gandalfe
Well-Known Member
If I could just do it for a few days, I would...
Proof of vaccination or negative COVID test required to attend games
- Thread starter dipship31
- Start date
magic
Well-Known Member
"These data further indicate that COVID-19 vaccines offer better protection than natural immunity alone and that vaccines, even after prior infection, help prevent reinfections."
You illiterate ****ing pig. It provides better protection than natural immunity ALONE. You can't just drop words out of a sentence to fit your narrative.
Here is the end of the summary of the article (since you probably didn't bother clicking on the link: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7032e1.htm?s_cid=mm7032e1_w
First it spells out 5 limitations of the study and says you can't use this article as causation:
"The findings in this report are subject to at least five limitations. First, reinfection was not confirmed through whole genome sequencing, which would be necessary to definitively prove that the reinfection was caused from a distinct virus relative to the first infection. Although in some cases the repeat positive test could be indicative of prolonged viral shedding or failure to clear the initial viral infection (9), given the time between initial and subsequent positive molecular tests among participants in this study, reinfection is the most likely explanation. Second, persons who have been vaccinated are possibly less likely to get tested. Therefore, the association of reinfection and lack of vaccination might be overestimated. Third, vaccine doses administered at federal or out-of-state sites are not typically entered in KYIR, so vaccination data are possibly missing for some persons in these analyses. In addition, inconsistencies in name and date of birth between KYIR and NEDSS might limit ability to match the two databases. Because case investigations include questions regarding vaccination, and KYIR might be updated during the case investigation process, vaccination data might be more likely to be missing for controls. Thus, the OR might be even more favorable for vaccination. Fourth, although case-patients and controls were matched based on age, sex, and date of initial infection, other unknown confounders might be present. Finally, this is a retrospective study design using data from a single state during a 2-month period; therefore, these findings cannot be used to infer causation. Additional prospective studies with larger populations are warranted to support these findings."
Then it reiterates that the study was done on persons previously infected with covid:
"These findings suggest that among persons with previous SARS-CoV-2 infection, full vaccination provides additional protection against reinfection. Among previously infected Kentucky residents, those who were not vaccinated were more than twice as likely to be reinfected compared with those with full vaccination. All eligible persons should be offered vaccination, including those with previous SARS-CoV-2 infection, to reduce their risk for future infection."
You have no older family members or young kids in your family? Colleagues? Friends?
What happens when you get in an accident or diagnosed with cancer and will need to be in unnecessary pain for months because you can't get an elective surgery?
I have older colleagues, friends and family that are more vulnerable, or ineligible for vaccine currently. It isn't about me.
Again, in any combo, (Covid before vacc, Covid after vacc, or Vacc without getting Covid) vaccination will provide more protection than without, so I am not sure what there is to argue.
Also, getting the virus just to prevent the virus seems to be about the stupidest idea I ever heard.
magic
Well-Known Member
I dislike responding to these posts because it shows the person didn't take time to read through the thread.
One of the points I made multiple times is that an unvaccinated person who had covid is more protected than a vaccinated person who never had covid. And gandalf, the illiterate pig, tried to argue otherwise.
Yes, I would recommend to anyone that wants to minimize effects of covid to get vaccinated. But nobody is arguing against that. Not everyone needs to minimize those effects. And this circles back to another point I brought up that risk threshold is subjective. The point is with the vaccine available, life can resume without discriminating against the unvaccinated, since the risk is incredibly low.
Also, I'm done with this thread most people here seem to be pious or straight up bad people. I've had my fill of using science to debunk the hate-filled drivel.
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SteakNEggs
Well-Known Member
Ok so if your colleagues are vulnerable, who’s job is it to protect them? It’s unfortunate but it’s on them.
As far as elective surgery? Maybe not fire people?
Below are the latest numbers from England regarding outcomes of patients hospitalized with the Delta variant. According to Public Health England's COVID-19 variant report, between February 1, 2021 and September 12, 2021, 52% of delta cases, 47% of emergency care visits, and 70% of delta deaths had at least one of dose of the vaccine.
Of the 2,542 deaths recorded in the sample, 1,779 (70%) had received at least their first dose of the vaccine. Whereas, 722 (30%) were unvaccinated.
Of course, there is very likely a propensity of individuals with advanced age and co-morbidities to take the vaccine relative to younger, healthier cohorts. So it is expected that this group would experience more deaths due to their being more vulnerable to the disease at the outset.
As of this week, as many as 89% of England's population are reported to be vaccinated. If we choose a median date during the term of this study and assume that roughly 60% of the population was vaccinated, then vaccinated individuals do index lower for emergency care visit (Index of 78), but index higher to ultimately succumb to the disease (Index of 117).
I have to concede that this data suggests vaccination among individuals under the age of 50 will reduce the likelihood that they will need to be admitted to an emergency room. Without knowing the actual percentage of people under the age of 50 from the population at large who were vaccinated during the term of this study, it is difficult to gauge just how big the impact is. However, there is enough data here to suggest that vaccination within the population as a whole will reduce the burden on hospitals to some degree.
Whether this factor is enough for governments or businesses to seek to compel vaccination is a matter for debate. I regard vaccination as a matter of individual assessment and judgement.
Of the 2,542 deaths recorded in the sample, 1,779 (70%) had received at least their first dose of the vaccine. Whereas, 722 (30%) were unvaccinated.
Of course, there is very likely a propensity of individuals with advanced age and co-morbidities to take the vaccine relative to younger, healthier cohorts. So it is expected that this group would experience more deaths due to their being more vulnerable to the disease at the outset.
As of this week, as many as 89% of England's population are reported to be vaccinated. If we choose a median date during the term of this study and assume that roughly 60% of the population was vaccinated, then vaccinated individuals do index lower for emergency care visit (Index of 78), but index higher to ultimately succumb to the disease (Index of 117).
I have to concede that this data suggests vaccination among individuals under the age of 50 will reduce the likelihood that they will need to be admitted to an emergency room. Without knowing the actual percentage of people under the age of 50 from the population at large who were vaccinated during the term of this study, it is difficult to gauge just how big the impact is. However, there is enough data here to suggest that vaccination within the population as a whole will reduce the burden on hospitals to some degree.
Whether this factor is enough for governments or businesses to seek to compel vaccination is a matter for debate. I regard vaccination as a matter of individual assessment and judgement.
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The Thriller
Well-Known Member
Do you have evidence that medical personnel have been fired in utah?
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
This is such a weird talking point to me. As if we all don’t share in the protection of fellow members of society. One would’ve thought that after nearly 2 years and 700,000+ dead some of you would’ve changed your selfish “im on an island” views. Guess you can’t fix stupid.
The more the virus circulates the more chance for it to mutate and sideline existing vaccines. You may not get sick now or ever or it could be a breeze but down the line, it could grow as a threat again.
This post shows your ignorance. You just don't know what you are talking about.
My wife's team of specialists is down to 50% being able to work because half of the team has family members in quarantine, including us. This leaves those working left to triage, leaving many patients with a lack of care. Others have quit or retired early due to the stress the overwhelming # of Covid patients have caused, but zero firings/dismissals.
Not one person on her staff has been fired. In general, the medical community is vaccinated.
SteakNEggs
Well-Known Member
As I said hate