fishonjazz
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- Thread starter LoPo
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LoPo
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If Millsap had any help in the playoffs, maybe his numbers would be better. It's amazing how we can make excuses for Hayward that we don't make for other players. It's called hypocrisy. So many times I've heard that Hayward doesn't shoot as well or do this or do that because he's lacking this or lacking that. Well, Millsap has done a whole lot with an Atlanta team that has zero true playmakers. Teague is close, but he's a shoot first pass second guy.
Through all the MJ vs LBJ debates or this guy vs that guy debates, one thing is abundantly clear - your supporting cast is so huge. Cleveland doesn't win the title without the contribution of 4th/5th option Tristan Thompson. GS won the title last year because the play of 6th man Iguodala. The Spurs win because everybody plays their role and does their job. When Korver is shut down and Horford can't shoot, the ball fell to shoot first Teague or to Millsap. You can't knock what Millsap has done in the playoffs because Favors might be completely irrelevant in the playoffs.
We don't know because he and Hayward haven't been able to lead us to the playoffs or .500 yet. Blame injuries or whatever, but if they were as good as some of you make them out to be, we would have been .500 by now. Give credit where credit is due - Millsap has been an incredible pro and is a better player right now than Favors ever has been and maybe ever will be.
fishonjazz
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First millsap was more clutch than favors. Then that was proved to be wrong.
Then the reason millsap was not more clutch than favors was because his teammates were TOO good....
But really what seperates millsap from favors is how millsap steps up in the playoffs. Now we find out that is also wrong.
Cause his teammates are not good enough.
So in the regular season the reason millsap is not more clutch than favors is because his teammates are too good. But the reason millsap does not step up his game in the playoffs is because his teammates are not good enough.
Lolololol. I'm done with this conversation.
seattlejazzfan
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You're not paying much attention to the discussion. It's okay, I forgive you.
LoPo
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What is "lol" is that you're bashing a guy's playoff numbers when comparing him to another guy who can't get his team to .500 much less the playoffs. Keep on arguing buddy. You're doing a great job.
So pretty much, Millsap's playoff numbers destroy Favors' playoff numbers.
I agree that the future financials of the team are a problem. In fact, I think the cap crunch will come much sooner than 19. Hayward will opt out next off season looking for the max. Gobert will get a max deal or near it either this off season or next. Favors needs to be restructured or just resigned in 2018, either way that's more money. Exum and Hood will both be up for extensions in the 2018 off season. Burks is making 10-11 mill per until 2019. Hill may be resigned as well. A move definitely needs to be made. Because keeping all these guys would basically mean we are locked in to using this group going forward. We would have little wiggle room. Which means this group would need to be ready for a title run. But I think we are a go-to scorer away still. Hayward is the one they need to move. Rudy is a top 5 center in this league going forward. Favors is a solid player on a solid deal. I believe in Exum's growth going forward. Hood has shown what he can do, and given the opportunity he may develop into a similar player to Hayward. As much as I like Gordo, I feel that resigning him to the max would be a deathnail to our rebuild. The team just isn't there yet. They are behind him and would never catch up if we didn't have roster flexibility to find that go-to scorer. I don't see this core ever winning a title with Gordo on a max contract. It would never happen.
Are someone REALLY comparing Favors to a All Star? Are someone REALLY comparing a go to guy clutch stats to a guy who sinks out of existence in "The Clutch"?
My god what a good stance to take. Favors is better in clutch because HE NEVER SHOOTS IN CLUTCH ON ISO ONLY GETS CLEAN UP BUCKETS! Man, I bet Millsap would love to play on a losing team an pat stats like that instead of LEADING a contender.
Favors >>>>>>>Milsap
My god what a good stance to take. Favors is better in clutch because HE NEVER SHOOTS IN CLUTCH ON ISO ONLY GETS CLEAN UP BUCKETS! Man, I bet Millsap would love to play on a losing team an pat stats like that instead of LEADING a contender.
Favors >>>>>>>Milsap
LoPo
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I seriously have my doubts. Hayward is a very good player, but paying him over $20-25 just seems ludicrous.
I'm a huge fan of Lyles. I think he's built to be a bigger Millsap. He's ahead of Millsap in every way at the same age. I love the idea of sacrificing Favors for Millsap and Korver for the "win now" "support Korver" approach but also prepare for our financial future built around Lyles over near max Favors.
I agree on Hayward. Like I said I just don't see us winning titles with him on the max.
I still have to agree to disagree on the Millsap/Korver trade. I just don't see where we benefit. We would be a 5-8 seed with or without that trade if we were healthy. But we wouldn't win anything now. We would just hurt our future. I like Lyles but we have a small sample size. Let's see if he continues his growth next year before we call him the future. He needs to get much better defensively and on the glass.
I love this logic. Guess we can confirm that Paul Millsap > Anthony Davis as well.
LoPo
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Cause that's logical. Because Millsap and Favors have both been named a top 5 type NBA talent. Oh wait, that's Anthony Davis.
The point made was that Millsap and Favors have similar season numbers and Millsap's season numbers went down some during the playoffs. So the "like for like" argument was being made and then they knocked Millsap because of playoff numbers. I guess the same guy calls Love crap because of his numbers in the Finals.
Today, Millsap is a better player. If you polled every GM in the league, 25+ would take Millsap for the 2016-17 season.
Joe Bagadonuts
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If I ever need a filibuster for some reason I'm hiring LoPo. Dude doesn't care whether he's made his point or not. He just keeps making it again and again and again and again... If someone disputes his claim with facts he simply makes his point again and again and again and again... If someone bows out of the discussion because they've made their point LoPo disputes again and again and again and again and again... Nine pages of this stuff? Enough already. It's literally the worst trade idea I've seen all summer (and I've seen some stinkers) but it's well on its way to becoming the longest thread.
mdalby
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LoPo = Often Wrong, but never in doubt. LoPo, there is a difference between confidence and competence.
LoPo
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First off, Paul spent 3 years in college leading the NCAA in rebounds during that span. Favors has the luxury of 2-3 more years of pro ball than Millsap. Maybe the issue is that we rolled out the red carpet for Favors yet Millsap had to earn his spot behind Boozer, AK and Okur. Millsap was on playoff teams and played very well despite our coaching staff not giving him confidence through consistent roles.
Favors' stats mean nothing because they aren't eye popping and they haven't taken us anywhere. There are a ton of players who can get stats. You want the players who can take you to the next level. I don't want Favors to be Zach Randolph. I want him to be something better. As of now, he's not even Randolph in terms of stats, influence or marginal playoff success.
LoPo
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You're wrong Joey
LoPo
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I definitely can be wrong. For all I know, Hayward stays and evolves into the star we need to lead us to greater things. And Favors evolves into a player who can share the court perfectly with Gobert.
I'm not going to run from my words. I'll be around and if I'm wrong, I'll own my mistakes.
I'll let this go now, but I do think Millsap and Korver make a ton of sense for us. Good luck to DL as he preps for free agency.
Yep, not like Millsap had multiple all stars around him to help him get to the playoffs. Swap favors onto Atlanta and they still make the playoffs and still probably get swept by Cleveland. Although favors would have been a tough match for Cleveland and provided more rim protection so maybe they win one game. Favors team was the second youngest in the NBA and had the second most amount of time missed due to injuries. Winning is about your team not just one player.
Not sure why I am arguing with this troll thread but hey it's the off season.
Remember when this guy said Millsap went toe to toe with LeBron. Still making me chuckle.
Sent from my Nexus 5X using JazzFanz mobile app
Not sure why I am arguing with this troll thread but hey it's the off season.
Remember when this guy said Millsap went toe to toe with LeBron. Still making me chuckle.
Sent from my Nexus 5X using JazzFanz mobile app
fishonjazz
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Mods, please change thread title to "bad trade idea"
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