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Is Exum The Worst Player in The NBA Who Gets Minutes?

Cy said:
Hack vs. GVC Round 2
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Nah!

It's over. I knocked him out. I'm not gonna kick him while he is down.


Back to the discussion.

Exum sucks cause he's young. Probably won't t suck later.

Now the thread can be closed.
 
ONE LOVE said:
Let's just remind ourselves that he is still two years younger than when Trey entered the league and nearly four years younger than Carter-Williams.
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And Ex is only 6 months younger than Giannis Antetokounmpo is today....

he was 2 months younger than Kyrie Irving was when he was drafted, who was a 19 year old rookie point guard, and Irving went on to average 19/5/4 on 47%/40%/87% his rookie campaign.

a 19 year old rookie stephon marbury put up 16/8/3 on 41%/36%/72%

Everyone uses this "19 years old" thing, and while it does have significance, it cant just let us just dismiss everything that happens on the court... so lets look at him compared to the other players in his situation. There have been 92 other rookies 19 and younger, with 28 of them being guards.

Dante's Rank out of the 92 other rookies 19 and younger | rank out of the 28 guards

Efg% - 49/92 | 13/28
win shares - 80/92 | 23/28
PER - 77/92 | 24/28

He could be worse, but he could certainly be better, even for being 19.
 
jope said:
And Ex is only 6 months younger than Giannis Antetokounmpo is today....

he was 2 months younger than Kyrie Irving was when he was drafted, who was a 19 year old rookie point guard, and Irving went on to average 19/5/4 on 47%/40%/87% his rookie campaign.

a 19 year old rookie stephon marbury put up 16/8/3 on 41%/36%/72%

Everyone uses this "19 years old" thing, and while it does have significance, it cant just let us just dismiss everything that happens on the court... so lets look at him compared to the other players in his situation. There have been 92 other rookies 19 and younger, with 28 of them being guards.

Dante's Rank out of the 92 other rookies 19 and younger | rank out of the 28 guards

Efg% - 49/92 | 13/28
win shares - 80/92 | 23/28
PER - 77/92 | 24/28

He could be worse, but he could certainly be better, even for being 19.
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Exactly. Giannis is a good comparisson becaue both Giannis and Dante both came from really crappy foreign competition and were very young coming into the NBA. Giannis showed a ton of potential, a lot of flashes. Dante flashes are pretty much limited to the defensive end. Offensively he makes some decent reads and passes, but that is because he never looks at the rim.
 
Cy said:
Exactly. Giannis is a good comparisson becaue both Giannis and Dante both came from really crappy foreign competition and were very young coming into the NBA. Giannis showed a ton of potential, a lot of flashes. Dante flashes are pretty much limited to the defensive end. Offensively he makes some decent reads and passes, but that is because he never looks at the rim.
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The positive things I have seen from is he has flashed some pretty nice passing skills, his shot is better than we expected, and his length looks like it could be a defensive factor.


I think his biggest problem is that he plays a little timid. He probably has more inside him right now that we just aren't seeing. Maybe he is trying to hard to do the right things. When he feels more comfortable with who he is out there the game will slow down and he will play with more confidence.

I like him. I don't think he'll be a superstar, but he will still probably be a low end all star one day.
 
Dante is three years away from being three years away. In my opinion, DL got sucked in on the Exum hype. If Exum would have played one year of college, I seriously don't think he would have been a #5 pick regardless of how well he did in his AAU game. Some rookies, you can tell have great potential to be a good player. I just don't see it. It doesn't matter how fast you are if you are completely out of gas three minutes into a game and your only 19. Who cares how quick you are if you can't do anything with the ball in the lane. I know he's only 19, but I would be really surprised if Exum develops into a really good player. Our back court sucks and I blame DL.
 
Hack said:
The positive things I have seen from is he has flashed some pretty nice passing skills, his shot is better than we expected, and his length looks like it could be a defensive factor.


I think his biggest problem is that he plays a little timid. He probably has more inside him right now that we just aren't seeing. Maybe he is trying to hard to do the right things. When he feels more comfortable with who he is out there the game will slow down and he will play with more confidence.

I like him. I don't think he'll be a superstar, but he will still probably be a low end all star one day.
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Is his shot better than we expected? What exactly did we expect? Because his shot is awful.
 
sojodave said:
Dante is three years away from being three years away. In my opinion, DL got sucked in on the Exum hype. If Exum would have played one year of college, I seriously don't think he would have been a #5 pick regardless of how well he did in his AAU game. Some rookies, you can tell have great potential to be a good player. I just don't see it. It doesn't matter how fast you are if you are completely out of gas three minutes into a game and your only 19. Who cares how quick you are if you can't do anything with the ball in the lane. I know he's only 19, but I would be really surprised if Exum develops into a really good player. Our back court sucks and I blame DL.
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I'm not sure why you think 19 year olds somehow possess superior stamina. They don't. Also, Exum always has a goofy look on his face that makes him look like he's always tired, but I haven't noticed this being a problem since preseason.
 
sojodave said:
Dante is three years away from being three years away. In my opinion, DL got sucked in on the Exum hype. If Exum would have played one year of college, I seriously don't think he would have been a #5 pick regardless of how well he did in his AAU game. Some rookies, you can tell have great potential to be a good player. I just don't see it. It doesn't matter how fast you are if you are completely out of gas three minutes into a game and your only 19. Who cares how quick you are if you can't do anything with the ball in the lane. I know he's only 19, but I would be really surprised if Exum develops into a really good player. Our back court sucks and I blame DL.
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Small point but Exum never played AAU. I agree it is maddening that won't even try to attack the rim.
 
sojodave said:
Dante is three years away from being three years away. In my opinion, DL got sucked in on the Exum hype. If Exum would have played one year of college, I seriously don't think he would have been a #5 pick regardless of how well he did in his AAU game. Some rookies, you can tell have great potential to be a good player. I just don't see it. It doesn't matter how fast you are if you are completely out of gas three minutes into a game and your only 19. Who cares how quick you are if you can't do anything with the ball in the lane. I know he's only 19, but I would be really surprised if Exum develops into a really good player. Our back court sucks and I blame DL.
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To be fair, we'd be a lot better with Burks in the lineup and Hood could still be a quality rotation player.
I don't blame DL too much. It's not like he went against draft boards and took Burke or Exum a lot higher than where they were slotted. In fact, Burke was seen as "slipping" a bit on draft day and Exum was always mentioned in the top-4. Orlando was the team that surprisingly "reached" when they took Gordon. I think most of us agreed Exum was the highest risk/reward player in the draft. Embiid had his injury, but at least he had a body of work to judge against. Not saying Exum's a bust. But even if he NEVER develops into a top-tier starter, it was a risk Utah had to take. I think DL KNEW the team would have another high lottery pick this year. So fail with Dante and there's still a means by which to add another starting-quality player to the roster.
 
Apparently ESPN thinks that Exum Stauskus and LaVine are the worst rotation players in the league. Not Exum. Phew, we really dodged a bullet there...

https://insider.espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/12250482/three-rookies-need-major-adjustments

Its and insider article. I will post the parts about LaVine and Stauskus.
Nik Stauskas, Kings
In 2011, the Kings drafted a high-level shooter and scorer, Jimmer Fredette, hoping to improve their overall team shooting. But the fit never worked because Fredette simply couldn't stop taking bad shots and offered little else on the court (except his 3-point shot). Ultimately, Fredette, who was drafted one spot ahead of Klay Thompson, was released after just two seasons. Although he has had one good shooting season since that point, he is hanging onto his spot in the NBA in New Orleans.

Stauskas was taken by the Kings in this past draft for similar reasons. The Kings finished 23rd in effective field goal percentage last season, and Stauskas was arguably the best shooter in the draft. He made shots from all over the court at Michigan, inside and outside of the 3-point line. So even though the Kings had just drafted another well-regarded shooting guard the season prior (Ben McLemore), the Kings must have figured they couldn't lose by taking another shooter. Unfortunately, Stauskas has been mostly awful so far.

Stauskas ranks second-to-last in PER and 20th in true shooting percentage among the 27 rookies who qualify (based on minutes per game and total games played), and his shooting numbers rank among the lowest in the NBA among all shooting guards. Because he is also a poor rebounder, passer and defender, while averaging less than one free throw attempt per game, there is an argument that Stauskas is currently the worst rotation player in the NBA. Advanced metrics support this, as he is in the bottom 10 in EWA (estimated wins added) and real plus-minus among all players.

So why is he struggling? The main reason is Stauskas has just made poor decision after poor decision on offense all season long.

Yes, he's been shooting better from 3 this month, so there is a chance he can rewrite his rookie season before it ends. However, if his shot selection does not take a big step forward, it may not matter much.


Credit: Comcast Sports Network

Too often, Stauskas is forcing long 2-point shots, "forcing" because he is well covered on these shots and oftentimes there are four seconds or more left on the shot clock. If there is a worse shot than a long 2-pointer, it is the well-defended long 2-pointer, and Stauskas takes far too many of these shots.


Credit: Comcast Sports Network

The forced shots and subsequent misses have only hurt his overall shooting rhythm when he attempts open 3s, which is one big reason why he shot so poorly from deep earlier this season. If Stauskas wants to get out of the hole he's standing in, he has to first stop digging.


Zach LaVine, Timberwolves
If Stauskas isn't the league's worst rotation player, it's LaVine. But LaVine's struggles should come as less of a surprise considering he wasn't a good college player last year at UCLA. For that reason, LaVine has a much steeper learning curve, though he has more time to figure things out at only 19 years old.

Injuries in Minnesota have forced LaVine into action he just isn't ready for. Although he has had some good games and plays, he ranks dead last in real plus-minus and last in defensive real plus-minus. Meanwhile, despite being so tall, long and athletic for his position, only a few smaller guards rank below him in offensive rebound rate. (Russell Westbrook's ORR was more than eight times higher than LaVine's mark as a rookie.) In short, he does not know how to use his athletic gifts on the basketball court.

But more importantly, perhaps, is that he has no idea how to play as a point guard at this level, often choosing to take long jumpers when the ball is in his hands. Like Westbrook, his handle and ability to bounce off the floor enable him to get an open shot over just about any kind of defense, but making those kinds of shots is far harder than just taking them. And there is no merit in only getting shots off; the idea that a player is valued simply because he can "get his own shot" is proved to be wrong by LaVine (and others).


Credit: Fox Sports Oklahoma

It wouldn't be so bad if he was able to draw fouls when he attacks the rim or forces a shot up over a contesting defender, but LaVine is not able to do that either -- he takes fewer than two free throws per game. It really looks like he prefers getting a clean shot off over making the shot or drawing the foul, a sign of just how underdeveloped his basketball IQ is at this stage.


Credit: Fox Sports Oklahoma

Again, LaVine is young and has time to figure things out, but the market for guards who can't make shots or think, while also not using their athletic talent, is very low. LaVine had a strong game, decision-wise, Wednesday night in a win over Boston which should give him something positive to build on and a reference point moving forward.
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Hack said:
I like him. I don't think he'll be a superstar, but he will still probably be a low end all star one day.
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Utah and Australia combine for a population of about 26 million people. Steph Curry had the most all-star votes this year with 1.5 million. Let's get a campaign going to help him become an all-star starter next year. I'm pretty sure that will force the NBA to change the stupid fan voting process.
 
What's weird about Exum is that when teams did their psych/personality tests on him, there were reports that he came out in the elite percentile as far as mental toughness/competitiveness. Scores that reminded them of a Kobe personality. Now he plays so timid. The jump to the NBA from Aussie kid ball has obviously been as steep of a learning curve as there could be. I think that killer instinct is still inside Exum, but his transition to the NBA has been a shell shock for him, so we're not seeing it right now.

Hopefully he buffs up this summer (I think his frail body makes him scared to take a hit and risk injury, thus he doesn't even try to score when driving), develops more skills, and let's the game come to him. A year in the NBA should help him calm down, show him what he needs to work on to then come back next season and stop playing like a scared ****.

I'll reserve judgement on him for now, but if he doesn't show dramatic improvement by this time next year, we've really got something to worry about. He's definitely got the most to prove out of anyone on the team. But I have faith in him.
 
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