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NON-JAZZ NBA PLAYOFF thread

fishonjazz said:
I mean 55% from the field for the suns (clippers were 45%) is pretty hard to duplicate. Suns shooting 100% from the line probably doesn't happen again this series. Suns only having 7 turnovers in a high scoring playoff game probably isn't the norm.

Looks like for the season the suns averaged 49% from the field (55% today), 37.8% from 3 (42.6% today), 83.4% from the line (100% today) and 12.5 turnovers (7) today.

So they weren't THAT far above their norm. Also they are peaking during the playoffs so their "norm" might actually be better than the season stats, though the season stats include games against teams like houston and okc and charlotte etc etc.
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This post aged well.
Thier field goal percentage came back to around thier average.
Thier free throw percentage came down though still pretty well above thier average.
Thier 3 point percentage came way down and was well below thier avearge.
Thier turnover went up a little though still below thier average. They are doing very good this series of not turning the ball over without cp3.


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Suns have gotta feel great. They’re 2-0 with CP3 on the mend. Payne, Booker, and Baby Amare have been unstoppable.

If you’re the Clippers, last night was a gut punch. Their team played well but P sucked. They should’ve been up by 3 if george would’ve hit his free throws. But playoff P has gotta be Playoff P…

Clippers are discovering what it’s like to defend a team that puts a ton of pressure on the rim. What Payne is doing to their defense is what they were doing to our defense.

Maybe Forrest can be that guy? We really need someone other than mitchell who can drive and get to the cup, collapsing entire defenses.
 
The Thriller said:
Suns have gotta feel great. They’re 2-0 with CP3 on the mend. Payne, Booker, and Baby Amare have been unstoppable.

If you’re the Clippers, last night was a gut punch. Their team played well but P sucked. They should’ve been up by 3 if george would’ve hit his free throws. But playoff P has gotta be Playoff P…

Clippers are discovering what it’s like to defend a team that puts a ton of pressure on the rim. What Payne is doing to their defense is what they were doing to our defense.

Maybe Forrest can be that guy? We really need someone other than mitchell who can drive and get to the cup, collapsing entire defenses.
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Of course we were up 2-0 without conley and had beat the clippers by a larger margin over the 2 games and they had kahwi playing in both our games.


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l Abach l said:
Those wins felt flukey though. We hung onto them by a thread due to Donovan's superhuman efforts.

I'm really not a fan of the live and die by the 3 offense we have
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Kinda flukey like a good free throw shooter missing 2 right at the end and then an alley oop with less than a second left when the dunker first touched the ball while it was above the cylinder?

But of course our wins were flukey and theirs were totally not.

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l Abach l said:
Those wins felt flukey though. We hung onto them by a thread due to Donovan's superhuman efforts.

I'm really not a fan of the live and die by the 3 offense we have
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I'm a huge fan. I'm not a fan of our exploitable defense (reminder: the exploitable defense was the reason the Jazz lost).
 
jom2003 said:
Tanking isn't an option short term unfortunately because we still owe a first round pick to Memphis. Wouldn't wanna waste a season just so we can give Memphis a high quality lottery pick.
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I think this is the one of the reasons we won’t see a big pivot this year. That would come the following year when we would at least get to reap the benefit of the downside.
 
NUMBERICA said:
I'm a huge fan. I'm not a fan of our exploitable defense (reminder: the exploitable defense was the reason the Jazz lost).
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Our playoff defense has not been good the last two years... not even in the Memphis series. I think we stick with Rudy but we need to change the scheme... no more extreme funneling and allowing mid range (becomes more important in the post season). Also need to get pressure on the ball and get some steals. If we are funneling I’d like to see us overplay more on the outside to get some turnovers.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Our playoff defense has not been good the last two years... not even in the Memphis series. I think we stick with Rudy but we need to change the scheme... no more extreme funneling and allowing mid range (becomes more important in the post season). Also need to get pressure on the ball and get some steals. If we are funneling I’d like to see us overplay more on the outside to get some turnovers.
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Also, anyone trying to take a charge ever might help. Our "scheme" is that everyone (besides Royce) coasts defensively, thereby increasing the exploitability of the defense and developing bad habits for when individual/perimeter defense is actually going to matter.

This is multiple years in the making. That's what frustrates me. We've been having this same conversation every year since 2018.
 
NUMBERICA said:
Also, anyone trying to take a charge ever might help. Our "scheme" is that everyone (besides Royce) coasts defensively, thereby increasing the exploitability of the defense and developing bad habits for when individual/perimeter defense is actually going to matter.

This is multiple years in the making. That's what frustrates me. We've been having this same conversation every year since 2018.
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We’ve also got a ton of “lazy” habits that are analytics based... the euro fouls, that we bitch half the time, incentivize our guys to not get back... just take a foul rather than competing anytime there is any potential fast break. If you are in the post on a mismatch rather than competing and fronting we too often just take a foul.

We just aren’t physical or tough. It’s personnel but I also think we are overly concerned about being called for fouls... I know you want to keep guys off the free throw line but we need to get up into guys and not just give them their spots. We don’t have a guy like crowder, Bev, Morris, who will get up into a guy and don’t care if it’s your star... they will jump on them grab hold fight and irritate dudes and the don’t care about your feelings. That stuff is kinda contagious and we just need it so so bad.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
We’ve also got a ton of “lazy” habits that are analytics based... the euro fouls, that we bitch half the time, incentivize our guys to not get back... just take a foul rather than competing anytime there is any potential fast break. If you are in the post on a mismatch rather than competing and fronting we too often just take a foul.

We just aren’t physical or tough. It’s personnel but I also think we are overly concerned about being called for fouls... I know you want to keep guys off the free throw line but we need to get up into guys and not just give them their spots. We don’t have a guy like crowder, Bev, Morris, who will get up into a guy and don’t care if it’s your star... they will jump on them grab hold fight and irritate dudes and the don’t care about your feelings. That stuff is kinda contagious and we just need it so so bad.
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It's almost like what people identified as good defense since basketball's inception might actually have some value. Weird.

But if it doesn't scream on a spreadsheet then I guess it's probably too stupid.
 
NUMBERICA said:
It's almost like what people identified as good defense since basketball's inception might actually have some value. Weird.

But if it doesn't scream on a spreadsheet then I guess it's probably too stupid.
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Even just mixing up rotations a little on the perimeter... like make them think/hesitate. Can't just have everyone know that Mann will be open in the corner if they get stuck... or maybe you trap/double to just change the way the other team has to react. Its a little too methodical.
 
fishonjazz said:
Of course we were up 2-0 without conley and had beat the clippers by a larger margin over the 2 games and they had kahwi playing in both our games.


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I would definitely not count them out. Their MO is to blow the first two games and then win. But last night really felt like the Clippers had the game stolen and then Push off P choked and Baby Amare posterized Zoo.
 
The Thriller said:
I would definitely not count them out. Their MO is to blow the first two games and then win. But last night really felt like the Clippers had the game stolen and then Push off P choked and Baby Amare posterized Zoo.
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One question, On that final play alley oop I saw it happen and then noticed it looked like it was being reviewed and I had to get my daughter to bed so I didn't see what went down with the review process but I remember favors tipping in a missed shot when the ball was coming off the rim but part of the ball was still above the cylinder and it was called goaltend and then there was discussion in the gamethread about the goal tend rule.

It was explained that there is and imaginary cylinder going straight up to the ceiling above the hoop. If the player touches that ball in this cylinder then its goaltending. It looked pretty certain that Ayton caught ball while it was over the hoop in this imaginary cylinder. Shouldn't it have been goaltending?
(fwiw I think the goal tend rule is stupid. I think that if its obvious that the ball isn't going to go in the basket then the players should be able to touch it. So the ayton play wouldn't be goal tend if the rules were the way i thing they should be. Neither would the favors tip in. But with the way the rules are it seems like both the Ayton alley oop and the favors tip in should be goaltending)
 
fishonjazz said:
One question, On that final play alley oop I saw it happen and then noticed it looked like it was being reviewed and I had to get my daughter to bed so I didn't see what went down with the review process but I remember favors tipping in a missed shot when the ball was coming off the rim but part of the ball was still above the cylinder and it was called goaltend and then there was discussion in the gamethread about the goal tend rule.

It was explained that there is and imaginary cylinder going straight up to the ceiling above the hoop. If the player touches that ball in this cylinder then its goaltending. It looked pretty certain that Ayton caught ball while it was over the hoop in this imaginary cylinder. Shouldn't it have been goaltending?
(fwiw I think the goal tend rule is stupid. I think that if its obvious that the ball isn't going to go in the basket then the players should be able to touch it. So the ayton play wouldn't be goal tend if the rules were the way i thing they should be. Neither would the favors tip in. But with the way the rules are it seems like both the Ayton alley oop and the favors tip in should be goaltending)
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Jackson and Van Gundy said it was considered a “live ball” since it was inbounded, not a regular pass or shot, and therefore couldn’t even be considered a goal tend. So they made it sound like you could goal tend offensively if it was an inbounds pass.
I’ll be honest, I hadn’t thought about this before so I could just be misunderstanding them completely. Anyone else feel free to jump in!

On twitter there were analysts who noticed 3 things:

1. Cousins Didnt position himself properly to take away the lob. It seemed like he was head on crowder which actually made the lob pass easy. I know you might find this hard to believe, since I know how much you love cousins ;)
2. Batum took a wrong step.
3. Zoo just wasn’t physical/quick enough to take it away.

All of which makes sense. I think where the Clippers really blew it was the free throws. Even if George splits them, that unreal lob only sends the game into overtime. If he makes both? Then the lob isn’t even an option.
 
How did the Clippers end up with Reggie jackson? It seems like a team already stacked shouldn’t have had the money to sign him. He’s a quality guard. They have 3 guards who could probably start/be key bench players for us, Beverley, Rondo, and Jackson.
 
A few years ago the Suns won on the same play but with like 0.1 on the clock. It’s correct that it’s not considered a shot so the offensive player just needs to touch it. It amazed me how few people learned about this since then (meaning coaches) because we’ve been in numerous situations where it would come in handy.
 
infection said:
A few years ago the Suns won on the same play but with like 0.1 on the clock. It’s correct that it’s not considered a shot so the offensive player just needs to touch it. It amazed me how few people learned about this since then (meaning coaches) because we’ve been in numerous situations where it would come in handy.
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can the inbounder try to just make the shot from out of bounds or would that not count? What if the inbounder tries to throw the lob but it hits the rim and is still above the cylinder and a player tips it in? Does that count.
 
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