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Imagine if DL had NOT "tanked". Where would our lineup look today?

Veteran PG/Mack
Hayward/Burks
Carroll/Hood
Millsap/Kanter
Favors/Gobert

THAT team wins 55 games. Especially with Snyder as the coach.

So, what did DL get us exactly?

Lol
Demarre carroll shot 39% from the field this year. 11 ppg. 29 years old. 1 assist per game. In the playoffs he is averaging 4.8 ponts per game in 18 minutes per game.
Kanter cries like a bitch and screws up chemistry and demands a trade. (kanter would be our 4th big)

Now lets give your hypothetical team injuries similar to what the jazz suffered this year.

Veteran point guard doesn't play a single game. Mack is your pg.

Favors misses 20 games. Millsap misses 20 games. Hood misses over 50 games.
We already established that carroll currently isn't very good.

That team misses the playoffs and is much more expensive and older than our current team with a lot less potential to get better and doesn't have a stockpile of draft picks coming their way.

I like the current team better than that one.

That team definitely is not a contender either.
 
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I want to dive a little deeper into the comparison with the d-will led team.
We all know that team was better this current team is. Lets look at a few reasons why.

Player peaks: Was deron ever better before or after those years? Im betting the answer is no. He was at his absolute peak as a player. Same goes for boozer. Same goes for memo. AK had better years before that time but he was still in his prime and near his peak.
How many current jazz players are at their peak for sure? Probably zero. Maybe Hayward is just barely peaking.

Experience: Im not going to look up each players age but im thinking that the ages are similar from the core of that team (d-will, boozer, memo, ak) to this team (gobert, favors, Hayward, exum, hood, burks). (I would bet that our core is the younger of the two though)

However, d-will played 3 years of college at Illinois and averaged 27, 34, and 34 minutes per game in those years. That is some pretty good experience and developing time.
Boozer played 3 years at duke under coach k and won a national championship. He then played 2 years with Cleveland before ever coming to the jazz.
Memo played in turkey and won a championship in 2002. was drafted by the pistons and played for them for 2 years and won an nba championship there. (memo was older than any of our core players)
AK: before d-will, memo, and boozer all arrived AK had was already a three time all nba defensive player and an all star.
They also had Derek fisher and matt harpring.
Looking at that team, they were young and well built. KOC did a great job of assembling that team. But the key was getting lucky in the draft with d-will. He was a true star. An elite player. Was an all star 5 years in a row with the jazz. Always averaging around 20 points per game and 10 assists per game (one year he averaged 12.8 assists per game!)
Those guys were coached by a hall of fame coach. The current guys were coached by ty corbin. Exum, and lyles are babies. much younger than any of the guys on that d-will team.

The big difference between this current jazz team and that jazz team is D-will. They got lucky and hit a home run in the draft. That's what the current management has tried to do. They had the #3 pick and #12 pick in one draft. The #14 and #21 (iirc) that they traded to get the #9 pick and then bought the #27 pick in another draft. They had the #5 pick and #21 in another draft. Then the #12 pick. They have a bunch of future drafts with multiple first round picks coming up. They traded for favors (the #3 pick). They have tried really hard to find another d-will caliber player in the draft and it has not happened yet. D-will was what made that team what is was and they got to the western conference finals 1 time (because they got lucky that an 8 seed beat a #1 seed) and then got destroyed by the spurs.

I think the jazz have had a plan to get as many good draft picks as possible (they have done a good job of that part of the plan) and hope to find and develop another d-will caliber player. Its not always easy though and not always quick. They still have many up coming draft picks, they have a lot of cash to spend, and they still have a lot of untapped potential talent on the current roster. They are doing fine. All they have to do is have one star player (via draft, free agency, trade, or development of a player currently on the roster) and they are golden.

THE JAZZ WERE A TEAM ON THE FRINGE OF THE PLAYOFFS LAST YEAR WITH ONE OF THE YOUNGEST AND MOST INJURED TEAMS IN THE ENTIRE LEAGUE AND HAVE A TON OF SALARY CAP SPACE AND A TON OF FUTURE DRAFT PICKS COMING UP.

I don't understand how someone can read that sentence and see only doom and gloom. Doesn't make sense to me.
 
I want to dive a little deeper into the comparison with the d-will led team.
We all know that team was better this current team is. Lets look at a few reasons why.

Player peaks: Was deron ever better before or after those years? Im betting the answer is no. He was at his absolute peak as a player. Same goes for boozer. Same goes for memo. AK had better years before that time but he was still in his prime and near his peak.
How many current jazz players are at their peak for sure? Probably zero. Maybe Hayward is just barely peaking.

Experience: Im not going to look up each players age but im thinking that the ages are similar from the core of that team (d-will, boozer, memo, ak) to this team (gobert, favors, Hayward, exum, hood, burks). (I would bet that our core is the younger of the two though)

However, d-will played 3 years of college at Illinois and averaged 27, 34, and 34 minutes per game in those years. That is some pretty good experience and developing time.
Boozer played 3 years at duke under coach k and won a national championship. He then played 2 years with Cleveland before ever coming to the jazz.
Memo played in turkey and won a championship in 2002. was drafted by the pistons and played for them for 2 years and won an nba championship there. (memo was older than any of our core players)
AK: before d-will, memo, and boozer all arrived AK had was already a three time all nba defensive player and an all star.
They also had Derek fisher and matt harpring.
Looking at that team, they were young and well built. KOC did a great job of assembling that team. But the key was getting lucky in the draft with d-will. He was a true star. An elite player. Was an all star 5 years in a row with the jazz. Always averaging around 20 points per game and 10 assists per game (one year he averaged 12.8 assists per game!)
Those guys were coached by a hall of fame coach. The current guys were coached by ty corbin. Exum, and lyles are babies. much younger than any of the guys on that d-will team.

The big difference between this current jazz team and that jazz team is D-will. They got lucky and hit a home run in the draft. That's what the current management has tried to do. They had the #3 pick and #12 pick in one draft. The #14 and #21 (iirc) that they traded to get the #9 pick and then bought the #27 pick in another draft. They had the #5 pick and #21 in another draft. Then the #12 pick. They have a bunch of future drafts with multiple first round picks coming up. They traded for favors (the #3 pick). They have tried really hard to find another d-will caliber player in the draft and it has not happened yet. D-will was what made that team what is was and they got to the western conference finals 1 time (because they got lucky that an 8 seed beat a #1 seed) and then got destroyed by the spurs.

I think the jazz have had a plan to get as many good draft picks as possible (they have done a good job of that part of the plan) and hope to find and develop another d-will caliber player. Its not always easy though and not always quick. They still have many up coming draft picks, they have a lot of cash to spend, and they still have a lot of untapped potential talent on the current roster. They are doing fine. All they have to do is have one star player (via draft, free agency, trade, or development of a player currently on the roster) and they are golden.

THE JAZZ WERE A TEAM ON THE FRINGE OF THE PLAYOFFS LAST YEAR WITH ONE OF THE YOUNGEST AND MOST INJURED TEAMS IN THE ENTIRE LEAGUE AND HAVE A TON OF SALARY CAP SPACE AND A TON OF FUTURE DRAFT PICKS COMING UP.

I don't understand how someone can read that sentence and see only doom and gloom. Doesn't make sense to me.
Tldr

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Imagine if DL had NOT "tanked". Where would our lineup look today?

Veteran PG/Mack
Hayward/Burks
Carroll/Hood
Millsap/Kanter
Favors/Gobert

THAT team wins 55 games. Especially with Snyder as the coach.

So, what did DL get us exactly?

This is ridiculous.

There is 0 reason to believe we would have picked all those same players. Gobert maybe because that was a draft day trade (I will say an incredible draft day deal, Gobert should have gone top 5 in that draft and Jazz got him for cash). Hood was the GS pick when we took their salary dump to land Iguodala. We freed up that salary by letting Millsap and Jefferson walk. There likely is no Millsap and Hood team
 
I think the best way to build a team is around a star.
What's the best way to get a star?
Well let's look at the teams reamaining and their stars.
Warriors: curry (drafted), thompson (drafted), green (drafted, I think. Not 100% sure)
Thunder: westbrook (drafted), durant (drafted)
Cavs: lebron (drafted originally and then free agency but we know his situation is very unique wanting to win a title for his hometown), kyrie (drafted), love (traded for.... Using a draft pick as the key piece of the trade. Wiggins.)
Raptors: derozan (drafted I think), lowry (traded for)

So looking at that list it seems that drafting and developing your own players is the best way to go. Even the ones traded for (love and lowry) are the worse players of the star players. And love was acquired because of the cavs having a good draft pick.

The jazz have done their best to get as many high draft picks as possible in the hopes of drafting and developing their own stars. They came close with Hayward and favors. A few guys on the roster could still develop into stars. They have a bunch of picks in future drafts for some more attempts in the crapshoot that is drafting a star.

Some of those teams got lucky in the lottery and moved up due to ****ing ping pong balls.

Some of those teams tanked hard (I believe curry was a result of a tank and Thompson was a result of currys injured ankles. Being great requires lots of luck) and the jazz tanked pretty hard 2 years ago bit not quite hard enough. Corbin was trying his hardest to win every game unfortunately. (Luckily corbins best efforts to win still resulted in a top 5 pick). We have lost ****ing coin tosses with other teams.

If one of our draft picks is a home run like durant, curry, westbrook, lebron or klay then we are sitting pretty.

Even the spurs. Best player is Leonard (drafted), duncan (drafted), parker (drafted), ginobli (drafted?), aldridge (free agent who wanted to go to the spurs to have a chance at a title..... Due to the fact that the spurs had a lot of good players that they drafted).
 
Who has drafted better than the Jazz the last few years? This isn't a challenge I'm genuinely curious.
 
Look at other teams that recently won titles and how they got their best player and team leader.
Dirk, wade, kobe, pierce to name a few. The team that drafted shaq won three titles.

Hitting home runs with draft picks seems to me to be the biggest key. (Free agency and trades help too but seem less important than picks which makes sense due to the fact that they are much harder to pull off) The jazz stockpiled picks as well as they could.
 
Look at other teams that recently won titles and how they got their best player and team leader.
Dirk, wade, kobe, pierce to name a few. The team that drafted shaq won three titles.

Hitting home runs with draft picks seems to me to be the biggest key. (Free agency and trades help too but seem less important than picks which makes sense due to the fact that they are much harder to pull off) The jazz stockpiled picks as well as they could.

I love the points but the Magic drafted Shaq
 
Who has drafted better than the Jazz the last few years? This isn't a challenge I'm genuinely curious.

I'm not trying to be challenging either, but let me throw this question alongside MDAV's:

Over the last few years, which other teams have whiffed on a top-3 pick (Kanter) + whiffed on a top-10 pick (Burke) + maybe whiffed on another lottery pick (Burks)?
 
I'm not trying to be challenging either, but let me throw this question alongside MDAV's:

Over the last few years, which other teams have whiffed on a top-3 pick (Kanter) + whiffed on a top-10 pick (Burke) + maybe whiffed on another lottery pick (Burks)?

Off the top of my head Kings, Cavs, Bobcats (Hornets), Wizards probably. But who else nailed late 20 picks like Gobert and Hood also?
 
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