Twin Towers
Well-Known Member
Hmm Okur was out. AK wasn't ready. and we played probably the best team in the past decade? But your going to blame being swept on Matthews and that we wouldn't have been with Brewer? come on
Source: Utah is Negotiating with Brewer
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Hmm Okur was out. AK wasn't ready. and we played probably the best team in the past decade? But your going to blame being swept on Matthews and that we wouldn't have been with Brewer? come on
Twin Towers
Well-Known Member
Deron is a player. Emotion is involved. He was very close friends with him........Are you really going to care that much about Deron's feelings? We were better with Matthews last year after Brewer left. Our offense was better. Defense was the same.
Whether or not Brewer comes back won't determine if Deron stays. Sorry but we are not going to sign friends just to keep a player here. Deron was mad we got nothing in return.
Addition by subtraction is never understood by players.
Deron never pouted for 2 months either. Show me the news articles if so. He complained the first week than he dropped it. Not sure where you are getting 2 months from.
Shaggy
Well-Known Member
other than the fact Al Jefferson isn't a free agent. It hasn't become official yet.
BENTLEY
Well-Known Member
I don't think Brewer got traded because he sucked. His contract was up and the Jazz would've had to give him a raise in order to keep him. They had a guy on the bench who they thought, even though he was shorter, that he could replace Brewer's production. Wes did this great. So if you can get the same production out of Wes for less than what Brewer would cost - DO IT!
But instead Wes got a huge raise from Portland. And after Brew got traded he injured his hammy - which drove his value down. So this time - if you can get the same production out of Brewer for less than Wes would cost - DO IT!
The difference between Matthews and Brewer is not much. Both have strengths and weaknesses in their respective games. But the results are pretty much the same. So be smart and get the same production (or if you believe they are not the same - they're close to it) for a much better price. It's all about value.
In spite of the similar production between these guys some have chosen to champion one and vilify the other. Let's remain objective.
But instead Wes got a huge raise from Portland. And after Brew got traded he injured his hammy - which drove his value down. So this time - if you can get the same production out of Brewer for less than Wes would cost - DO IT!
The difference between Matthews and Brewer is not much. Both have strengths and weaknesses in their respective games. But the results are pretty much the same. So be smart and get the same production (or if you believe they are not the same - they're close to it) for a much better price. It's all about value.
In spite of the similar production between these guys some have chosen to champion one and vilify the other. Let's remain objective.
billyshelby
Well-Known Member
Good post. But almost nobody can be rational about Brewer so it will mostly go unheard.
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
This basically describes my feelings towards our franchise even CONSIDERING Brewer again. And this off season in general.
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Good post. +1
You stated the reasons for the trade perfectly. The Jazz got a first round pick out of a guy they were going to lose anyway once the year ended if thing would have stayed status quoe. But because he got traded and injured he well come in a lot cheeper than if he would have stated. So we get him for cheeper and a FR pick to boot. I don't see were we lose in this.
D Will> CP3
Member
I'm with Honz. i love Brewer and his dangly arms. i really missed his dunks and reverse lay ups towards the end of last year. In a back up role you wont have to worry about his shooting. All you need him to do is play D, bring energy and finish. I'm disguisted with the Brew Crew hate
InGameStrategy
Well-Known Member
Were people outraged for our trading Brewer? Even though I was a Brewer booster for years, the emergence of Matthews with a minimally passable jump shot and defensive ability made Brewer less essential. Oh, and Utah got a first-rounder out of it, too.
That being said, I wouldn't mind having Brew back for 2 or 3 million annually, although i'd much prefer having WM. But almost $7 million per year (on average) is a steep price. If Utah can get Tolliver and Brewer for the same cost as Matthews, I think that you go for the 2 for 1 special, even if each of the two is less than the one.
The bigger hit was losing Eric Maynor. Backup PGs are a dime a dozen; good backup PGs are not.
Darkwing Duck
Well-Known Member
I'd be happy at 2 for 4, Shaggy.
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
Isn't this oversimplifying the situation? I remember many posters upset that we couldn't package him up with Boozer. I remember many posters upset that we didn't get hardly anything out of the Brewer trade. Maynor was traded for cap relief and then Brewer. Didn't that send the wrong message to the fans?
I think at the time he was traded there were still some questions about Wesley Matthews. I think at the time people were upset at the trade, we still had Korver on the team.
I just think that people don't really see Ronnie Brewer as much of a help right now since our centers are either terrible (or injured), Deron is our only outside shooter, and Boozer is gone.
I also think that Wesley's outside shooting helped show Jazz fans what can happen when we play 3 on 5 (like when Brewer and kiri played together). I for one don't believe we would have beaten Denver had Brewer been our starting SG instead of Matthews. I think that Wesley's position defense won over a lot of fans rather than Brewer's gambling defense.
I think there are also a lot of fans that just want to see change now. Even if it means tanking this next season.
I'm not necessarily taking a side, since I honestly do see positives to both sides (now). But I do believe that your post was an oversimplification of the whole situation.
I am not suggesting he will in fact turn out to be a one year wonder nor do I think there is no risk in other deals. What I am saying is that there is ADDITIONAL risk in giving Wes a contract that big, because he only had one solid year in NBA. Not even a great year, but OK, solid year.
Hopper
Banned
And here I got the impression that you had been around Jazzfanz for a spell, eh, Honzy? Who's doin it wrong? The Jazz, whatever they do, caincha see?
InGameStrategy
Well-Known Member
What risk would that be? I'd call re-signing WM as a pretty low-risk deal. He seems to be a character guy, a hard worker, an athlete, and a player with potential--just one year in the NBA. More in the mold of Millsap. AK, Boozer, Okur, and Ostertag are players who would be more at risk to dog it after they get a big contract. And they did.
Utah should let Matthews go only if they can get a viable starting SG elsewhere for less. Lots of teams play two or three or four times as much for their SG. Go through the NBA's starting lineups; maybe better players elsewhere, but 300% better? I say no.
Matthews is at around CJ's level, and it took Wes only one year, vs. 3 or 4 years for CJ. That's a positive sign to me. Right now, Matthews is probably a more focused Brewer defensively, and he has a jump shot. Any player who is respectable on both ends of the floor is worth considering.
Could someone look up team stats during the Brewer Era of the 09-10 season, and post Brewer stats? I know they wouldnt be 100% telling, but Im just interested in the teams offensive and defensive numbers.
If you really compare Wes to CJ, you have to look at his College career, because they are the same age. And Wes was not very good until his senior year. He broke through when he was 22 - same age CJ had his first solid NBA season (a year ago). So, comparison to Miles is actually right on the money. The difference is that Matthews contract is more than double than that of CJ.