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Historically Great Offense

fishonjazz said:
Let me clarify. They are really really good so they scare me. But they would allow rudy to play in the paint. So we could at least see what the jazz can do against them with our normal gameplan. Maybe we win and maybe we lose. Same goes for the bucks.

What scares me most is a team forcing rudy out of the paint. I dont want to see teams that can and will do that. I dont think the suns (because of ayton) or bucks (because of giannis) are teams that will force us to change everything we do.


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I get that. But the top-line summary of why the Suns are a problem for us needs to be about their offense versus our defense: even with Rudy in the paint, they are perfectly build to expose our biggest weaknesses. That’s my point: they can go toe to toe with our best punch and hit us back harder.
 
fishonjazz said:
Let me clarify. They are really really good so they scare me. But they would allow rudy to play in the paint. So we could at least see what the jazz can do against them with our normal gameplan. Maybe we win and maybe we lose. Same goes for the bucks.

What scares me most is a team forcing rudy out of the paint. I dont want to see teams that can and will do that. I dont think the suns (because of ayton) or bucks (because of giannis) are teams that will force us to change everything we do.


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While they won’t take him “out of the paint,” per se, CP will take him out of position where he can’t grab the rebound and can’t protect the lob. The only answer is if Rudy Gay can rotate to box out the lob and grab the rebound (though CP seems to hit over Rudy just fine). Even if this scenario were effective, it would require us to deploy it in the clutch (i.e. Gay closes). I don’t have much confidence in Quin watching this and responding. This far in these situations the approach has been “when all else fails, all else harder.”
 
NAOS said:
I get that. But the top-line summary of why the Suns are a problem for us needs to be about their offense versus our defense: even with Rudy in the paint, they are perfectly build to expose our biggest weaknesses. That’s my point: they can go toe to toe with our best punch and hit us back harder.
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Our offense punches pretty dang hard too. Kinda historically hard. I think we are top 3 in offense and top 3 in defense. When we are allowed to play our game we are awesome.
 
To put it another way, super great teams like the suns and bucks, who have guys who cant shoot threes that rudy can guard, can definitely beat us. But I look forward to the matchup and seeing who the better team is. A team like the warriors, or the clippers last year, is a series that I dont look forward to cause I dont have fun watching the jazz have no idea what to do on the court.
 
There was a stretch last year, I think maybe around 60-ish% of the way through, where we had these historic numbers. Can't remember what it was. Perhaps it was differential. Those ended up tanking. Perhaps not tanking, but they weren't relevant by season end. Part of that was Donovan and Conley missing a lot of the end of the season, but does anyone remember which numbers it were that were hyped?
 
infection said:
There was a stretch last year, I think maybe around 60-ish% of the way through, where we had these historic numbers. Can't remember what it was. Perhaps it was differential. Those ended up tanking. Perhaps not tanking, but they weren't relevant by season end. Part of that was Donovan and Conley missing a lot of the end of the season, but does anyone remember which numbers it were that were hyped?
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Not sure if this was exactly what you were talking about, but the Jazz at some point the Jazz had the best net rating (no garbage time) since sites started recording those things….the last 15 years or so. They also held the #1 offense and defense spot at different times in the year.

Jazz have the same super insane net rating this year. It’s just not talked about as much because the Warriors have the same and have a better record. It’s wayyyy tilted towards the offense this year though.
 
fishonjazz said:
To put it another way, super great teams like the suns and bucks, who have guys who cant shoot threes that rudy can guard, can definitely beat us. But I look forward to the matchup and seeing who the better team is. A team like the warriors, or the clippers last year, is a series that I dont look forward to cause I dont have fun watching the jazz have no idea what to do on the court.
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The Suns are the most deadly team in the league at the shots we conceded. Ayton allows Gobert to stay in the paint, but he also occupies Gobert super well. I actually think it’s harder for him to guard a good rolling big man than it is to guard a stretch 5.

The Clippers didn’t start beating us until they stopped running PnR at Rudy. Even with a spaced plot Rudy could keep it contained by switching or keeping everything in front. It was more difficult for him to defend when Zubac was in the game because the space between the two players was greater. A deadly mid range shooter combined with a good rim running big is tough to stop. CP3 is one of the best all time in that situation and Booker is great as well.

It doesn’t make PHX impossible to beat, but that’s a tough matchup because their offense is designed to score against our type of defense.

In general, however, I think PHX’s greatest strength is just how damn good they are in the clutch. I think GSW, UTA, MIL, and maybe BKN are better teams than PHX. But if PHX can keep it close they are the best on the league in the clutch.
 
LogGrad98 said:
So they did a historic rim-job? Wow.
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They attack the rim like it has never been attacked before.

So unless you want massive rim pressure you better be ready to protect your rim when the Jazz are in town.
 
Gameface said:
They attack the rim like it has never been attacked before.

So unless you want massive rim pressure you better be ready to protect your rim when the Jazz are in town.
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The personification of the Utah Jazz is Wilt Chamberlain.
 
Wilt Was certainly prolific. But he was nothing compared to the Cherokee chief who apparently impregnated every Civil War widow he could find from Maine to the Wasatch Front in the late 1860s.
 
infection said:
There was a stretch last year, I think maybe around 60-ish% of the way through, where we had these historic numbers. Can't remember what it was. Perhaps it was differential. Those ended up tanking. Perhaps not tanking, but they weren't relevant by season end. Part of that was Donovan and Conley missing a lot of the end of the season, but does anyone remember which numbers it were that were hyped?
Click to expand...

Jazz had a historic Net Rating, slightly better than the 2014 Spurs that won a title.
 
KqWIN said:
The Suns are the most deadly team in the league at the shots we conceded. Ayton allows Gobert to stay in the paint, but he also occupies Gobert super well. I actually think it’s harder for him to guard a good rolling big man than it is to guard a stretch 5.

The Clippers didn’t start beating us until they stopped running PnR at Rudy. Even with a spaced plot Rudy could keep it contained by switching or keeping everything in front. It was more difficult for him to defend when Zubac was in the game because the space between the two players was greater. A deadly mid range shooter combined with a good rim running big is tough to stop. CP3 is one of the best all time in that situation and Booker is great as well.

It doesn’t make PHX impossible to beat, but that’s a tough matchup because their offense is designed to score against our type of defense.

In general, however, I think PHX’s greatest strength is just how damn good they are in the clutch. I think GSW, UTA, MIL, and maybe BKN are better teams than PHX. But if PHX can keep it close they are the best on the league in the clutch.
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It seems as though the Jazz could trap CP the way they do Doncic and disrupt their pick-and-roll before they get set. Make some of their other offensive players create for themselves. Mostly, they're spot-up shooters. CP is really the head of the snake for them.

Also, I have a hard time buying into the Suns' bench. Cam Payne, Cam Johnson, Elfrid Payton, Landry Shamet, Javale McGee--it just doesn't seem that credible to me.
 
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