What's new
By:

Zach Lavine's rise to greatness

I gotta go now, buddy. I got grownup things that need to get done. I'll check in later.

We can get through this
 
NAOS said:
Hacl,

I think you need to hear some Basketball Analytics 101:

Axiom #1: There is no action a basketball player can take which isn't somehow affected by the play of his teammates.

Some actions are less affected than others. For example, a guard's ability to stay in front of his man on defense isn't as affected as, say, his success at team defense. For example, free-throw shooting is much less affected than, say, finishing at the rim. But, nevertheless, all actions are somehow affected.

AXIOM #2: (a) If all actions are affected, then there will be no statistical representation of a player's individual action which isn't "polluted by" or "alloyed to" the play of another player. (b) All statistics of individual performance are skewed by team-play in ways that are NOT revealed by the statistic itself.

CONCLUSION:

When you demand to know if RPM or any other statistic is "effected" by teammates, then you are revealing your ignorance. The answer is "Yes, just like every other statistic.... So what's your point?"

What you don't seem to realize is that RPM and the other stats I listed make it easy for the analyst to acknowledge to affect of teammates. They allow us to say "It looks like Zach LaVine made a bad team worse."


Does this help?
Click to expand...

The only thing you are doing right now is providing proof in the future that your statistics don't tell the whole story about a player. Especially not the ones you provided. And actually can be quite misleading.

So no, that does not help.
 
King Cy said:
I still think it would. Not many 2nd year players average 18 ppg w/ 5 assist and 4 rebounds. That's a stat line that took Hayward 5 years to achieve.
Click to expand...

King Cy said:
Disagree completely. There is definitely the minutes and opportunity for LaVine to get the averages Hack predicted if he was good enough. He will probably get around 12-14 shots per game, which is enough to average 18 points. He won't though and it will be more like 13-14 points.
Click to expand...

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/cartemi01.html

In Philadelphia you can get stats that are comparable to your 18-5-4 from a "raw" perspective even as a rookie.
 
King Cy said:
MCW is a do-it-all kind of guard though. LaVine doesn't play that style where he just rakes up rebounds, assist, or even FT attempts. I think he would average a point or 2 more while taking 2-3 more shots and shooting worse %.
Click to expand...

My argument was just: in the right situation you can do pretty ludacris stats with limited talent. And that's not saying that LaVine is a slouch. Just that I don't see him having that opportunity in Minnesota yet with the amount of talent that will see exposure.
 
BTP said:
My argument was just: in the right situation you can do pretty ludacris stats with limited talent. And that's not saying that LaVine is a slouch. Just that I don't see him having that opportunity in Minnesota yet with the amount of talent that will see exposure.
Click to expand...

I think it has less to do with the talent around him and more with the green light.
 
Hack said:
The only thing you are doing right now is providing proof in the future that your statistics don't tell the whole story about a player. Especially not the ones you provided. And actually can be quite misleading.

So no, that does not help.
Click to expand...

I never said that statistics tell the whole story about the player. I said something quite contrary to that, and your error in comprehension lets me know how far off you are here.

What I said was, in the field of sports statistics, there are various measurements of achievement, all of which have something to do with the individual player's teammates. Some of these statistics acknowledge and adjust themselves for team play better than others. Inherent in all of these points is the notion that statistics are just one way to help support claims about an individual players performance.

This is extraordinarily basic stuff, dude.

Back on topic: As far as statistics are concerned, there is no way to build a good case for Zach LaVine right now. His supporters are riding on the euphoric waves of "potential". Most of them are dazzled by his raw athletic abilities. But, raw athletic abilities don't guarantee success in the NBA.

So, what's your evidence about Zach Lavine & His Sure Thing?? Pls, dude, what's your evidence? Do you have more than one month of games (particularly the last month of the regular season when there are plenty of stat-stuffing games to be played)? What else you got?
 
NAOS said:
I never said that statistics tell the whole story about the player. I said something quite contrary to that, and your error in comprehension lets me know how far off you are here.

What I said was, in the field of sports statistics, there are various measurements of achievement, all of which have something to do with the individual player's teammates. Some of these statistics acknowledge and adjust themselves for team play better than others. Inherent in all of these points is the notion that statistics are just one way to help support claims about an individual players performance.

This is extraordinarily basic stuff, dude.

Back on topic: As far as statistics are concerned, there is no way to build a good case for Zach LaVine right now. His supporters are riding on the euphoric waves of "potential". Most of them are dazzled by his raw athletic abilities. But, raw athletic abilities don't guarantee success in the NBA.

So, what's your evidence about Zach Lavine & His Sure Thing?? Pls, dude, what's your evidence? Do you have more than one month of games (particularly the last month of the regular season when there are plenty of stat-stuffing games to be played)? What else you got?
Click to expand...

You are just gonna have to take my word for it.
 
LaVine ignores Gorgi Dieng, who has Aaron Brooks posted, and LaVine takes a contested jumper that misses, announcers rip into his IQ lol.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page
Back
Top