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How strong is your support for Quin Snyder?

How strong is your support for Quin?

  • Very strong

    Votes: 15 23.1%

  • Strong

    Votes: 20 30.8%

  • Ok with it

    Votes: 18 27.7%

  • Weak

    Votes: 10 15.4%

  • Very weak

    Votes: 2 3.1%
  • Total voters
    65
jope said:
People keep saying that we are just missing open shots, but are ill-informed. as of a few days ago, Jazz take the 4th most "very-tight" contested shots in the league, and take the 7th fewest "wide open" shots in the league. it isnt a matter of just missing open looks. comparatively, there arent many open looks to miss.
Click to expand...

https://stats.nba.com/league/team/s...=10.0&CloseDefDistRange=0-2 Feet - Very Tight

We are 5th in "very-tight" shots outside 10 feet, but the difference between teams isnt high.

https://stats.nba.com/league/player...=10.0&CloseDefDistRange=0-2 Feet - Very Tight

You also have to factor in we have guys like Rodney Hood who takes "very tight" midrange shots frequently because of his ability to rise over smaller guards in the midrange.

https://stats.nba.com/league/team/s...ange=>=10.0&CloseDefDistRange=4-6 Feet - Open

We are 12th in open shots, which is the stat I put the highest weight in. NBA.com defines "wide open" as having 6+ of space. Having that much space might be a bigger sign that your offense is terrible and your players are getting sagged off of. I'm not concluding that is for certain, but two of the top teams in "wide open shots" are Brooklyn and Philly. There are also great teams who have a large % of these shots, but using the data to prove "good" offense or "bad" offense isnt correct.


https://stats.nba.com/league/team/s...=>=10.0&CloseDefDistRange=6+ Feet - Wide Open

And we arent 18th in wide open shots, not 7th fewest (or 23rd since Jope wants to "glass half empty" everything).

*Please provide links when you try to cite stats*
 
https://stats.nba.com/league/team/s...=10.0&CloseDefDistRange=0-2 Feet - Very Tight

Also when you look at the stats, we are actually a top 3 team in %EFG for both tight and very tight shots. The fact is we have a lot of player who excel at these kind of shots. Our problem currently is just not having a PG, missing one of our most versatile defenders and interior scorers, and not having the added firepower of Burks. That and having to play dudes like Mack, Johnson, and Ingles too many minutes.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
https://stats.nba.com/league/team/s...=10.0&CloseDefDistRange=0-2 Feet - Very Tight

We are 5th in "very-tight" shots outside 10 feet, but the difference between teams isnt high.

https://stats.nba.com/league/player...=10.0&CloseDefDistRange=0-2 Feet - Very Tight

You also have to factor in we have guys like Rodney Hood who takes "very tight" midrange shots frequently because of his ability to rise over smaller guards in the midrange.

https://stats.nba.com/league/team/s...ange=>=10.0&CloseDefDistRange=4-6 Feet - Open

We are 12th in open shots, which is the stat I put the highest weight in. NBA.com defines "wide open" as having 6+ of space. Having that much space might be a bigger sign that your offense is terrible and your players are getting sagged off of. I'm not concluding that is for certain, but two of the top teams in "wide open shots" are Brooklyn and Philly. There are also great teams who have a large % of these shots, but using the data to prove "good" offense or "bad" offense isnt correct.


https://stats.nba.com/league/team/s...=>=10.0&CloseDefDistRange=6+ Feet - Wide Open

And we arent 18th in wide open shots, not 7th fewest (or 23rd since Jope wants to "glass half empty" everything).

*Please provide links when you try to cite stats*
Click to expand...

Those stats were from 2 games ago and of course are subject to change as noted in my post.

And I don't have all day to look at distance or gap breakdowns, i took the numbers in their entirety. some of us have jobs and contribute to society beyond 50,000+ contrarion posts on a forum.

But you gotta get that self worth from somewhere cy. :)
 
JGolds said:
I hear what you are saying, and there is ball movement. However, its not good ball movement.It looks like a play/drill you do in middle school... (Pass the ball 5 times then jack up a low percentage shot)

Maybe the ball isn't bouncing utahs way and these percentages will even out eventually. Currently though, it is Ugly basketball. Hopefully we see change. seeing utah going into to 4th with 12 assist is not good active basketball. Everyone was standing watching the other guy the last 2 games.
Click to expand...

I've been leading that ugly charge from the get go. All I'm saying so far this year is it looks better and more dynamic.

JGolds said:
I would like to see more cuts. the swing cut baseline to baseline, simplest cut in basketball, but it causes a lot of movement and makes the other team have to communicate instead of just sitting back and watching the jazz play hot potato till the timer runs out and we shoot a low percentage mid-range shot or a 27 footer.
Click to expand...

I'm not a fan of Sloan's Floppy in modern NBA. It would have to be modified to get three pointers or layups. Miami did a bit of that with the big 3.

FWIW, Quin is using the bigs for a lot more misdirection play setting. I like watching Gobert on play initiation.
 
jope said:
Those stats were from 2 games ago and of course are subject to change as noted in my post.

And I don't have all day to look at distance or gap breakdowns, i took the numbers in their entirety. some of us have jobs and contribute to society beyond 50,000+ contrarion posts on a forum.

But you gotta get that self worth from somewhere cy. :)
Click to expand...

You just spent 10-20 minutes arguing with me and citing stats. But you cant look them up or think about them in any objective way or link them? Ok.

You also realize you are being the contrarian one here, right? You are the guy who is going against the majority who still support Quin.
 
JGolds said:
I hear what you are saying, and there is ball movement. However, its not good ball movement.It looks like a play/drill you do in middle school... (Pass the ball 5 times then jack up a low percentage shot)

Maybe the ball isn't bouncing utahs way and these percentages will even out eventually. Currently though, it is Ugly basketball. Hopefully we see change. seeing utah going into to 4th with 12 assist is not good active basketball. Everyone was standing watching the other guy the last 2 games.

I would like to see more cuts. the swing cut baseline to baseline, simplest cut in basketball, but it causes a lot of movement and makes the other team have to communicate instead of just sitting back and watching the jazz play hot potato till the timer runs out and we shoot a low percentage mid-range shot or a 27 footer.
Click to expand...

A lot of it still feels like the ball is hitting Mack/Exum and those two just arent good in half-court offense.
 
jope said:
People keep saying that we are just missing open shots, but are ill-informed. as of a few days ago, Jazz take the 4th most "very-tight" contested shots in the league, and take the 7th fewest "wide open" shots in the league. it isnt a matter of just missing open looks. comparatively, there arent many open looks to miss.
Click to expand...

I don't think your analysis is correct either. The Jazz are very high in "very-tight" shots as you said, but it's such a low percentage of the offense to begin with. The difference between last and first in frequency is just 3%. If you look at the breakdown of who's taking the shots, it's basically just Rodney Hood. No one on the team has taken more than 5 contested jumpers other than him, and it makes sense because we all know that rising over defenders and shooting is part of Hood's game.

The Jazz are middle of the pack in every other defender distance, so I don't think it's fair to say that the Jazz are taking too many contested shots or not getting enough open looks. What is notable is that the Jazz are 3rd to last in wide open 3's, and I think that's what people are complaining about.
 
No matter what the system, our guys have not played well overall lately(poor shooting is a big part of it), and it's tough to say that is Quin's fault. But ever since he benched Rudy against Memphis we have lacked a solid effort overall. It's been obvious. Couple that with sticking with Diaw and Mack when they were atrocious and Quin has screwed the pooch lately. Quin is responsible for keeping guys fired up and how can a guy who looks like he is in the midst of the worlds biggest hangover create that spark? Well, he hasn't. But who knows, maybe Quin is suffering from insomnia. Seriously.
 
str8line said:
No matter what the system our guys have not played well overall lately(poor shooting is a big part of it), and it's tough to say that it's Quin's fault. But ever since he benched Rudy against Memphis we have lacked a solid effort overall. It's been obvious. Couple that with sticking with Diaw and Mack when they were atrocious and Quin has screwed the pooch lately. Quin is responsible for keeping guys fired up and how can a guy who looks like he is in the midst of the worlds biggest hangover create that spark? Well, he hasn't. But who knows, maybe Quin is suffering from insomnia. Seriously.
Click to expand...

Yes. All people seem to think about is offense, offense, offense...The problem I've had Quin hasn't been his offense, it's the effort his team plays with and his rotational/in game decision making. The team needs to play hard regardless of who's available and that just isn't the case.
 
KqWIN said:
I don't think your analysis is correct either. The Jazz are very high in "very-tight" shots as you said, but it's such a low percentage of the offense to begin with. The difference between last and first in frequency is just 3%. If you look at the breakdown of who's taking the shots, it's basically just Rodney Hood. No one on the team has taken more than 5 contested jumpers other than him, and it makes sense because we all know that rising over defenders and shooting is part of Hood's game.

The Jazz are middle of the pack in every other defender distance, so I don't think it's fair to say that the Jazz are taking too many contested shots or not getting enough open looks. What is notable is that the Jazz are 3rd to last in wide open 3's, and I think that's what people are complaining about.
Click to expand...

I didn't claim to have analyzed anything, just presented the numbers as were available a few days ago. Which by the way overall did show exactly what i said they showed.

Anywho, i seems all is well and good with everyone i guess, our offense is the best it could possibly be, and quins smooth talking is worth more than results. Once we get Derrick and hill back our offense will magically stop stagnating with a pointless snails pace and guys will hit the shots theyve been missing for 3 years now.

Its blasphemous to question leadership, and stupid to expect anything more than mediocrity.

Got it.
 
I'm still a big Quin believer, but if the offense continues to sputter he needs to tweak it to conform better to his personnel. He does seem to have a shorter leash on his rotations than a guy like Ty did, but that's hardly a big compliment. I'd be more impressed with him if guys like Neto and Bolomboy were given a chance some year. If they suck it up too, hey, fair enough but at least you're not going back to the same well when it's dry.

Edit: And for ****'s sake, get a ****ing technical once in a while. Stand up for your players. That's honestly one of my biggest complaints about him, that the refs can **** over the Jazz time and time again and he does nothing.
 
jope said:
I didn't claim to have analyzed anything, just presented the numbers as were available a few days ago. Which by the way overall did show exactly what i said they showed.

Anywho, i seems all is well and good with everyone i guess, our offense is the best it could possibly be, and quins smooth talking is worth more than results. Once we get Derrick and hill back our offense will magically stop stagnating with a pointless snails pace and guys will hit the shots theyve been missing for 3 years now.

Its blasphemous to question leadership, and stupid to expect anything more than mediocrity.

Got it.
Click to expand...

You can go back and look at the numbers from different days, and it doesn't seem like they were ever as you said they were...but whatever you say man. I can't even tell what your opinion is through your poor attempt sarcasm, but I hope you got satisfaction out of your sarcasm and conceit.
 
From what I have seen thus far, I believe that he still has a lot of room for improvement as far as in-game decisions go, as well as which personnel he uses in specific situations (which has obviously become increasingly vital to the success of this team).

However, I do believe that he is (& continues to be) very good at developing talent. I also believe that it would be premature to make a decision on his future as our head coach due to the consistent lack of a fully healthy roster/sufficient PG play prior to this season.

Until this year, I thought (& still think) that he was the right man for the job as player development was clearly the team's main priority at the time.. Unfortunately, possibly due to his focus on developing talent, he may have failed to develop his coaching skills enough to match & (in return) maximize the much improved abilities of this current roster.

Personally, I believe that he has earned the opportunity to display what he is able (or unable) to accomplish with a healthy team (which may never be a possibility) & more time to focus on results rather than team development. Although if he fails to lead a (reasonably) healthy roster beyond the first round of the playoffs then it is likely time to make a change.

He has undoubtedly served his purpose up to this point & deserves a great deal of credit for getting this team to where it currently is, but it is certainly possible that he has outlived his usefulness due to where this team currently is in it's developmental timeline. I certainly hope that he turns out to be the right man to take this team to that next level but management would ultimately be doing the players a disservice by allowing it's coach to prevent the team from reaching it's potential.

It appears that this team has a very bright future regardless of who is at the helm, but this decision could be the deciding factor in whether this team reaches legitimate contender status or comes up just short.
 
Cappy_Smurf said:
Utah just went 4-5 on a road trip, and are now struggling with multiple key players injured.

EVERYBODY PANIC!!!
Click to expand...

Teams beaten

Sixers
Magic
Heat
Knicks

Among all 30 teams
Sixers-Magic and Heat are bottom 6 or bottom 8 teams without any doubt.

Mediocre teams will beat at least 3 of them.
Nothing special other than the mini comeback against the knicks, which is still the knicks.
We did not play vs any solid team other than the hornets and of course we lost against hornets.
If you'll be satisfied with horrible offense, lack of effort, 7th 8th seed and an unwatchable gameplay overall, no problem.

With west being weaker than ever, I'm fed up with this mediocrity.
If you can't score or execute, fine. You have to battle, you have to defend than.
We have none of them right now.

The only real wins we got were against the Spurs and Knicks.
Lakers are not a playoff team.
The rest were all versus pathetic teams like mavs magic sixers etc.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
https://stats.nba.com/league/team/s...=10.0&CloseDefDistRange=0-2 Feet - Very Tight

Also when you look at the stats, we are actually a top 3 team in %EFG for both tight and very tight shots. The fact is we have a lot of player who excel at these kind of shots. Our problem currently is just not having a PG, missing one of our most versatile defenders and interior scorers, and not having the added firepower of Burks. That and having to play dudes like Mack, Johnson, and Ingles too many minutes.
Click to expand...

Nice work bruh. See how my homie Gobert is finishing at the rim this year on tightly contested shots? Brother is leading the league in fg% an putting on a show. I want more of that not Jope less.
 
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