Grade this Fantasy U.S. Presidents Draft

[The Blue Elephant]

All we have is the perception of presidents which are most likely seriously construed from reality. For example someone like Abraham Lincoln many probably think is a great president who loves black people. Think again.

“I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in anyway the social and political equality of the white and black races – that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race. I say upon this occasion I do not perceive that because the white man is to have the superior position the negro should be denied everything.” -Abraham Lincoln (Fourth Debate with Stephen A. Douglas at Charleston, Illinois, September 18, 1858)

There are many many more just google.

To me presidency is like WWE wrestling. One year someone holds the belt, next year someone else does.

 

[Sneakers]

Team 5 is the best rounded of the options

 

[Sneakers]

Well we all know popularity is the best sign of objective quality.

That's why Justin Bieber is the best musician in the United States.

By scholars fool

 

[framer]

Where the Hell is Silent Cal? He would beat teams 1 and 3 just by himself!

 

[NUMBERICA]

You're kind of proving my point.

Lincoln has been built up as some sort of god -- and admittedly it makes for a nice story/movie -- but spend more than a few minutes in some historical literature and delve into the details of his presidency and his war, and your opinion might be a little less shiny. Not implying that he's evil, just....overrated.

And presidents who have been assassinated always get a historical bump in their perceived ratings.

I'm proving your point that they steered the ship through the most treacherous waters in this nation's (and world's) history?

 

[Gameface]

We can't judge these people based on our current standards of morality and social norms. They didn't live in a world that operated according to that set of standards, so they were by and large a product of their times.

 

[sirkickyass]

We can't judge these people based on our current standards of morality and social norms. They didn't live in a world that operated according to that set of standards, so they were by and large a product of their times.

I disagree on a couple points.

First, anyone who orders genocide is wrong. I don't care about the mores of the time. That's about being a human being.

Second, Andrew Jackson was a monster even for his era.

 

[Gameface]

So you're not a big fan then?

I honestly don't know a lot about him other than he was a general before he was pres.

I'm all for condemning his actions, but he was "at war" with the Native Americans. I don't know for sure but I don't think he just randomly killed masses of people without some sort of mandate and without some sort of sense that he was fighting for whatever his version of good was.

 

[default]

Well we all know popularity is the best sign of objective quality.

That's why Justin Bieber is the best musician in the United States.

I thought Bieber was Canadian.

 

[default]

You're kind of proving my point.

Lincoln has been built up as some sort of god -- and admittedly it makes for a nice story/movie -- but spend more than a few minutes in some historical literature and delve into the details of his presidency and his war, and your opinion might be a little less shiny. Not implying that he's evil, just....overrated.

And presidents who have been assassinated always get a historical bump in their perceived ratings.

Abraham Lincoln Vampire Hunter!!! Didn't you see the movie? Obviously his team would win!
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1611224/

 

[Sneakers]

Lincoln hating is the hipsterdom of Presidential history / scholarship

 

[Jazz Spazz]

How about the teams are judged on who would win if teamed up in a Hunger Games scenario.

Now which team would you vote for?

 

[♪alt13]

Best president each team imo
1 FDR (Gave the country real hope and comfort during the depression and ww2)
2 Bill Clinton ( times were good)
3 George Washington (there still was a USA when he left office of his own accord)
4 Abraham Lincoln (the fact that his name is on the emancipation proclamation is quite enough)
5 Theodore Roosevelt (preservation of natural land and went after monopolies)

Worst president each team imo
1 Woodrow Wilson (ww1 pointless death and the Federal Reserve Act)
2 John Adams (Alien and sedition act)
3 Richard Nixon (Hoover comes in a close second here but the statement " if the president does it it's legal" tilts it to Dick)
4 Abraham Lincoln ( only Pres to get best and worst bumbled the war and a gross expansion of federal and presidential powers)
5 Andrew Jackson( Shoutout to the Osage Nation **** ****ing old hickory)

 

[Sneakers]

Team 5 wins in an even bigger landslide. Eisenhower to do the strategy, Teddy and AJ to hunt and kill the living daylights out of bitches... Thom J can be the resourceful one, or the intellectual one... **** it it doesn't even matter what he does.

 

[♪alt13]

We can't judge these people based on our current standards of morality and social norms. They didn't live in a world that operated according to that set of standards, so they were by and large a product of their times.

It is the people who refused to accept the social norms of their times as moral that we look back on and remember as great. People use this argument all the time to try and defend Jefferson but not all of our founding fathers had slaves and Jefferson did not free his(as Washington did)even though some of them were his children. Jefferson should be remembered as a great political thinker but not as a great man.

 

[sirkickyass]

How about the teams are judged on who would win if teamed up in a Hunger Games scenario.

Now which team would you vote for?

In that instance it's team 5, and it's not close.

I'm pretty sure Jackson would kill everyone on his own team as well just to prove that he could.

 

[sirkickyass]

I liked heyhey's analysis of best/worst so Imma bite his steez and do the same.

Best:

Team 1: It's FDR. I've got a personal soft spot for Carter (who I think was probably too moral and naive for the gig), but we all know it's FDR. I'm frankly curious if FDR was the first pick.

Team 2: Harry Truman. His accomplishments in office are simply staggering, especially given the shoes he had to fill. I find the use of the atomic bomb defensible.

Team 3: George Washington. It's hard to be the first. It's especially hard to be the first and turn down being a functional king.

Team 4: Abraham Lincoln. Not going to be a contrarian. Degree of difficulty incredible. Wouldn't be having this conversation at all if he hadn't pulled it off.

Team 5: Eisenhower. He was a tremendous believer in state infrastructure (the highway system, and created NASA) was a strong desegregating force and appointed many of the most important Supreme Court justices of the century.

The Worst:

Team 1: I'll surprise some and pick Obama. Part of this is probably present dissatisfaction with his foreign policy and the revelation that he's the biggest spy of all time.

Team 2: Adams. Dude was a paranoid prick.

Team 3: Hoover. We all know why.

Team 4: JFK remains one of the most overrated figures in American history. But at least he was actually elected and has these things I like to refer to as accomplishments. Gerald Ford, on the other hand, is mostly famous for falling down the stairs.

Team 5: Andrew Jackson. Probably should be burned in effigy every year on his birthday.

 

[Sneakers]

Really, Ike over Thomas ****ing Jefferson and Teddy? Reach

 

[sirkickyass]

Really, Ike over Thomas ****ing Jefferson and Teddy? Reach

I don't really understand the cult of Thomas Jefferson. I regard the Louisiana Purchase as a no-brainer. His actual actions as president are not particularly notable.

I think reasonable people could disagree between Ike and Teddy.

 

[LogGrad98]

I liked heyhey's analysis of best/worst so Imma bite his steez and do the same.

Best:

Team 1: It's FDR. I've got a personal soft spot for Carter (who I think was probably too moral and naive for the gig), but we all know it's FDR. I'm frankly curious if FDR was the first pick.

Team 2: Harry Truman. His accomplishments in office are simply staggering, especially given the shoes he had to fill. I find the use of the atomic bomb defensible.

Team 3: George Washington. It's hard to be the first. It's especially hard to be the first and turn down being a functional king.

Team 4: Abraham Lincoln. Not going to be a contrarian. Degree of difficulty incredible. Wouldn't be having this conversation at all if he hadn't pulled it off.

Team 5: Eisenhower. He was a tremendous believer in state infrastructure (the highway system, and created NASA) was a strong desegregating force and appointed many of the most important Supreme Court justices of the century.

The Worst:

Team 1: I'll surprise some and pick Obama. Part of this is probably present dissatisfaction with his foreign policy and the revelation that he's the biggest spy of all time.

Team 2: Adams. Dude was a paranoid prick.

Team 3: Hoover. We all know why.

Team 4: JFK remains one of the most overrated figures in American history. But at least he was actually elected and has these things I like to refer to as accomplishments. Gerald Ford, on the other hand, is mostly famous for falling down the stairs.

Team 5: Andrew Jackson. Probably should be burned in effigy every year on his birthday.

Don't forget some great golf outtakes.