Cappy_Smurf
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Utah is top 10 offense and defense.
Too bad losers are to busy focusing on the negative to realize how badass our team is. You suck.
Can the Dante Exum Experiment Please End
- Thread starter franklin
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Utah is top 10 offense and defense.
Too bad losers are to busy focusing on the negative to realize how badass our team is. You suck.
fishonjazz
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Crazy that we are still so damn good.
Glass half full look is to think how many gm's could miss on a #3 and #5 pick yet still build a great team with Hayward (#9?), Gobert (27?), hood (21), burks (12), favors (extended), hill (trade), and a fantastic supporting cast?
Plus hired a fantastic coach imo.
Now if we could just do something about the medical staff....
Could've been devastating, but the Jazz made up for it by drafting the best player in the 2013 draft with the 27th pick, and one of the top five players from the 2014 draft with the 23rd pick.
jope
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Lol. Simmer down. Weve had barely any top 5 picks in our history and were/are still in search of a true superstar. Thats where you find them and if we whiffed twice then thats frustrating. Not to mention if guys leave this summer, we could just be middling again and not have the opportunity to have a top 5 for some time, yet never really contend either.
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jope
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I agree completely but still nervously approach the summer, both in terms of playoff performance and free agencies. Is this a "regular season" team that may get ousted in the playoffs due to the lack of a true superstar? And does the team stay intact past june? If either of those things fall down, the two wasted top 5s would be painful. Time will tell.
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Handlogten's Heros
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Just thinkin about Dante and his path for development. He's obviously a pretty big project still and clearly we don't have the time for him to come in the game and screw up. I've never seen a pg with his development curve that became great. There in no real way I see him as being able to take over for Hill next year without us falling off of a cliff.
He may become a good... even great player but because of his unique skill set/potential, his steep development curve, and our lack of ability to tolerate his mistakes I don't see it happening here. I guess if Hayward bolted and we took a step back and built around Rudy, Hood, Dante, and Trey...
I'd be hitting the trade market hard if I was DL... his value will continue to decline unless he breaks out and contributes in limited minutes. I hate where this is headed because I do think he could be good but we don't have time for this experiment.
He may become a good... even great player but because of his unique skill set/potential, his steep development curve, and our lack of ability to tolerate his mistakes I don't see it happening here. I guess if Hayward bolted and we took a step back and built around Rudy, Hood, Dante, and Trey...
I'd be hitting the trade market hard if I was DL... his value will continue to decline unless he breaks out and contributes in limited minutes. I hate where this is headed because I do think he could be good but we don't have time for this experiment.
What happens if what Tony Jones is reporting is true? That Hill wants to hit FA and is aiming 5max? What do we do then? I love Hill as much as anybody, but I don't think it would be wise for the Jazz to offer him anywhere close to that contract.
Game6Conley
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Draft a PG with one of the 1st rd picks for sure should be part of that plan. AKA use(at-least) the 8th pick in 4 years on a PG..
Trey Jerk, Neto, Exum, Olivier Hanlan, [George Hill], Tyrone Wallace, Marcus Paige and (Edmond Sumner??)
Handlogten's Heros
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He's dreaming. Won't get that deal this summer. Even with his numbers he's had many small injuries throughout his career.
He doesn't have the same value around the league as Conley. There is not as much space out there as last summer. Who offers that?
I am not sure plan B can be Dante starts and we take a huge step back... I think we'd likely get some help. I mean he's getting yanked for Mack...
Douchebag K
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bummer if Hill is going to leave to chase money elsewhere. I think Exum will be very different by the end of this year and then next. I think he still doesn't trust his knee fully subconsciously
seattlejazzfan
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The steep development curve is a legit concern. I must have posted about it when he was a rookie or after his rookie year, but there has essentially never been an 18 or 19 year old that was as unproductive as Exum was his rookie year that became great. Very few that even became good (Jamal Crawford was one that became good).
I imagine after a couple months we could say the same for 21 year olds.
So it's not that he can't become great or good but it's going to be tough. Fortunately he's a pretty good defender, so coaches can be more patient with him that other guys.
Some of you guys are too impatient, not everybody develops at the same rate.
These PG's are all pretty good players now, and they all had indifferent starts to their careers. Give Exum some time, he will be fine.
These 2 guys were ok in their rookie season, but no-one thought they would become such quality players with there physical restrictions.
Isaiah Thomas
Kemba Walker
Not too dissimilar to Exum, these 2 guys started there careers extremely slowly, but have improved dramatically as they have aged.
Kyle Lowry
Jeff Teague
Pretty much didn't exist in his rookie year, but now has the starting postion on a pretty good team, and is improving each year.
Dennis Schroder
Just need to be patient, if these guys can do it then so can Exum. He has the tools to succeed.
seattlejazzfan
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uh, either you simply don't get it or you are not paying attention.
Isaiah Thomas' PER his rookie year was 17.
Kemba Walker's PER was 15
Kyle Lowry's PER was 14 his first full season (18 in 10 games his rookie year)
Jeff Teague's PER was 11
Schroder's PER was more Exum like at 6, not playing a full year, but his first full year, at age 21 his PER was 16.
Dante Exum's PER his rookie year was 6, and at age 21, it is sitting at 8.
Let's be clear - Nobody (or very few) are saying he can't or won't ever be good. But your comparisons above fall flat. Exum simply has a steeper development curve than the players you mentioned. From league low type production at age 19 and again at 21, it's incredibly rare that guys who don't produce ever become good players, even more rare - great players.
it's not impossible, Exum is his own guy, has his own skill set, his own work ethic, so you can't judge him by what other guys have done, but history shows us it is unlikely.
LoPo
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Seattle Jazz - almost all the guys you listed were on poorly run teams and allowed to shoot at will. If Exum played on some crap team with volume shooting, his stats would look better.
At the end of the day, Exum is a big athlete at PG who can play good defense. At 21, that's a good find and valuable rotation guy. There have been players for years who were vital contributors simply off of athleticism and defense. Without research, these come to mind:
Bruce Bowen - could only shoot corner 3
Thabo Sefolosha - solid for years
Tony Allen - defense a+ offence c
Livingston - length, athleticism and post up only
Trevor Ariza - mostly length and d
Avery Bradley - athleticism and defense
I'm sure there are many more. Exum is a luxury to have on the roster. He has to get better which he will. We don't want to start him but we don't need to lose him.
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At the end of the day, Exum is a big athlete at PG who can play good defense. At 21, that's a good find and valuable rotation guy. There have been players for years who were vital contributors simply off of athleticism and defense. Without research, these come to mind:
Bruce Bowen - could only shoot corner 3
Thabo Sefolosha - solid for years
Tony Allen - defense a+ offence c
Livingston - length, athleticism and post up only
Trevor Ariza - mostly length and d
Avery Bradley - athleticism and defense
I'm sure there are many more. Exum is a luxury to have on the roster. He has to get better which he will. We don't want to start him but we don't need to lose him.
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fishonjazz
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Those guys you mentioned are ok nba players. Kind of a let down though when people were comparing exum to kobe, kidd, penny hardaway, etc. Saying he is our best chance for a star player. Talking about him reaching his potential being the key to a shot at a championship. Now we hope he can turn into thabo? Kinda sad.
LoPo
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It is sad, but not as stupid as thinking Exum was Kobe. I find it encouraging that we drafted at least a defensive specialist player of value instead of another player not worth keeping (Kanter, Burke, etc.)
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fishonjazz
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Would have been nice to have got that type player in a draft position more fitting of that type of contribution without tanking.
That year many of us were rooting for losses in the hope of grabbing a star player in a good draft.
And ya, what happened with Kanter (an offensive specialist making max money btw) sucked but that doesn't mean what is happening with exum doesn't suck too. Neto and mack (2nd rounders) are looking better than our #5 pick
LoPo
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That's not my point. Of course it's disappointing Exum or how we used his pick didn't turn into a star. However, I'm encouraged that we got a player of value. More importantly, I'm excited we got a specialist. In my opinion, elite teams possess specialists and a few comprehensive players and usually a couple stars.
Exum's development will lead him to become either a very good 6th man type guy like Avery Bradley or maybe better. His skills would have him being a valuable contributor in every title contending roster.
Could be a lot worse and we should not move him.
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fishonjazz
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But we didn't. If you think he is a player of value then your definition of value is way different than most people.
He gets dnp's when hill is healthy cause he can't get minutes over mack. I doubt we could get much of anything for him in a trade.
Could he have some value in the future? Sure. Right now though? Come on.
Also, you expect to have some value from a #5 pick.
fishonjazz
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