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Minute Distribution???

Cappy_Smurf

Well-Known Member
Ok, I think this is going to be much more difficult than it has been in the past. Utah actually has too much depth, if you believe there is such a thing, and if everyone remains healthy, I think it will be a challenge keeping everyone happy. Obviously injuries could solve that problem, but for now, let's assume everyone stays healthy for once.

First, do the minutes the way you think it WILL be, and if you want, do one the way you think it SHOULD be or will be by the end of the year. Or do a tightened version you think will be our playoff rotation. Soooo many frickin options. Such a weird feeling to have not enough minutes to spread around the talent instead of the opposite. Did I say weird? I meant awesome.:cool:

Let's start with these 15 players, but feel free to change a player or two if you think the final roster will be different. Or start with 14 if you wish. Whatever. I'm going to wait on doing mine, as I need to put some thought into it.

Gobert
Favors
Diaw
Lyles
JJ
Gordo
Burks
Hill
Exum
Hood
Mack
Jingles
Withey
Neto
Bolomboy
 
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This is completely based off matchups, hot hand, type of game, etc. I don't envy Quin, it will be tough balancing the rotations and keeping everybody happy. I just posted this in a response on your other thread but I definitely think Neto, Mack, Ingles, Bolomboy, Withey ride the bench and don't see the floor unless foul trouble or injury. Then you split up your 240, like I said, due to many different factors game-by-game between the 10 guys.

Couple things I am really interested to see regarding minutes/lineups:
- The Favors/Gobert duo. How does Quin work with this? Could Gobert come off the bench some games, or be started and pulled 5 minutes in? Also the added variable of his contract extension
- Hill and Exum. I'm pretty sure Exum is going to be slowly worked in and Hill is our dude this year. What if Dante starts tearing it up? Can you keep him on the bench all season?
 
Diaw has been in the low twenties for the past 5 years. Burks probably gets his minutes limited to start the season. JJ probably cuts Hood's minutes more than he would like, and I don't think any player gets more than 32 minutes right away.
 
Wow nice job. Looks good. I could see Boris playing a little more Center and Lyles with 12 minutes is tough to swallow but you guys are right, minutes are scarce.

Thanks, I could make a public one so people can try their hand at it if they'd like. It's an interesting exercise to go through. I had so many ideas I went into it with, but so many of them got thrown out the window because I couldn't find minutes for them.

The big rotation is going to be tight. If you're really trying to win, Favors and Rudy should both be playing 33+ minutes, but that leaves very little time for the bench. Lyles should be playing ~20 minutes a night, and Boris just played 18 MPG for one of the best benches in the league last year, but I could only find 12 minutes for each because you have to fit in some small ball minutes too. Quin has a serious task at hand.

It's easy to just cut minutes from Hayward, Favors, and Gobert, but that might not be a luxury we can afford. If the difference between winning and losing is playing those guys a few minutes more, Quin has to go out and win the game. I don't think people will be happy if we're losing while Hayward is sitting 8 minutes a half. It's possible that we can be like the Hawks in 14-15, but in my opinion we will have to lean on those 3 to get HCA.
 
First attempt using this janky spreadsheet I whipped together. I did the rotation minute by minute because I'm a nerd. Maybe should have given a couple more minutes to Lyles, but I feel ok about it.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1G_e4GVWIBEHjiM9oGnBapEcloaTfmuUdAWIil_XvH8w/edit?usp=sharing

Decent. My prediction is that:

** Lyles cuts into Favors' minutes more than that, like 5 - 8 minutes more. If Favors gets those kind of minutes, it will be with even more minutes at the 5.
** Johnson doesn't take minutes at guard. (He's over 250 lbs now.) He'll cut into Favors' minutes at the 4 a bit more too.
** Ingles is going to get 8 - 10 rotation minutes, mostly at the 3, probably taking those SF minutes you have allocated to Hood.
** Burks is going to have to work his way back.
** Exum might take minutes from Burks if he shows he can shoot. He's got the IQ, passing and defense.

** Quin is going to be tempted to play Hill/Hood/Hayward/Johnson together with Favors or Gobert at the 5. That's veteran leadership, spacing and shot creation all over the floor.
 
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Decent. My prediction is that:

** Lyles cuts into Favors' minutes more than that, like 5 - 8 minutes more. If Favors gets those kind of minutes, it will be with even more minutes at the 5.
** Johnson doesn't take minutes at guard. (He's over 250 lbs now.) He'll cut into Favors' minutes at the 4 a bit more too.
** Ingles is going to get 8 - 10 rotation minutes, mostly at the 3, probably taking those SF minutes you have allocated to Hood.
** Burks is going to have to work his way back.
** Exum might take minutes from Burks if he shows he can shoot. He's got the IQ, passing and defense.

** Quin is going to be tempted to play Hill/Hood/Hayward/Johnson together with Favors or Gobert at the 5. That's veteran leadership, spacing and shot creation all over the floor.
It's very difficult!

*It's hard to cut minutes from Favors. If you cut 5-8 more minutes for Lyles and some for Johnson, you leave Favors with about 25 minutes a game. That isn't going to happen!
*I had Johnson as the opposite wing as Hayward, it was just easier to drag him into the guard slot but it's the same difference. I think we'll see big lineups with Hayward and Joe as two wings with two traditional bigs on the floor. Hayward can probably guard every position on the floor.
* I have a hard time finding minutes for Ingles. He'll get some through injuries and foul trouble, but I think he will see many DNP's this season. If you take away those minutes from Hood that leaves him with only about 20 minutes which is too low. The team is better off just giving them to Hood imo.
* I agree that Burks will get squeezed, and Exum might be the guy to do it. His defense is much better. That said, Alec did play 25 MPG last year. I have him down to 15 MPG and I have a tough time slashing off much more minutes than that. Ingles might be a more reliable player than Burks, but it's not a terrible thing to have a high variance 15 MPG player.
 
Thanks, I could make a public one so people can try their hand at it if they'd like. It's an interesting exercise to go through. I had so many ideas I went into it with, but so many of them got thrown out the window because I couldn't find minutes for them.

The big rotation is going to be tight. If you're really trying to win, Favors and Rudy should both be playing 33+ minutes, but that leaves very little time for the bench. Lyles should be playing ~20 minutes a night, and Boris just played 18 MPG for one of the best benches in the league last year, but I could only find 12 minutes for each because you have to fit in some small ball minutes too. Quin has a serious task at hand.

It's easy to just cut minutes from Hayward, Favors, and Gobert, but that might not be a luxury we can afford. If the difference between winning and losing is playing those guys a few minutes more, Quin has to go out and win the game. I don't think people will be happy if we're losing while Hayward is sitting 8 minutes a half. It's possible that we can be like the Hawks in 14-15, but in my opinion we will have to lean on those 3 to get HCA.

I'm not sure you need to play Gobert more than 30 minutes per game, at least with a fully healthy squad. Gobert plays at a high energy level and can get worn down. Generally, when healthy, he HAD to get back in the game to stop the bleeding from our horrible bench. If our bench can hold its own or extend the lead on a consistent basis, I see no reason to not sit Rudy for longer stretches to keep him fresh for crunch time. A tired Rudy tends to do dumb things.

A bench that produces is going to make it easier to short the starters minutes, especially on extended road swings. Teams with depth win on the road. If the bench doesn't produce, then the minutes can be allocated more heavily to the starters. I'll just be happy to not see someone like Chris Johnson or Elijah Millsap checking in at the scorers table because we have no other options.
 
I'm not sure you need to play Gobert more than 30 minutes per game, at least with a fully healthy squad. Gobert plays at a high energy level and can get worn down. Generally, when healthy, he HAD to get back in the game to stop the bleeding from our horrible bench. If our bench can hold its own or extend the lead on a consistent basis, I see no reason to not sit Rudy for longer stretches to keep him fresh for crunch time. A tired Rudy tends to do dumb things.

A bench that produces is going to make it easier to short the starters minutes, especially on extended road swings. Teams with depth win on the road. If the bench doesn't produce, then the minutes can be allocated more heavily to the starters. I'll just be happy to not see someone like Chris Johnson or Elijah Millsap checking in at the scorers table because we have no other options.

I had Rudy penciled in for 30 minutes myself, but my point is that we're only going to be able to cut down on minutes if we're winning. If we're behing or the game is close Hayward is playing 36 minutes that night.Having a great bench does make it easier to short the starter minutes, but from the little bit of research I've done, starters have more impact on starters getting rest. That sounded awful, but bear with me. The primary way for Hayward, Favors, and Gobert to get more rest is to blow out teams. The bench won't lose leads like last year, but having a sizable lead in the first place is the first step. If the starting unit can be a +10 (NET) lineup they'll get plenty of rest.

The only player I think that has to play big minutes each night is Hayward. He's easily the most indispensable player on roster imo. There will be nights where we can win small so Rudy or Favors doesn't have to play a lot, but Hayward is going to be needed unless it's a blowout. I'd go into every game prepared to play him 36 minutes. Hopefully there will be games you don't need him that much, but I think you get the idea.

Are there any teams from recent seasons with comparable depth we could look at?

Few teams came up:

First team to look at is the Spurs, every year. They are the golden standard. They usually have 1-3 guys who eclipse 30 MPG, but never more than 33. No one played more than 30 MPG in their most recent championship season. The Jazz starting lineup will be good, but I don't see them reaching the level of the Spurs. Our bench isn't as good either. Manu was a killer and extended leads like no other.

Next we have Spurs east, the Atlanta Hawks. It seems so distant now, but the Hawks won 60 games two years ago. Their bench doesn't sound that spectacular on paper (Antic, Scott, Thabo, Bazemore, Shroeder), but they also didn't have a starter play over 33 minutes. Their starting lineup was good (+8.6), but that's definitely something the Jazz can achieve. My takeaway from this team is that depth doesn't just come from the bench, it can also come from the starting lineup. The Hawks had 5 starters who you'd want to play big minutes. All of them are key players. Having a balanced team like this means that your starters will play more total minutes together and almost every lineup will include 1 or 2 key players. Having every starter play 30 MPG meant that no one had to play 36 MPG.

Lastly, the post-Melo Nuggets are a good team to look at. Another short lived era, but they did have goo success while it lasted. They really only had a 9 man rotation, but they also had a very balanced starting lineup and their 4 bench guys (Miller, Chandler, Brewer, McGee) all demanded a lot of minutes. Their highest MPG guys were Lawson and Igoudala at just under 35 MPG. I think this is where Hayward will be, somewhere between 32-34 minutes a game. Denver's starting lineup was decent (+7.0), but the Jazz should be better and be able to boat race teams more often.

The toughest part to figure out is going to be the backend. I can't think of a team who had a guy like Alec Burks as their 10th man.
 
It's easy to just cut minutes from Hayward, Favors, and Gobert, but that might not be a luxury we can afford. If the difference between winning and losing is playing those guys a few minutes more, Quin has to go out and win the game. I don't think people will be happy if we're losing while Hayward is sitting 8 minutes a half. It's possible that we can be like the Hawks in 14-15, but in my opinion we will have to lean on those 3 to get HCA.

I agree. I hope that Quin doesn't feel like he has to play JJ and Diaw just to keep them happy.

I want favors, Gobert, and Lyles to be getting pretty much all the minutes at the 4 and 5.
I would like hayward, hood and burks to get most of the minutes at the 2 and 3. Plus you figure exum and hill might get a few wing minutes.

With Gobert and favors playing the 5 and favors, lyles, and johnson playing the 4, I hope that diaw never sees the court unless foul trouble or injuries forces him in the game.

JJ is not quick/fast/athletic enough to play wing effectively anymore imo.

I just don't really see a big need for 2 out of 3 of our big off season veteran acquisitions if everyone is healthy.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using JazzFanz mobile app
 
First attempt using this janky spreadsheet I whipped together. I did the rotation minute by minute because I'm a nerd. Maybe should have given a couple more minutes to Lyles, but I feel ok about it.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1G_e4GVWIBEHjiM9oGnBapEcloaTfmuUdAWIil_XvH8w/edit?usp=sharing
One problem with doing things that way is that you are forcing 5*48 = 240 total minutes per game. Whereas with players missing the occasional game due to injury, the total minutes per game are usually more like 260 iirc.
 
** Quin is going to be tempted to play Hill/Hood/Hayward/Johnson together with Favors or Gobert at the 5. That's veteran leadership, spacing and shot creation all over the floor.
I like that lineup but I think I would rather just have lyles in that lineup than JJ. Lyles can space the floor and create shots just as good as JJ (I think Lyles might be the better, more willing passer too). Only thing JJ has over Lyles is experience and ball handling (Though Lyles ain't bad in that department) and maybe defense? (I have no idea if JJ is a good defender at this point in his career)



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using JazzFanz mobile app
 
One problem with doing things that way is that you are forcing 5*48 = 240 total minutes per game. Whereas with players missing the occasional game due to injury, the total minutes per game are usually more like 260 iirc.
From the OP

if everyone remains healthy, I think it will be a challenge keeping everyone happy. Obviously injuries could solve that problem, but for now, let's assume everyone stays healthy for once.

So in this thread it seems that you are supposed to look at minute allocation for a completely healthy team.
 
One problem with doing things that way is that you are forcing 5*48 = 240 total minutes per game. Whereas with players missing the occasional game due to injury, the total minutes per game are usually more like 260 iirc.
I was thinking the same thing. [MENTION=4829]KqWIN[/MENTION], could you do another version with every minute for every position for the entire season listed? And if I'm being honest here, listing it by seconds (or at least in 15 second increments) would be a lot more accurate.

One last thing: despite my sarcasm I'm truly impressed. Teacher gave a huge assignment in the OP (I was thinking, "Holy crap, how am I ever going to get all this homework done") and the next thing I know you've gone way above and beyond the call. What I'm really saying is, I thought about giving this thing a go for a moment, but you've convinced me that my best role is to sit in the back row throwing spitballs at the back of your head instead. It's my way of saying thank you for all of the great work you're doing. That and the rep I will send as well.
 
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