Baton Rouge Police Killing a 37-year-old black man at point blank range

[Red]

Back to Rudy Giuliani's comments, this article saw it as I saw it:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/rudy-giuliani-black-kids-have-99percent-chance-of-killing-each-other/ar-BBu9EXi?ocid=iehp

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/arti...are-police-shootings-and-black-on-black-crime

"Critics often ask why African-Americans become so exercised over the handful of killings of young black men by police each year when so many thousands of are killed by other young black men. Chicagoans didn’t march en masse to protest the 64 -- that’s not a typo -- shootings in their city over Memorial Day weekend. Federal authorities didn’t rush in to investigate. Don’t those lives matter too?

It’s a reasonable question and deserves a reasonable answer.

Let me suggest two explanations. Neither is entirely satisfactory, but each, I think, points in the right direction.

The first is history. For hundreds of years, the U.S. has in large part been defined by the sharp divide between black and white. I do not speak here of statistics, although they obviously matter. I have in mind, rather, the vividness of a past in which the violence of the dominant race was simply part of the American background. My great-grandmother described the aftermath of the Atlanta riots of 1906, in which white mobs attacked the businesses and homes of the city’s burgeoning black middle class:

“In a moment our sense of security was gone, and we had to realize that we, as colored people, had really no rights as citizens whatsoever. It left us very empty, for we knew in that hour that all for which we had labored and sacrificed belonged not to us but to a ruthless mob.”
Such events are living memories for many African Americans, and, for the rest, are handed down, as stories and warnings, from generation to generation.

The alarming rate of black-on-black crime threatens our concrete security. The killing of blacks by whites, particularly police, touches something more elemental, a sense of fragility within a race still struggling to throw off the burdens, both psychic and economic, of the nation’s tortured history.

That some of the shootings may turn out to be justified is thus very much beside the point. Each episode constitutes a reminder of how the race itself remains but delicately tethered to the mainstream of American life. The lives of blacks killed by blacks are no less precious than those of blacks killed by whites; but the symbolism, the relationship of image to history, is different."

 

[Gameface]

Why do we treat the Constitution as if it's the holiest of holies?

I used that because I'm guessing he's all about the second amendment and doesn't know that 4, 5, 6, 7 and 8 protect the rights of the accused. Most of the beloved bill of rights is about protecting people from our criminal justice system.

 

[Red]

Joe Bagadonuts wrote:


Originally Posted by Red
"And does it say anything at all that the police then spent 15 minutes consoling the officer, and not one minute attending to a dying man?"


I agree with all of the rest of your post, but I'm curious what your evidence is for the statement above. The evidence I've seen only shows me that the cop who fired the shots did not immediately attend to the dying man. I do not know for certain what happened to the dying man after his girlfriend was pulled from the car.
---------

My apologies for not answering your question till now. My only evidence is the female passenger's statement. I believe it was toward the end of her ~10 minute video, though it might have been the next day. She stated the cops spent their time consoling the cop who fired the shots, and no time checking on the driver.

 

[♪alt13]

Do you always make things up like this?

Which part do you think is made up?

 

[Red]

Here's one instance of the license plate information directly from the Snopes report that you posted.

The Snopes report is referring there to trying to establish if the police scan audio is authentic. Hence they are saying that the license plate identified in the scan is the same as Castile's plate during the traffic stop. They are using that to help confirm that the police scan is genuine. They are not saying it is the same license plate as the armed robbery two days earlier.

The excerpt from Snopes:

"Although the KARE report noted that the audio was provided by a viewer and had not been authenticated by officials, the license plate number mentioned in the audio did match Castile's car, and an alert had been issued about an armed robbery that occurred a few days before the shooting."

It's a little confusing but they are not saying Castile's plate is the same as any plate that was noted during the robbery. In fact, they don't actually say if a plate was noted during that robbery. They are saying what is said about the plate in the scan conforms to what Castile's plate actually was.

 

[The Midnight]

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/arti...are-police-shootings-and-black-on-black-crime

"Critics often ask why African-Americans become so exercised over the handful of killings of young black men by police each year when so many thousands of are killed by other young black men. Chicagoans didn’t march en masse to protest the 64 -- that’s not a typo -- shootings in their city over Memorial Day weekend. Federal authorities didn’t rush in to investigate. Don’t those lives matter too?

It’s a reasonable question and deserves a reasonable answer.

Let me suggest two explanations. Neither is entirely satisfactory, but each, I think, points in the right direction.

The first is history. For hundreds of years, the U.S. has in large part been defined by the sharp divide between black and white. I do not speak here of statistics, although they obviously matter. I have in mind, rather, the vividness of a past in which the violence of the dominant race was simply part of the American background. My great-grandmother described the aftermath of the Atlanta riots of 1906, in which white mobs attacked the businesses and homes of the city’s burgeoning black middle class:

“In a moment our sense of security was gone, and we had to realize that we, as colored people, had really no rights as citizens whatsoever. It left us very empty, for we knew in that hour that all for which we had labored and sacrificed belonged not to us but to a ruthless mob.”
Such events are living memories for many African Americans, and, for the rest, are handed down, as stories and warnings, from generation to generation.

The alarming rate of black-on-black crime threatens our concrete security. The killing of blacks by whites, particularly police, touches something more elemental, a sense of fragility within a race still struggling to throw off the burdens, both psychic and economic, of the nation’s tortured history.

That some of the shootings may turn out to be justified is thus very much beside the point. Each episode constitutes a reminder of how the race itself remains but delicately tethered to the mainstream of American life. The lives of blacks killed by blacks are no less precious than those of blacks killed by whites; but the symbolism, the relationship of image to history, is different."

GREAT article.

 

[Red]

Interesting development in the Baton Rouge shooting:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/artic...phone-my-surveillance-video-locked-me-up.html

"BATON ROUGE, Louisiana — The owner of the convenience store where Alton Sterling was killed last week by cops alleges in a lawsuit that police stole surveillance video from his shop, confiscated his cell phone, and locked him inside a car for the next four hours.

Abdullah Muhlafi, proprietor of the Triple S Mart, saw police confront and kill Sterling who was selling CDs with his permission in the front parking lot last Tuesday night. Muhlafi recorded part of the incident in footage he gave The Daily Beast last week that shows Sterling did not have a weapon in his hand when Officer Howie Lake shouted “gun!” and Officer Blane Salamoni fired six shots into his chest.

Muflahi claims in a lawsuit filed Monday in Baton Rouge district court that after Salamoni killed Sterling, he immediately told responding officers Lt. Robert Cook and Officer Timothy Ballard to confiscate the “entire store security system” and detain him.

 

[Boris]

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/arti...are-police-shootings-and-black-on-black-crime

"Critics often ask why African-Americans become so exercised over the handful of killings of young black men by police each year when so many thousands of are killed by other young black men. Chicagoans didn’t march en masse to protest the 64 -- that’s not a typo -- shootings in their city over Memorial Day weekend. Federal authorities didn’t rush in to investigate. Don’t those lives matter too?

It’s a reasonable question and deserves a reasonable answer.

Let me suggest two explanations. Neither is entirely satisfactory, but each, I think, points in the right direction.

The first is history. For hundreds of years, the U.S. has in large part been defined by the sharp divide between black and white. I do not speak here of statistics, although they obviously matter. I have in mind, rather, the vividness of a past in which the violence of the dominant race was simply part of the American background. My great-grandmother described the aftermath of the Atlanta riots of 1906, in which white mobs attacked the businesses and homes of the city’s burgeoning black middle class:

“In a moment our sense of security was gone, and we had to realize that we, as colored people, had really no rights as citizens whatsoever. It left us very empty, for we knew in that hour that all for which we had labored and sacrificed belonged not to us but to a ruthless mob.”
Such events are living memories for many African Americans, and, for the rest, are handed down, as stories and warnings, from generation to generation.

The alarming rate of black-on-black crime threatens our concrete security. The killing of blacks by whites, particularly police, touches something more elemental, a sense of fragility within a race still struggling to throw off the burdens, both psychic and economic, of the nation’s tortured history.

That some of the shootings may turn out to be justified is thus very much beside the point. Each episode constitutes a reminder of how the race itself remains but delicately tethered to the mainstream of American life. The lives of blacks killed by blacks are no less precious than those of blacks killed by whites; but the symbolism, the relationship of image to history, is different."

That is a biased person. Some shootings happen to be justified? Tell me when the last one was not. Even if you happen to find a single one tell me what percent are not.

 

[Boris]

Interesting development in the Baton Rouge shooting:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/artic...phone-my-surveillance-video-locked-me-up.html

"BATON ROUGE, Louisiana — The owner of the convenience store where Alton Sterling was killed last week by cops alleges in a lawsuit that police stole surveillance video from his shop, confiscated his cell phone, and locked him inside a car for the next four hours.

Abdullah Muhlafi, proprietor of the Triple S Mart, saw police confront and kill Sterling who was selling CDs with his permission in the front parking lot last Tuesday night. Muhlafi recorded part of the incident in footage he gave The Daily Beast last week that shows Sterling did not have a weapon in his hand when Officer Howie Lake shouted “gun!” and Officer Blane Salamoni fired six shots into his chest.

Muflahi claims in a lawsuit filed Monday in Baton Rouge district court that after Salamoni killed Sterling, he immediately told responding officers Lt. Robert Cook and Officer Timothy Ballard to confiscate the “entire store security system” and detain him.

Meh. Taking evidence is part of the process. It is in the evidence locker an available to Obamas Feds.

 

[babe]

Meh. Taking evidence is part of the process. It is in the evidence locker an available to Obamas Feds.

what are you?

Clearly, the implications of the store owners' assertion put this into an unlawful police event. Police in this country are sometimes called to enforce civil code violations where selling merchandise on the street is a law topic. Brick and Mortar store owners and employees, and general citizens will call the cops when they see someone selling stuff. This CD sales operation was on private property, and therefore not on public property where the police can lawfully go without a warrant or reasonable cause.

Clearly, the owner of the property gave permission, and clearly the confiscation of the surveillance equipment was a further illegal action by the police, and in violation of laws pertaining to people's rights to record events on their own property.

Not to mention the possible destruction of evidence.

Stop being a complete ***, Boris.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

The Snopes report is referring there to trying to establish if the police scan audio is authentic. Hence they are saying that the license plate identified in the scan is the same as Castile's plate during the traffic stop. They are using that to help confirm that the police scan is genuine. They are not saying it is the same license plate as the armed robbery two days earlier.

The excerpt from Snopes:

"Although the KARE report noted that the audio was provided by a viewer and had not been authenticated by officials, the license plate number mentioned in the audio did match Castile's car, and an alert had been issued about an armed robbery that occurred a few days before the shooting."

It's a little confusing but they are not saying Castile's plate is the same as any plate that was noted during the robbery. In fact, they don't actually say if a plate was noted during that robbery. They are saying what is said about the plate in the scan conforms to what Castile's plate actually was.

Yep. My bad.

 

[The Midnight]

So I hear on the news that Barak Obama has cut short his Spain trip to come back and speak at the dead cop's memorial....



I wonder if he'll speak at the funerals of Sterling and Castile, the 2 controversial black victims?

 

[The Midnight]

[tweet]752827860470095873[/tweet]

The violence in Dallas last week is intensifying worries in Cleveland about visitors and protesters taking firearms downtown during the Republican National Convention, where thousands of people plan to demonstrate.

Ohio’s open-carry laws mean that those who legally own guns can take them into the 1.7-square-mile area where many of the events and protests connected to the Republican convention will be held next week. Beginning Sunday, protesters are expected to flood into the city, with causes ranging from white supremacy to Palestinian rights.

“Obviously, everybody is on edge after Dallas,” Brian Kazy, a member of the Cleveland City Council and its Safety Committee, said in an interview Sunday evening.

Mr. Kazy said he had never been concerned about Ohio’s open-carry laws. But then Micah Johnson, an African-American sniper said to be determined to murder white police officers, went on a rampage in Texas, which also has open-carry laws.

“If you had some mass confusion, even if you had a civilian who was carrying who would attempt to help out, I think the mentality of any law enforcement officer would see an individual with a gun, would see an individual possibly shoot and would react to that,” he said.

Cleveland officials are promising increased security during the Republican gathering, with resources from city, state and federal authorities. And within the convention area, the Secret Service will set up a smaller perimeter near the Quicken Loans Arena that will have stricter security and prohibit guns. Delegates to the convention, for example, will not be able to take their guns onto the convention floor.

However, given the recent tumult around the country, some leaders are anxious that the environment could turn dangerous. One group made up of current and former members of the military called the Oath Keepers, who have shown up at other tense events heavily armed, say they again plan to carry weapons into Cleveland.

Stephen Loomis, president of the Cleveland Police Patrolmen’s Association, said he strongly supported citizens’ rights to bear arms, but he is urging people not to take their guns anywhere near Cleveland’s downtown during the convention.

“The last thing in the world we need is anybody walking around here with AR-15s strapped to their back,” he said. “And the absolute tragedy in Dallas is proof positive that we just cannot allow that to happen. I would really just beg these folks, just leave your guns at home. Come, say whatever it is that you want to say, make whatever point it is that you want to make, but it’s going to be very, very difficult to deal with the R.N.C. as it is.”

He added that officers were already in a “heightened state” because of the passions generated by the presumptive Republican nominee, Donald J. Trump, on both sides and the security challenges as thousands of delegates fill the city.

Eric Pucillo, the vice president of Ohio Carry, a gun rights group based in Kent, Ohio, said he understood Mr. Loomis’s concerns, but stressed that people could not be legally prevented from carrying their guns downtown.

Convention planners and city officials emphasize that they are prepared for the Republican gathering and the crowds it will attract.

The Cleveland police chief said Friday that after the Dallas shootings the city would be changing its security plans but did not go into detail. Dan Williams, a spokesman for Mayor Frank G. Jackson, also declined to describe how Dallas had reshaped the city’s security plans, or whether officials were concerned about the state’s gun laws.

“We are going to follow the law and the law is the law period,” Mr. Williams said. “We believe that we are prepared.”

 

[Red]

That is a biased person. Some shootings happen to be justified? Tell me when the last one was not. Even if you happen to find a single one tell me what percent are not.

"..... there are reasons for the community’s more visceral response to an interracial shooting -- especially when the killer is a police officer. Whether or not one agrees with the reasons, it’s important to know what they are."

For someone who you see as biased, he sure has an even handed way with words.

"What happens next is predictable. Liberals will blame institutional racism. Conservatives will blame an aberrant officer. Libertarians will blame the violent culture of law enforcement. And black Americans will be left wondering whether the pain of history will ever pass."

And Boris will invent evidence that doesn't exist, like head shots that never happened, and the victim holding a gun. Or third videos that only he has seen. The one he says includes audio(the two released videos both include audio). It seems Boris will invent anything in order to support his own bias. But, that too is very predictable.

BTW, sounds like the police have that third video.

(BTW, you could defend your point of view while being honest about it at the same time. Give it a try some time. It will do wonders for your credibility, if it isn't too late by now.)

 

[fishonjazz]

[tweet]752827860470095873[/tweet]

I hope people leave their guns at home in Cleveland.

 

[Stoked]

That is a biased person. Some shootings happen to be justified? Tell me when the last one was not. Even if you happen to find a single one tell me what percent are not.

So if some are not than that would mean that some are. Glad you agree with him.

S. Carolina and New York jump to the front of my mind.

 

[Boris]

"..... there are reasons for the community’s more visceral response to an interracial shooting -- especially when the killer is a police officer. Whether or not one agrees with the reasons, it’s important to know what they are."

For someone who you see as biased, he sure has an even handed way with words.

"What happens next is predictable. Liberals will blame institutional racism. Conservatives will blame an aberrant officer. Libertarians will blame the violent culture of law enforcement. And black Americans will be left wondering whether the pain of history will ever pass."

And Boris will invent evidence that doesn't exist, like head shots that never happened, and the victim holding a gun. Or third videos that only he has seen. The one he says includes audio(the two released videos both include audio). It seems Boris will invent anything in order to support his own bias. But, that too is very predictable.

BTW, sounds like the police have that third video.

(BTW, you could defend your point of view while being honest about it at the same time. Give it a try some time. It will do wonders for your credibility, if it isn't too late by now.)

Nice job avoiding the question and trying to make it about me instead the subject at hand. I repeat my question. When was the last unjustified police shooting. What percent of them are found unjust?

 

[Gameface]

Nice job avoiding the question and trying to make it about me instead the subject at hand. I repeat my question. When was the last unjustified police shooting. What percent of them are found unjust?

There is a big difference between an unjust shooting and one that means the police officer is guilty of a crime. Police are pretty well protected so long as it appears they acted in good faith.

 

[Boris]

There is a big difference between an unjust shooting and one that means the police officer is guilty of a crime. Police are pretty well protected so long as it appears they acted in good faith.

That is a far leap but I will humor your notion. Show me how many cases police acted in good faith but were unjustified. An please tell me you do not believe the Saratoga Springs execution is one of them.

 

[Gameface]

That is a far leap but I will humor your notion. Show me how many cases police acted in good faith but were unjustified. An please tell me you do not believe the Saratoga Springs execution is one of them.

That wasn't an execution. If it was it was certainly illegal.

I have no intention in putting any effort into your question.