what should Favors/Hayward extension be vs what will they be

[framer]

No, that means teams will even be more likely to get into a bidding war. Make an over exaggerated offer to a RFA so they Jazz have to match, especially if you are in the same conference. See Portland the past 5 years.

2 things:

1. With the new salary cap rules, Portland will not be making crazy offers. As we just witnessed this last offseason, you want to extremely overpay for an RFA, you just might be stuck with them (Tyreke Evans). If Portland wants to max Favors, the Jazz are in the best position of knowing whether he is worth that or not. If he is not, let him go to Portland and screw their salary cap. We have other assets that we can pay. If we feel like he is a max player (pretty great chance of being a top 10 or so player in the league), then we can pay him without immediate repercussions.

2. The Jazz were played by Portland because they had made bad salary decisions with AK and Okur as well as maxing their point guard. None of those things are an issue now. The best move that the jazz made in trading DWill is that they traded a max pg for two rookie salary big men with huge potential to evaluate. DWill was good, but I contend that no pg is max salary good, not even Chris Paul. Teams get far into the playoffs all of the time without stellar small guard play. It rarely happens without good big men. Removing the DWill's max salary burden was HUGE!

Gone are the days that we have to live in fear of big spenders. With new management we profit off them (Brooklyn and Golden State.)

 

[green]

I would love to revisit this thread and see how people's opinions have changed after the Jazz only get 25 wins this year.

LOL.

 

[framer]

I would love to revisit this thread and see how people's opinions have changed after the Jazz only get 25 wins this year.

LOL.

I don't suspect people will be all that bitter about having mountains of capspace , a bunch of solid young prospects, probably a new coach, and one of the top 3 players from the 2014 draft. Some might even be pretty enthused about that position.

 

[green]

I don't suspect people will be all that bitter about having mountains of capspace , a bunch of solid young prospects, probably a new coach, and one of the top 3 players from the 2014 draft. Some might even be pretty enthused about that position.

Uh...have you not seen all the Burkes talk going on? People here are ridiculous and completely over-react to everything.

 

[udflyer]

Hayward is interesting

- He seems willing to stay in Utah
- Boston (Stevens) will definitely want him
- Game of Poker now. Jazz can probably get him for 9-10/year if they sign him before the season. If they do not extend now and he has a great year (regardless of our record), I see him getting 11-12/ year , very easily. If he has an avg year, he will settle at 6-8/year.

 

[framer]

Hayward is interesting

- He seems willing to stay in Utah
- Boston (Stevens) will definitely want him
- Game of Poker now. Jazz can probably get him for 9-10/year if they sign him before the season. If they do not extend now and he has a great year (regardless of our record), I see him getting 11-12/ year , very easily. If he has an avg year, he will settle at 6-8/year.

If you can get him at 9, you pull the trigger. The trick is what if you extend Hayward and not Favors? Is there any animosity? I don't know, but I doubt it. I do know that what has killed the Jazz in the past is bidding against themselves rather than matching RFA contracts. Millsap was a good deal and Matthews would have been if we matched him. Generally I think it safer to match an RFA, or to use that process to negotiate with your player.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

If you can get him at 9, you pull the trigger. The trick is what if you extend Hayward and not Favors? Is there any animosity? I don't know, but I doubt it. I do know that what has killed the Jazz in the past is bidding against themselves rather than matching RFA contracts. Millsap was a good deal and Matthews would have been if we matched him. Generally I think it safer to match an RFA, or to use that process to negotiate with your player.

Animosity from who?

I'm sure the Jazz want to extend both and would if they could. The people who are stopping the extensions are probably the agents who think their client can show out this year and get a bigger contract.

 

[framer]

Animosity from who?

I'm sure the Jazz want to extend both and would if they could. The people who are stopping the extensions are probably the agents who think their client can show out this year and get a bigger contract.

I'm not sure to be honest, but I am not a 22 year old NBA player. It seems like contract negotiations are about respect to them, and if you worked to get a deal with one and let the other see what they could get in the marketplace, there might be some animosity. I don't think that Favors would care about Hayward's market value, so I don't think he would be "Wow the Jazz got a great deal there!"
Then again, I was raised on Karl Malone salary negotiations playing out in the media, so I may be stunted.

 

[Stifle Tower]

I would love to revisit this thread and see how people's opinions have changed after the Jazz only get 25 wins this year.

LOL.

Cartwheels from me. But you also have to evaluate how players have performed in reaching just 25 wins. If Burke came in and won ROY, you'd probably have to blame some of the others for ONLY reaching 25 wins. Likewise, Favors and Hayward could have monstrous seasons and be let down by poor play from Kanter, Burks, etc. Jazz could also win 35 and you'd need to do the same individual evaluations. Maybe Lucas, Jefferson, Rush and Marvin Williams have amazing success off the bench and the starters are decent, but not great,

 

[NUMBERICA]

Hi. You are familiar with the word "most", aren't you?

 

[NUMBERICA]

The Jazz have put themselves in the best possible position to retain all of their free agents. If you are going to get in a bidding war with another team, you don't pick the Jazz who can retain all of their free agents and not even approach the same zip code as the luxury tax.

Sorry for interrupting your rant about the absolute necessity of an organization to be be fiscally responsible, to the point of being shrewd (no point guard is or has ever been worth the max except Magic Johnson). Continue.

 

[Deleted member 848]

Hi. You are familiar with the word "most", aren't you?

Yes.


I'm also all-too-familiar with putting a moronic Locke-ist blanket-generalization on every NBA player who joins the league, by exclaiming he only has 3 years to cultivate his identity-- despite the fact that some of these players are getting drafted at 18 years of age

 

[Jazz4ever]

Yes.


I'm also all-too-familiar with putting a moronic Locke-ist blanket-generalization on every NBA player who joins the league, by exclaiming he only has 3 years to cultivate his identity-- despite the fact that some of these players are getting drafted at 18 years of age

You have to factor in big men, on average, take a couple years longer as well. Portland gave up on Jermaine O'Neal in early 2000 at age 21, but had been in the league 4 years. One of their many big man blunders. He went on to be a 20/10/2.5+ player with Indiana. He is an extreme case, but an important one.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/onealje01.html

 

[akirac73]

You have to factor in big men, on average, take a couple years longer as well. Portland gave up on Jermaine O'Neal in early 2000 at age 21, but had been in the league 4 years. One of their many big man blunders. He went on to be a 20/10/2.5+ player with Indiana. He is an extreme case, but an important one.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/onealje01.html

I think Favors' situation is different because he was traded in his rookie season and plays for moron of a head coach that limited his playing time, so I think Favors has more to show us than what we've seen so far. But in general, I agree that a player is what he is after 3 seasons. There are obviously exceptions, but you'll rarely find players that suddenly jump from being a bench scrub or role player to a all-star/superstar caliber player. I think Hayward is another example of WYSIWYG.