Where does Utah fit in the West?

[fishonjazz]

For me I think we have great defenders and a defensive minded coach already in place.
What we need is more balance.... A great scorer/offensive player.

The warriors have really good defenders (draymond, bogut, etc) and really good scorers (curry, Thompson) and not all those guys are good on both ends of the court.

Same with the spurs. Aldridge isn't much of a defender. Neither is ginobli or parker. They are there to score.

Not all players can be like Leonard and cp3 and be really good on both ends.

The jazz already have Gobert, favors, and exum. Stud, terrific defenders. What the jazz do not have is a dude who can drop 40-50 points in a game a few times a year and frequently hit the 30 point mark.

That's what the jazz should be chasing right now. Give up hayward, Burks, trey, draft picks for a dude that can score like that.
Or trade for a high draft pick if there might be a dude like that in the draft.

Of course there is a good chance that there simply isn't the opportunity to trade for, draft, or acquire in free agency a guy like that.

 

[NAOS]

Hayward hood and Exum will start next year. Exum figures to be elite defensively Hayward is very underrated defensively. Hood isn't a beast defensively, but he's also not bad. I'm not sure what defensive problems that need addressing you're referring to?

why do you cakky idiots fail to acknowledge our 4th quarter defensive problems? Why do you expect other posters to assume Exum will be juss teh besst? Please stop taking the bad hallucinogens for one day. Detox, pls.

 

[NAOS]

Maybe not but the point is that the jazz have lots of good defenders. Hayward, Exum, Gobert and favors all have all nba defensive team potential.

I don't see any elite scorers though. (Maybe hood gets there. Maybe not)

That's hyper-hopey -- but keep riding high with it if that feels good, brough

 

[NAOS]

On the defensive end Exum goes a long way towards that.

Is that proven yet?
Also, what about the injury?

We need help on the perimeter, regardless of Exum. It doesn't need to be a starting-caliber stud, but we need a specialist at the very least.

 

[green]

I know I Know Defense Defense Defense but...

Love for Favors is the kind of trade that should happen. Both teams would be better.

Exum
Hood
Hayward
Love
Gobert

Love would fit in perfectly with us. He would spread the floor, rebound, be great in the pick and roll with Hayward/Exum/Hood.

Anyone who wouldn't trade Favors for Love...well, thank god they aren't our GM.

 

[green]

Lyles does not equal Love

I actually think that with all that length(especially Exum & Gobert) we would be well equipped to hide Love's defensive shortcomings. Love may even look like a fairly decent defender given that his role would be smaller than it would be on almost any other team. Remember people criticized the hell out of Dirk's D and that dude has a ring. Either way I think that Love would more than make up for the difference on the other end of the floor.

I wouldn't want Love to play any defense. Between Exum, Hayward and Gobert, we would be above average defensively.

I would want Love to score 25 a game. That would be his role.

 

[silesian]

There are NINE teams that have legit stars on their teams. We don't have one. And no. Hayward isn't on the level of any of the players above.

I think you must have time traveled from 2010 if you think Howard is still a legit NBA star.

This stuff drives me a bit crazy since everyone has a convenient and amorphous definition of "legit star" or "superstar" --some say it must be a person who take over a game offensively, some say a one-dimensional defensive player can be a superstar. Some say that you must be an all-time great to lead a team to a title. Then when someone outside the category wins a title, folks use ex poste facto logic to say "well, they really were a superstar, we just didn't see it until the won a title" or they write exceptions to the rule (Chauncy, Bill Walton, etc). And those who don't win a title, they say it is because they really weren't a superstar after all.

The Kevin Love argument is silly. He led the TWolves to greatness (sarcasm). And if he were co-superstar with LeBron and Kyrie, who could beat them? How does a two-time All NBA second teamer qualify as a superstar in the same category with LeBron, Curry and Durant -- he is nowhere near these guys. One can credibly argue that Love is better than Hayward, but not that he is in a completely separate category.

 

[green]

I think Rodney Hood can be a 23+ ppg scorer. Efficiently. And I think he can do that within read-option style sets that get others involved. And, I think Exum will be able to contribute to good offense.

^When you pair this with elite defense, then the future could still be bright.

Hood is the new Burks. I always said Burks ceiling was sixth man of the year. Looks like I may be right.

Hood is so over-rated here. He is a solid starter. Nothing more. Utah needs a starting role wing player now.

 

[green]

I think you must have time traveled from 2010 if you think Howard is still a legit NBA star.

This stuff drives me a bit crazy since everyone has a convenient and amorphous definition of "legit star" or "superstar" --some say it must be a person who take over a game offensively, some say a one-dimensional defensive player can be a superstar. Some say that you must be an all-time great to lead a team to a title. Then when someone outside the category wins a title, folks use ex poste facto logic to say "well, they really were a superstar, we just didn't see it until the won a title" or they write exceptions to the rule (Chauncy, Bill Walton, etc). And those who don't win a title, they say it is because they really weren't a superstar after all.

The Kevin Love argument is silly. He led the TWolves to greatness (sarcasm). And if he were co-superstar with LeBron and Kyrie, who could beat them? How does a two-time All NBA second teamer qualify as a superstar in the same category with LeBron, Curry and Durant -- he is nowhere near these guys. One can credibly argue that Love is better than Hayward, but not that he is in a completely separate category.

You are all over the place with this post. I don't even know where to start.

Hayward is not a star.

Love is a star.

It's that simple. If you want any hope of doing anything, you need a star.

Love can average 25 pts a game. Not many people can do that. No one on the Jazz can do that. Love is a PF that is an elite level rebounder and can stretch the floor with his three point shot.

We HOPE Lyles can do that, and reality is, Lyles will probably never be as good as Love.

Those of you knocking Love...just don't. It doesn't speak well of you.

 

[Stoked]

Hood is the new Burks. I always said Burks ceiling was sixth man of the year. Looks like I may be right.

Hood is so over-rated here. He is a solid starter. Nothing more. Utah needs a starting role wing player now.

Hood is a starting role wing player. Now if you mean a superstar wing player than sure that is better than Hood and I'd take it. But Hood is a fantastic player.

 

[green]

For those of you on the Hood bandwagon, do you realize that he did not improve from year 1 to year 2?

Look at his first year vs his second year, per 36 mins:

15 pts, 1.5 TO's, 1 steal, 3 assists, 4 rebs, 46% 2ptFG, 37% 3pt, 13 FG attempts.
16 pts, 2 TO's, 1 steal, 3 assits, 4 rebs, 47% 2ptFG, 36% 3pt, 14 FG attempts.

Hood's big "improvement" was getting more minutes. Other than that, he is the exact same player.

Expecting him to jump up to a 20 pts a game scorer is silly. It's not realistic. He is what he is. A nice wing player. Much like Burks, he is a great bench guy or a solid starter.

 

[Stoked]

You are all over the place with this post. I don't even know where to start.

Hayward is not a star.

Love is a star.

It's that simple. If you want any hope of doing anything, you need a star.

Love can average 25 pts a game. Not many people can do that. No one on the Jazz can do that. Love is a PF that is an elite level rebounder and can stretch the floor with his three point shot.

We HOPE Lyles can do that, and reality is, Lyles will probably never be as good as Love.

Those of you knocking Love...just don't. It doesn't speak well of you.

Neither does Love's history. Yes we need a star to carry us to a chip. Yes, Love is a great player. No, Love is not a player capable of carrying Utah to a chip.

 

[Stoked]

Is that proven yet?
Also, what about the injury?

We need help on the perimeter, regardless of Exum. It doesn't need to be a starting-caliber stud, but we need a specialist at the very least.

The only evidence was have, 1 season, says he is. So it is not set in stone but it is more proven than saying he isn't a good perimeter defender.

 

[akirac73]

But how are we supposed to get Love if we also need to max Harrison Barnes? You need to coordinate how this works with PGAB.

 

[NAOS]

For those of you on the Hood bandwagon, do you realize that he did not improve from year 1 to year 2?

Look at his first year vs his second year, per 36 mins:

15 pts, 1.5 TO's, 1 steal, 3 assists, 4 rebs, 46% 2ptFG, 37% 3pt, 13 FG attempts.
16 pts, 2 TO's, 1 steal, 3 assits, 4 rebs, 47% 2ptFG, 36% 3pt, 14 FG attempts.

Hood's big "improvement" was getting more minutes. Other than that, he is the exact same player.

Expecting him to jump up to a 20 pts a game scorer is silly. It's not realistic. He is what he is. A nice wing player. Much like Burks, he is a great bench guy or a solid starter.

lol at those stats. GTFOutta here. The whole ****ing world has moved on from those simple stats. How many Monsters today, brough?

 

[NAOS]

The only evidence was have, 1 season, says he is. So it is not set in stone but it is more proven than saying he isn't a good perimeter defender.

it was not a full season.

 

[tleikheen]

Jazz had a 29 game sampling of the type of defense they could play with Exum's perimeter defense combined with Gobert's interior defense.Pretty damn eyeopening holding opponents to 89ppg. This year without that perimeter defense the Jazz held opponents to 95.9 ppg.
Can the Jazz return towards that 89 ppg they did before.With Exum 21 years old ,stronger and a year of watching and learning NBA defenses from the front row it wouldn't surprise to see the Jazz defense (if healthy) lead the NBA in team defense ,say 92 ppg.
Even finishing #28 in team offense the Jazz had a plus 1.8 in pt.differential.
Jazz were in the top 2 youngest team and the NBA's slowest paced team.Exum was one of the top fastest players in the NBA and if he returns to that ,the Jazz won't be walking up the ball with Hayward and Hood .The ball will be moving up alot faster up the court with Exum bringing it up ,the offense will score more pts. Say 100ppg ,thats 2.3 ppg more.....Now your talking elite ,going from 1.8 to 8 ppg pt differential.
This is what I think why the Jazz are so high on Exum and what they think having him running the show as PG on offense and defense will be.

So what are your thoughts on this , Jazz better on defense and offense, what is the best guess on the pt differential and is this reasonable?

 

[NAOS]

The offense could improve by a handful of points per game the very moment Lyndsey decides to actually build out the whole roster. Like, build it for an actual run in the playoffs.

Ingles, Johnson, Pleiss, Burke, and Booker are, with respect to offense, easily upgradable. Look at what Portland did to the middle and end of its roster in a single ****ing offseason. One. And then look what it's getting them right now.

Our offensive ineptitude this year points directly at Lyndsey, and indirectly at everybody else.

 

[Stoked]

it was not a full season.

And yet it is all we have to go on and it points to him being a great defender on the wing. I am not arguing against picking up a wing defender. I am saying all the evidence we have says that Exum will help address that issue. It'll take more than 1 to have elite perimeter D

 

[Stoked]

it was not a full season.

And yet it is all we have to go on and it points to him being a great defender on the wing. I am not arguing against picking up a wing defender. I am saying all the evidence we have says that Exum will help address that issue. It'll take more than 1 to have elite perimeter D