Trade Rumors Involving the Jazz

[Elizah Huge]

All of this is false. Idiot!!! Gobert isn’t hindered it’s the rest of the team you idiot!!!

Rudy’s offense is more in line with the modern NBA than most centers in the league today you stupid idiot

Lmao, what offense? He has no post moves. He sets screens that’s his offense.

 

[Jingled]

#1 - I never said let him have a major voice
#2 - we don't know that he's going to ask out
#3 - if he does get traded in a year, that doesn't "leave the franchise in shambles"

Trading him in a year while Rudy takes any sort of step back with that albatross contract could leave us hurting. That's why you trade Rudy now while he has his best value. Doesn't matter what we do with Don - Rudy needs to go.

#1-Is your name Ryan Smith? I never said that you said to let him have a major voice, I said that that's what Ryan is going to do based on reports I've read and listened to.

#2 Every single reporter with inside knowledge thinks he's asking out...I mean everyone, both local and national. Andy Larsen, Tony Jones, Eric Walden, Ben Dowsett, Dan Clayton, Spence Checketts, Tim MacMahon, Brian Windhorst, Tim Bontemps, Zach Lowe, Kevin O'Connor, Jake Fischer all think he's asking out eventually. I'm sure I missed some.

#3 If we trade our best player in Rudy, Build the entire team around Donovan, hire the head coach Donovan wants, and then he asks out in a year, I'd say that will leave the franchise in shambles.

 

[Hearsky]

I say we trade Rudy before we get embarrassed in the playoffs for the third year in a row.

You are in a serious challenge with Lopoo for the biggest dumbass on this site.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I just think we need the Knicks to work harder for their guy. Don isn’t close to AD as a player, but how many more players would the Knicks rather have than Don? They value him more than any team in the league. Use that against them. I’m willing to wait it out.

At the very least, I don’t think there’s a deal that’s “too much” for the Knicks. They’d give everything they have in a heartbeat right now. It feels like a standing offer, and I don’t think it goes away. I’d rather wave the middle finger at them and tell them to get us Wemby (even though I’m a Wemby skeptic).

Tony Jones on ESPN 700 said that Knicks would have to put all their draft picks and swaps plus RJ to get the Jazz to the table. Said its not a discussion and this response was after he was asked "what would it take". Just thought it was interesting... carry on everyone.

 

[Elizah Huge]

Tony Jones on ESPN 700 said that Knicks would have to put all their draft picks and swaps plus RJ to get the Jazz to the table. Said its not a discussion and this response was after he was asked "what would it take". Just thought it was interesting... carry on everyone.

That is a godfather offer.

 

[Elizah Huge]

You are in a serious challenge with Lopoo for the biggest dumbass on this site.

Ahh yes, another poster who thinks 99% of the other people are wrong including reputable beat writers and that you are correct.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

#1-Is your name Ryan Smith? I never said that you said to let him have a major voice, I said that that's what Ryan is going to do based on reports I've read and listened to.

#2 Every single reporter with inside knowledge thinks he's asking out...I mean everyone, both local and national. Andy Larsen, Tony Jones, Eric Walden, Ben Dowsett, Dan Clayton, Spence Checketts, Tim MacMahon, Brian Windhorst, Tim Bontemps, Zach Lowe, Kevin O'Connor, Jake Fischer all think he's asking out eventually. I'm sure I missed some.

#3 If we trade our best player in Rudy, Build the entire team around Donovan, hire the head coach Donovan wants, and then he asks out in a year, I'd say that will leave the franchise in shambles.

The shambles part will depend... it certainly is not ideal. Hopefully we get stuff when we trade Rudy that has future facing value (like a Plan B that we certainly will need). We did a minor version of this with Gordo... the Hill trade and the Ricky trade were motivated very much by Gordon's influence. Then he left.

If you had moved him you don't lose him for nothing and also retain those picks/space to do other stuff. The cost was justified and the players gave us good value. Trading Rudy (if we do it) is obviously a much bigger potential eff up. There needs to be draft comp, youngish players, and/or good players that can hold their value... or expire like Vucevic so you open up the cap.

Its just a silly waste of time though.

 

[NUMBERICA]

On the Hoops Collective podcast Tim MacMahon says that Donovan would do the Jazz a big favor by forcing his way out of Utah this summer... says in the short term it would be very painful for the Jazz but ultimately in their best interest.

I couldn't agree more. We all know where this is ultimately headed... so just rip the band aid off now, get as many draft picks and as much young talent for him as possible and get rid of the headache of having to constantly cater to him at every turn. I think the longer we wait the less we will get back for him...if we trade him now with 3 years left on his contract teams are going to be willing to pay the premium for him. If we drag this out until he just has one year left on his deal, the return is going to be significantly less for him than what it is right now.

Clear as ****ing crystal.

 

[KqWIN]

Tony Jones on ESPN 700 said that Knicks would have to put all their draft picks and swaps plus RJ to get the Jazz to the table. Said its not a discussion and this response was after he was asked "what would it take". Just thought it was interesting... carry on everyone.

I agree with that. Right now I'd be in a holding pattern with the Knicks and telling them they don't have a package we'd accept. I think they have to come to the table with a real premium asset.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

That is a godfather offer.

I do wonder if you could also bait and switch them a little. Say they can keep RJ... and we get Quickly, Toppin, Grimes, cap fodder and teh picks.. then we keep Rudy for a little while and roll with Quickly, Daniels at 11?, Toppin, Rudy, Bogey... (flip Mike for like KCP from Washington). Then just see what happens... have those guys increase their value by actually playing... maybe you stumble into a team that is still in the top 6 in the West and you have reloaded the cupboards. Or you can move Rudy later when it isn't working for draft centered packages.

 

[stitches]

Also, I know you guys don’t want to hear this but there has been a clear shift since 2020 with how teams approach Gobert during the playoffs and the results are not great.

View attachment 12213

Graphs are good, stats are good... but then comes the time when you have to watch the games and interpret what the stats are actually saying.

When you watch the last several playoff appearances you would notice that teams decided that the best way to counter Gobert is ... to put him as far away from the action as possible... because on this team he quite possibly is the best defender in every aspect of the game. So what do teams do to the Jazz defense. Put the the player Gobert defends on the weakside corner(i.e. as far away as possible from the action). Next step... attack ANY OTHER player on the perimeter in whatever way you see fit - could be PnR, could be iso... it doesn't really matter you won't see much resistance on the drive either way... So... they attack. Conley, Donovan, Bojan, Royce, Clarkson... doesn't matter. Blow past them. Rudy has to help on the drive and leaves the corner. The driver passes to the corner, the other Jazz perimeter defenders don't rotate or are late rotating, Gobert cannot recover in time to the corner(because it's damn hard to be in two places at the same time) and his man splashes a 3 or makes the extra pass vs late rotation, which again creates open shot. This is how teams have been beating the Jazz in the playoffs. What's the result of that? The graph above... forced help against drives leaves Gobert's man open who splashes 3s and there is noone to help Rudy - both higher volume and higher efficiency on spot ups "defended" by Rudy. They don't help him on the drives and they don't help him on the rotations. So Gobert has to guard his man at the corner 3, help in the pant when inevitably our perimeter defense gets broken, recover to the corner to contest, go get the rebound... because of course noone else on the Jazz can possibly have any defensive responsibility on this damn team.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I agree with that. Right now I'd be in a holding pattern with the Knicks and telling them they don't have a package we'd accept. I think they have to come to the table with a real premium asset.

I just hope we are taking the call to set the table... rather than just saying "no we aren't discussing it". Just say "fine what do you have" then laugh at them a little.

 

[KqWIN]

I do wonder if you could also bait and switch them a little. Say they can keep RJ... and we get Quickly, Toppin, Grimes, cap fodder and teh picks.. then we keep Rudy for a little while and roll with Quickly, Daniels at 11?, Toppin, Rudy, Bogey... (flip Mike for like KCP from Washington). Then just see what happens... have those guys increase their value by actually playing... maybe you stumble into a team that is still in the top 6 in the West and you have reloaded the cupboards. Or you can move Rudy later when it isn't working for draft centered packages.

Nooo...that type of plan is a disaster!!!!!

 

[stitches]

Tony Jones on ESPN 700 said that Knicks would have to put all their draft picks and swaps plus RJ to get the Jazz to the table. Said its not a discussion and this response was after he was asked "what would it take". Just thought it was interesting... carry on everyone.

Pretty much what I expect. I have no idea why other teams think they can have our stars for pennies. Both Donovan and Rudy should fetch incredibly rich offers.

 

[Brsn]

He helps the offense with screening but as far as offensive talent goes he doesn’t have much. We could definitely hit him with the lob more but let’s not act like we can throw it down to him and get out of the way.

I agree we could get him the lob more often. I think he needs to work more on punishing smaller defenders in the off-season. Not every team member needs to be an offensive talent though. There are only so many offensive positions per game.

 

[Elizah Huge]

I do wonder if you could also bait and switch them a little. Say they can keep RJ... and we get Quickly, Toppin, Grimes, cap fodder and teh picks.. then we keep Rudy for a little while and roll with Quickly, Daniels at 11?, Toppin, Rudy, Bogey... (flip Mike for like KCP from Washington). Then just see what happens... have those guys increase their value by actually playing... maybe you stumble into a team that is still in the top 6 in the West and you have reloaded the cupboards. Or you can move Rudy later when it isn't working for draft centered packages.

I’m down for a godfather offer for Donovan. I am also down for moving Rudy/Bogey/Royce/2026 1st and bringing in Grant/Hunter/Collins/Capela.

Either way works for me and honestly if we moved both that would be fine as well. This iteration of the Jazz is likely over that’s about the only thing I’m sure about.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Nooo...that type of plan is a disaster!!!!!

Nah... I already talked myself into Quickley becoming as good or better than Donovan by season's end. Playing pick and roll with Rudy unlocks his full potential. I am only kind of kidding.

New York implodes when Thibs takes out Donovan's legs because he missed another rotation. We end up in the playoffs and with the number 1 pick.

 

[cowhide]

I think every reporter who has talked about the situation whether nationally or locally indicates that "we are on the clock" and some go as far as to say "Donovan is not long for Utah". Now you can just say that is lies, rumors, and other BS... but it has been consistent and not something reporters like McMahon are just going to spout off for no reason. They are getting it directly from sources they trust... not trusting some rumor mill. Donovan hasn't come out and said "I'm 10 toes down" like Dame has. I don't think these are meaningless guesses... going back to Hayward there were rumors he was out a year before his final year. He and Jazz management met and denied them. Where there is smoke there is fire... and we've had all teh smoke.

I just haven't heard nothing but noise. It is like the Rudy vs DM conflict which was blown way out of proportion in my opinion. I do agree that the Jazz have to make sure that they don't have another Hayward situation so if the management has any doubts then they need to pull the trigger and trade him.

 

[cowhide]

All you have to do is watch the Celtics and how they have many good defenders who give great effort. The Jazz lack perimeter defenders and this is why Rudy can be taken out during the playoffs. Jazz need guys who have the desire and ability to get up on guys and make getting to the basket difficult so Rudy can protect the basket.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Nooo...that type of plan is a disaster!!!!!

If you control their draft the next 5 years you will get some high picks. Donovan ain't a culture changer and he bails on them for a winner at some point.

Quickley does a poor man's Donovan impression. We do just fine with improved defense... the vibes are immaculate.