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Acta signed!!!!

babe said:
I'd like to see some smart and in the postive aspect of the term "progressive", meaning trying to enhance the quality and value of life, folks like Kicky and One Brow actually get interested in applying their considerable talents in bringing credible public attention to issues of declining personal rights and protection from overlordyism run amok.
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If you are really going to focus on privacy issues, you need to focus on situaitons where actual privacy is in play, not the illusion of anonymity.
 
Like Kicky, I have only skimmed through the criticisms of ACTA as laid out by the European public interest research group. None of us have the actual language of the current draft of the agreement, and apparently in the course of enlisting more national signatories they are open to amendments and changes. But apparently the very process is being conducted out of the public view, and is therefore inherently elistist, undemocratic strategy for addressing this problem, and obviously being done for the protection of major concerns like the movie, music and other commercial interests who are being "ripped off" in some places by knockoff reproductions. The scope of the agreement has been broadened to include use of materials in the internet and other more or less "free" sharing mediums. In fact the language appears to be so broad and all-inclusive it could conceivably be applied to say, an artist re-drawing the Mona Lisa with maybe some humorous twist.

Why is your set point on dismissing concerns for what this obviously anti-democratic type of "legislative body" is producing, that obviously is going to end up having a huge impact on you and everybody else.

Why are you drinking this cool aid just because it is being offered under a professed good intention?

It is my "insider" knowledge that the purpose ultimately to be addressed will make it impossible for individuals to discuss the news in a comprehensive manner, including quotations and comparisons from different news retailers, without getting permission and maybe even paying for the use. The news will not any longer be for everybody, just those who pay for it. It will also make discussions like this impossible. And force us to purchase our information at virtually every bend in the road.

It is absolutely and undeniably undemocratic, and goes far beyond merely collecting royalties for entertainment.
 
Dutch, logg, and babe, are spot on. I don't see how anyone can be informed about this and not be concerned about it.

Deep packet inspection is bad news. And giving anyone authority to use it, basically whenever they want, with no warrant, is bad news.

There is a reason this is all being done behind closed doors.
 
One Brow said:
If you are really going to focus on privacy issues, you need to focus on situaitons where actual privacy is in play, not the illusion of anonymity.
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To follow up on this point: part of credibility on an issue is not falling victim to the chicken little routine. That's especially true when it's founded upon claims that posting a youtube video of your child's birthday is going to run you into serious piracy problems.
 
SaltyDawg said:
Dutch, logg, and babe, are spot on. I don't see how anyone can be informed about this and not be concerned about it.

Deep packet inspection is bad news. And giving anyone authority to use it, basically whenever they want, with no warrant, is bad news.

There is a reason this is all being done behind closed doors.
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In intenet terms, deep packet inspection would be a lot like the government being able to randomly turn on a camera in your personal bedroom for no other reason than they saw a lot of people enter your home. It seriously compromises encryption and any other algorithm designed to protect data transfer on the internet. I don't think it is chicken-little-ish (word?) at all to be concerned about the precedent this could set and to want to understand better the controls that may or may not be in play when/if this is enforced.

Again, this is very similar to the phone tapping without warrant of the patriot act. Was everyone here in favor of that? The big difference between this and the patriot act is the patriot act at least operated under the auspices of national security from imminent terrorist attack. This new legislation could be twisted to fit almost any nefarious scheme that a company could lobby for, from checking for illegal downloads to bank account information, to personal emails. The possibility of triggering a witch-hunt atmosphere, not to mention bypassing basic constitutionality of due process, is enough to warrant a deeper look and some concern.

Here is a loaded question: Would it be more outrageous if it were happening directly under a republican regime?
 
Sirkickyass said:
Do you believe that all trade agreements, which basically are universally negotiated behind closed doors, signal some kind of nefarious conspiracy?
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I do if it gives the government (and other non government groups) powers similar to the patriot act.
 
Sirkickyass said:
To follow up on this point: part of credibility on an issue is not falling victim to the chicken little routine. That's especially true when it's founded upon claims that posting a youtube video of your child's birthday is going to run you into serious piracy problems.
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whit deep packet inspection and "super"computer within reach scrapers could be used searching for signature.

point in case a few months ago a certain fileserver , hotfile gave warner bross permission to scan and automatically delete files that where in violation of copyright laws. all good right

but then warnerbross descigned a crawler and started delting files needles to say they started deleting files on which no copyright rests.

the crawler started delting everything
for example in their crawler they put key word "Harry's" (obviously cus they own that harry potter crap)
but now if i Called my homemade program "Harry's home made porn tool" they would just delete it cus the crawler was not overseen by a human. there was no oversight on what was deleted and whatnot. but ofcourse this is no big deal its just deleting files.

but with these facre called ACTA they could do this on a GLOBAL scale. eg happy birthday being sung on youtube(happy birthday is on copyright till 2016 if i'm not mistaken) thereby deleting the file. and offcourse after some time they will start taking it one step further deleting the file. and than because of this acta crap they will know your ip your home adres(without obtaining warrant.
and they sent you a fine for copyrigth violations.

when money is on the line history shows humanity will fail.



this acta law allows that without trial or warrants or such legal mumbo jumbo. to be cut off from internet. and internet now adays is a must certain tax returns and other important stuff we cant do with internet here.

so take this as you may. acta is BAD NEWS
 
also the acta is a world agreement putting borders on the internet criminalizing people for sending a bunch of zeros and one past an imaginary border.
yet the countries that sign it(eventually will sign it) is only 12.7% of the world population. not very (global)democratic is it.

also acta will not stop offline counterfitting as of now most counterfit stuff comes from china and russia. note that those 2 countries wont sign it and want nothing to do when it comes to offline counterfitting.

tell me this why weren't Representative of THE PEOPLE not allowed in the negotiations but some fat greesy mafia enum i mean studio boss was allowed to attend and influence this crap
 
also this patent/ip law is getting ridicluous point in case the numerous lawsuit crApple did to samsung for tablets and phones and such.
patent and ip law are there to support progress. but today it mostly brings it to a halt
 
SaltyDawg said:
I do if it gives the government (and other non government groups) powers similar to the patriot act.
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This is argument by analogy though. I think you're going to have to do a little more explaining regarding why deep packet inspection is fundamentally different from what is authorized under present US law and what specific rights are violated.

I think there's sort of this maxim at work that everything about the internet is totally free that's guiding a thought process here. I don't believe that's necessarily true or even particularly wise so I'm not jumping all over any boogeyman as a result.

DutchJazzer said:
whit deep packet inspection and "super"computer within reach scrapers could be used searching for signature.

point in case a few months ago a certain fileserver , hotfile gave warner bross permission to scan and automatically delete files that where in violation of copyright laws. all good right

but then warnerbross descigned a crawler and started delting files needles to say they started deleting files on which no copyright rests.

the crawler started delting everything
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Link please.

Also, and these are unanswerable questions, how does ACTA operate in the context of varying national laws, are countries allowed to sign with exception, and what is the governing body that oversees enforcement?

I think you're assuming it overruns all of these things. Very little precedent indicates that would be the case. Is there any evidence, for example, that ACTA is going to entirely invalidate the fair use doctrine in the United States?
 
DutchJazzer said:
also the acta is a world agreement putting borders on the internet criminalizing people for sending a bunch of zeros and one past an imaginary border.
yet the countries that sign it(eventually will sign it) is only 12.7% of the world population. not very (global)democratic is it.

also acta will not stop offline counterfitting as of now most counterfit stuff comes from china and russia. note that those 2 countries wont sign it and want nothing to do when it comes to offline counterfitting.

tell me this why weren't Representative of THE PEOPLE not allowed in the negotiations but some fat greesy mafia enum i mean studio boss was allowed to attend and influence this crap
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Great point about some music industry mafia don sitting on on a meeting that was kept secret from the public.

Also, great point about China and Russia not signing it. What have we come to if China and Russia are the ones with unobtrusive governments looking out for the people, while the USA gives mafia dons authority to perform deep packet inspection without a warrant?

Wow, I never thought I would see this in my lifetime.
 
Sirkickyass said:
This is argument by analogy though. I think you're going to have to do a little more explaining regarding why deep packet inspection is fundamentally different from what is authorized under present US law and what specific rights are violated.

I think there's sort of this maxim at work that everything about the internet is totally free that's guiding a thought process here. I don't believe that's necessarily true or even particularly wise so I'm not jumping all over any boogeyman as a result.



Link please.

Also, and these are unanswerable questions, how does ACTA operate in the context of varying national laws, are countries allowed to sign with exception, and what is the governing body that oversees enforcement?

I think you're assuming it overruns all of these things. Very little precedent indicates that would be the case. Is there any evidence, for example, that ACTA is going to entirely invalidate the fair use doctrine in the United States?
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I got the link but it's in dutch.

searched some english links
https://torrentfreak.com/hotfile-sues-warner-bros-for-copyright-fraud-and-abuse-110913/
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy...es-accusing-warner-brothers-of-dmca-abuse.ars
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr-esq/cyberlocker-battle-hotfile-threatens-countersue-224365

there are lots more if you doubt the trustworthiness of these website.

so yeah this might bring more trouble without a warrant and such they where able to delete files that they do not belong.
all acta does is give non government similar powers on a global scale.
 
SaltyDawg said:
Great point about some music industry mafia don sitting on on a meeting that was kept secret from the public.

Also, great point about China and Russia not signing it. What have we come to if China and Russia are the ones with unobtrusive governments looking out for the people, while the USA gives mafia dons authority to perform deep packet inspection without a warrant?

Wow, I never thought I would see this in my lifetime.
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yet the countries that signed that crap sit on some sort of high horse about china and Russia violating human rights. and some may not believe acta violates "feredom of speech", "Right to privacy" and irght to some sort of trial. but it DOES.
 
thank god for wiki-leaks leaking the early draft. that caused some backlash so now the new acta agreement is not as bad as the first drafts. which included a "global" three strike laws.
 
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