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Dante Exum vs. Zach Lavine

Rubio prefers to set up others as a playmaker than be the cut throat closer. He is becoming a closer more and more as he career goes on, but he has been injured a lot too.

I see Dante as being a playmaker. Once Dante gets the confidence and green light to attack the paint aggressively, I see him being a drive and dish playmaker with the ability to get to the rim like Tony Parker, but a vision like Rubio. Quick but deceptive. It's a bright future. Lavine is still a break neck speed player.
 
Wanted to bump this thread right after the Timberwolves game but thought the pain was too fresh. Objectively now, I think we can say that Lavine will turn out to be the far superior offensive player. Exum has the edge defensively only because of effort and discipline. With a different hard-nosed coach, Lavine could learn these things. It seems we do better with picks in the 20s than in the top 10 (Gobert, Hood vs Trey, Exum, Kanter).
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Hipporippo said:
Wanted to bump this thread right after the Timberwolves game but thought the pain was too fresh. Objectively now, I think we can say that Lavine will turn out to be the far superior offensive player. Exum has the edge defensively only because of effort and discipline. With a different hard-nosed coach, Lavine could learn these things. It seems we do better with picks in the 20s than in the top 10 (Gobert, Hood vs Trey, Exum, Kanter).
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check back in 2-3 years Will be very interesting
 
Hipporippo said:
Wanted to bump this thread right after the Timberwolves game but thought the pain was too fresh. Objectively now, I think we can say that Lavine will turn out to be the far superior offensive player. Exum has the edge defensively only because of effort and discipline. With a different hard-nosed coach, Lavine could learn these things. It seems we do better with picks in the 20s than in the top 10 (Gobert, Hood vs Trey, Exum, Kanter).
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Zach Lavine is dead last in real plus minus in the league... That's not a good sign. He's an amazing athlete but dante is the more effective player right now.

It's tough to analyze dante and compare him to people. He is really unique. Problem is he basically sits out offensive possessions. Would just like to see more aggressiveness to know if he can do it.
 
Hipporippo said:
Wanted to bump this thread right after the Timberwolves game but thought the pain was too fresh. Objectively now, I think we can say that Lavine will turn out to be the far superior offensive player. Exum has the edge defensively only because of effort and discipline. With a different hard-nosed coach, Lavine could learn these things. It seems we do better with picks in the 20s than in the top 10 (Gobert, Hood vs Trey, Exum, Kanter).
(
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How do you figure? Lavine is worse in pretty much every single advanced offensive metric?

Offensive RPM:
Exum: -0.81
Lavine: -3.15

Offensive BPM:
Exum: -2.1
Lavine: -2.6

Offensive WS:
Exum: -0.5
Lavine: -1.0
 
LazyD said:
Exum has brain, Lavine has no brain.

Case closed

#100RAPclub
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Lavine can shoot. Exum can't.

Case re-opened.


And I don't place much stock in win shares, etc. Lavine is playing on a crappy team. Exum benefits from the Jazz being an elite defensive team. Sure, he's part of that. But the main guys are Gobert and Favors. WE only have Alec out; the TWolves have had far more key injuries.
 
Stifle Tower said:
Lavine can shoot. Exum can't.

Case re-opened.


And I don't place much stock in win shares, etc. Lavine is playing on a crappy team. Exum benefits from the Jazz being an elite defensive team. Sure, he's part of that. But the main guys are Gobert and Favors. WE only have Alec out; the TWolves have had far more key injuries.
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He happened to shoot well the time he played us, this year his overall offensive rating is lower than Exum's. And Exum is a whole lot better on defense. I think what you see is what you are going to get with Lavine, because his mental awareness isn't top notch. He is a freak athlete for sure, but I suspect his career path will be a lot like Jamie Watson.
 
framer said:
He happened to shoot well the time he played us, this year his overall offensive rating is lower than Exum's. And Exum is a whole lot better on defense. I think what you see is what you are going to get with Lavine, because his mental awareness isn't top notch. He is a freak athlete for sure, but I suspect his career path will be a lot like Jamie Watson.
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Harold Miner ?? Similar start to his career & type of player ??
 
framer said:
He happened to shoot well the time he played us, this year his overall offensive rating is lower than Exum's. And Exum is a whole lot better on defense. I think what you see is what you are going to get with Lavine, because his mental awareness isn't top notch. He is a freak athlete for sure, but I suspect his career path will be a lot like Jamie Watson.
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This is what the Exum chicken littles just just can't get a grasp on. They look at his absence of an offensive game, and they decide he must belong in the D-league. However, although Exum isn't contributing much on the offensive end, he also isn't hurting our offense. He's a positive on the defensive end, and basically a zero on offense. Compare that to Trey, who overall is a negative on both ends, because of his inefficiency. Trey is absolutely going to have to become a smarter player in regards to understanding that when his shot is off on any particular night, it isn't going to suddenly return after you go 2-12. Quin has given him every opportunity to work through his struggles, but that opportunity is going to dry up really quickly when winning becomes a priority.
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Also, I know some people believe Trey is just fine as a backup PG, and I might agree if he was actually playing backup minutes, but he's not. If Utah wants to be serious about winning next year, we can't continue with playing Trey significant minutes as a volume shooter. Until Exum is ready to play actual starter minutes, Trey is either going to have to become much more selective with his shooting, or Utah needs to go in a different direction. Needless to say, I'm not very optimistic that Trey is suddenly going to figure it out. I'm afraid at this point, what we see is what we get, which is why I'm in favor of moving Trey and bringing in a different PG.
 
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freakazoid said:
This is what the Exum chicken littles just just can't get a grasp on. They look at his absence of an offensive game, and they decide he must belong in the D-league. However, although Exum isn't contributing much on the offensive end, he also isn't hurting our offense. He's a positive on the defensive end, and basically a zero on offense. Compare that to Trey, who overall is a negative on both ends, because of his inefficiency. Trey is absolutely going to have to become a smarter player in regards to understanding that when his shot is off on any particular night, it isn't going to suddenly return after you go 2-12. Quin has given him every opportunity to work through his struggles, but that opportunity is going to dry up really quickly when winning becomes a priority.
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Also, I know some people believe Trey is just fine as a backup PG, and I might agree if he was actually playing backup minutes, but he's not. If Utah wants to be serious about winning next year, we can't continue with playing Trey significant minutes as a volume shooter. Until Exum is ready to play actual starter minutes, Trey is either going to have to become much more selective with his shooting, or Utah needs to go in a different direction. Needless to say, I'm not very optimistic that Trey is suddenly going to figure it out. I'm afraid at this point, what we see is what we get, which is why I'm in favor of moving Trey and bringing in a different PG.
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Exum will soak up more minutes next year and many of Trey's shots will go to Burks. If we get a big like Tomic, Trey won't need to do as much either, especially if we get an offensive minded draft choice. The problem is that we are asking Trey to be a volume shooter when the other team knows darn well that he is supposed to be a volume shooter. The spacing he gets is horrible and he is forced into a lot of contested shots. That situation is only going to get better and so will Trey's numbers.
 
Diamond77 said:
We should have drafted Michael Carter-Williams in 2013 draft and Dario Saric in the last draft.
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If we are going to do draft do overs lets aim higher than MCW... Dat guy Milwaukee took might be just a little better. Exum was the right pick.
 
Lavine will probably put up solid numbers but I doubt he'll ever play good basketball on a winning team.
 
freakazoid said:
This is what the Exum chicken littles just just can't get a grasp on. They look at his absence of an offensive game, and they decide he must belong in the D-league. However, although Exum isn't contributing much on the offensive end, he also isn't hurting our offense. He's a positive on the defensive end, and basically a zero on offense. Compare that to Trey, who overall is a negative on both ends, because of his inefficiency. Trey is absolutely going to have to become a smarter player in regards to understanding that when his shot is off on any particular night, it isn't going to suddenly return after you go 2-12. Quin has given him every opportunity to work through his struggles, but that opportunity is going to dry up really quickly when winning becomes a priority.
-
Also, I know some people believe Trey is just fine as a backup PG, and I might agree if he was actually playing backup minutes, but he's not. If Utah wants to be serious about winning next year, we can't continue with playing Trey significant minutes as a volume shooter. Until Exum is ready to play actual starter minutes, Trey is either going to have to become much more selective with his shooting, or Utah needs to go in a different direction. Needless to say, I'm not very optimistic that Trey is suddenly going to figure it out. I'm afraid at this point, what we see is what we get, which is why I'm in favor of moving Trey and bringing in a different PG.
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Dead on. If Exum stays the defensive player he is, but adds say a reliable 3 pter, a willingness to drive even if just to break down the defense, and a moderate ability to run the PnR we will have something pretty special. And from what we have seen of him so far that is not such a huge leap. We are in a position to be one of the top defensive teams in the league as a group and at all 5 positions next season. Frankly, as the Pistons absorbed Wallace's complete ZERO on offense due to his rebounding and defense, we will be able to absorb some as well.
 
framer said:
Exum will soak up more minutes next year and many of Trey's shots will go to Burks. If we get a big like Tomic, Trey won't need to do as much either, especially if we get an offensive minded draft choice. The problem is that we are asking Trey to be a volume shooter when the other team knows darn well that he is supposed to be a volume shooter. The spacing he gets is horrible and he is forced into a lot of contested shots. That situation is only going to get better and so will Trey's numbers.
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Um, Trey is choosing that for himself. How many times do we see him dribble the clock down to 8 seconds, then run into the teeth of the defense only to back out and force up a contested long 2, all while his team mates watch. He just plain sucks, period.
 
I think Exum will be fine once he puts on some muscle & gets some core strength. During draft time numerous articles stated he's got a 1st step like Kobe. When I watch him play he's got the finesse down but no explosiveness. If he gets stronger and begins finishing I'm hoping he'll start driving inside (something Burke NEVER did last season but has drastically improved this season). Also, with dribbling toward the basket Exum's assists will go up as well.
 
stitches said:
How do you figure? Lavine is worse in pretty much every single advanced offensive metric?

Offensive RPM:
Exum: -0.81
Lavine: -3.15

Offensive BPM:
Exum: -2.1
Lavine: -2.6

Offensive WS:
Exum: -0.5
Lavine: -1.0
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I do believe he is currently the better offensive player because of his ability to shoot and finish at the rim. But I actually said that he would TURN OUT to be the far better offensive player. Why do people think Lavine is a finished product? He's the same age as Dante. Lavine has tools and skills that Dante doesn't. Dante has a better feel for the game and playmaking. Both can learn.
 
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