if you have a shred of intellectual honesty) will soon have to abandon as well.

I await actual evidence.

 

[One Brow]

CBS, NBC and ABC are all liberal.

To an arch-conservative, they seem liberal. To an arch-liberal, they seem reactionary. I see just as many complaints about the conservatism of the media amongst liberal commentators.

The reality is their bias is towards sensationalism and ratings.

 

[RandyForRubio]

yeah lets just keep spending on making sure that corporations still have their tax loopholes I mean that seems to be a bigger priority than the health of American citizens

Who here is saying that's what they want? We're intelligent here, let's make intelligent arguments, yeah?

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

I notice that the importance of these communications occurring at different times, with different amounts of intelligence, does not seem to factor in your analysis of why there were different conclusions.

You're clearly going to cling to your version of events despite the established facts, but I will give you a timeline once again. If you honestly believe upon studying this that the Clinton and the administration handled this in a reasonable fashion then we will just have to agree to disagree.
https://www.factcheck.org/2012/10/benghazi-timeline/

Please provide any evidence of Clinton's involvement of some order to stand down.

Clinton headed the state department. I do not give her a pass for orders her department generated. This is important stuff and the leaders of the department must be held responsible. Either she or someone who she placed extreme confidence in had to be behind this. If not that means she did a terrible job of organizing and running her department.

Trey Gowdy's statement has been proven false. The very next link you offered showed it was a lie. Does it bother you at all that you present known lies as evidence?

Yes, that bothers me. I did not know about the lies. I will research it and determine what impact it has on the story.

Fox News is centrist?

Fox News is right wing.

People of either party are foolish if they think deleting actually means anything. Outside of that, why would I care?

Seriously?

I await actual evidence.

Looks to me like what you are waiting for is confirmation of your bias. Since that's not going to come your strategy is apparently to deny the evidence that does arrive. That's your prerogative, but there's no point in discussing this further given your .
continued denial of the evidence.

 

[Deleted member 848]

Who here is saying that's what they want? We're intelligent here, let's make intelligent arguments, yeah?

the fact of the matter is that billions of dollars are being allocated in that direction. Where is the conservative pressure to stop this?

 

[colton]

yeah lets just keep spending on making sure that corporations still have their tax loopholes I mean that seems to be a bigger priority than the health of American citizens

I'm not sure how you get that from my simple agreement that Sanders' plan will involve substantially raising taxes, but whatever.

 

[Deleted member 848]

I'm not sure how you get that from my simple agreement that Sanders' plan will involve substantially raising taxes, but whatever.

if we can afford to not tax people justly, we can afford healthcare

 

[babe]

if we can afford to not tax people justly, we can afford healthcare

On the same level of evidence and analysis, "If we can just not tax people unjustly, they can afford to buy the healthcare they choose."

 

[RandyForRubio]

the fact of the matter is that billions of dollars are being allocated in that direction. Where is the conservative pressure to stop this?

Let me be more blunt, and lets see if we get a straight answer here.

Who HERE is saying that's what they want?

 

[babe]

To an arch-conservative, they seem liberal. To an arch-liberal, they seem reactionary. I see just as many complaints about the conservatism of the media amongst liberal commentators.

The reality is their bias is towards sensationalism and ratings.

It's not very objective to refer comparatively to various viewpoints and categorize them according to made-up ideological pictograms.

Objectively, I'd just say the media is corporate-owned and closely managed to corporate agendas.

 

[babe]

Ben Carson and Hillary Clinton compared on truthfulness

I'm sure I could dig up a lot of issues in this microcosm of the presidential campaigns this coming year. . . . and I confess to a bias in favor of Ben Carson. Over a year ago, my wife presented me with his book in autobiography.

I like Ben Carson.

Ben's autobiographical embellishments might be on the same scale as this breakfast story recently:

https://www.yahoo.com/politics/hillary-clintons-story-about-marines-rejection-173811079.html

clearly, Hillary in 1975 was just surveying military recruitment officers for gender bias, not trying to become a military enlistee.