Donovan Mitchell Trade Threads
- Thread starter Saint Cy of JFC
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Avery
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Paul doesn't need to score 25 PPG though. He facilitates and empowers everyone one else.
Maybe this org thought Conley could do the same, but he's not the floor general that Paul is.
Handlogten's Heros
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Dame's next contract will be okay for a year or two but will quickly become a millstone imo. He isn't like CP3 and Lebron where they are just basketball geniuses... I mean Lebron still is a physical force too but you catch my drift here.
Start fresh... jump all in and you will hopefully only spend 3 years in the dumps. You hope to hit on 2/3 of your top picks... you collect some young guys from the trades that you hope blossom... with all the other trades (Bogey, Mike, Royce) you get firsts that are lotto tickets in the future or you can use as trade assets when you flip the switch. If our cupboards still had some extra firsts I might think you keep Rudy or Don and try and stitch something together and you would have a little hope of a guy popping in the draft. The draft cupboards are bare... our cap is a mess... and our best players haven't really figured they BS out in 2 years.
With new business opportunities I will tell folks that if its not a good fit just let me know. The best answer you can get is Yes, the second best answer is No, the worst thing that can happen is a slow maybe. The current group is a no... pivoting with one of the guys sends us to the slow maybe group... you will spin your wheels as a treadmill team and lose the opportunity to cash in on the Mike, Bogey, Royce deals in the meantime.
Also, you figure if they trade Rudy we are headed for a season where we finish and get a late lotto or mid first next year. Moving Donovan too takes us from having say the 12-18th pick next year to having a top 5-6 pick... so add that to whatever haul we would get.
How high are you? Lillard was clearly a worse player than Mitchell this year. It isn't even debatable. Lillard was a mediocre chucker this year.
I'm not sure what you mean by this. The suns traded Rubio and Oubre for Paul. Are you trying to tell me those 2 guys are equal to Mitchell? They also still had young building blocks in Booker, Ayton and Bridges. They traded for Paul while keeping there best pieces. We wouldn't be in that situation. If we could get Lillard for Conley and Clarkson then your comparison might make sense.
Here's one if we want to try to keep our window open around Rudy: Mitchell and Royce for Bradley Beal and Deni Avdija, add picks from WAS if need be. Have to be done with the understanding that Beal will be signing some sort of extension...
homeytennis
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If you think Spida is a diva, just wait until Beal hits town.
Yeah not a fan. I think if you deal Mitchell you got to go in a different direction and get multiple pieces if you want to keep Gobert and compete. Beal would just be a lateral move. He might be a bit better than Donovan, but not by much and you're losing a rotation piece to do it.
Also doubt Utah wants to pay Beal his next massive deal.
An interesting Knicks deal to me would be a package centered around Barrett and Randle plus two first round picks. The picks would probably have to have some kind of top 3-5 protection on them, but the Jazz could possibly build a team around Conley/Barrett/Randle/Gobert. Use Bogey and combine him with some draft assets to grab a big upgrade on the wing.
I know Barret and Randle aren't known as defenders, but they both have size and rebound well. I would have to put some more thought into who that upgrade could be that makes sense while dealing Bogey.
I mostly despise the way Randle plays, but he can possibly be unlocked.
I know Barret and Randle aren't known as defenders, but they both have size and rebound well. I would have to put some more thought into who that upgrade could be that makes sense while dealing Bogey.
I mostly despise the way Randle plays, but he can possibly be unlocked.
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Beal, Dame, Harden, Kyrie on their next deals will be rough. GS might experience this with Steph and his monstrous deal too... their luxury tax problems gonna get real spicy next year or two if Poole has a decent agent.
I also think you have a significant amount of emotional scars here... Rudy and Donovan both carry them. At this point if one guy is forcing a breakup its better to just do a complete reset. Retooling under the constraints of no draft picks, no young players, aging role players, and a salary cap that is going to bury the new ownership so much that he might not be able to buy a new sports team this year... like the degree of difficulty is so high.
Bill Simmons brought up the early Celtics days and Ainge had a chance to trade Pierce to Portland for the pick that would have been Chris Paul. Supposedly Pierce's people shut it down. Anyway... in his younger days he was okay blowing **** up... we will test him this summer. If Ryan had been the owner longer I think a full scale tear down is looming... his ego might make it impossible. If you go full OKC mode you can really speed up the process when you sell off all the parts. You just need a smidge of lottery luck.
I feel like if you want to compete with timeline around Gobert's you will pay Beal's next contract. They are practically the same age(Beal is actually younger). I don't think the talent at the top is the biggest problem of this team. I think it's the structural composition of the team around our best two players, plus those two players' personal beef. You will need to make other moves and get some more athleticism and defense on the perimeter, but that I think would be a good main piece to get in return for Mitchell.
I don't know what other package of lesser players would give us better chance to retool around Gobert. We still need offensive creator to replace what Mitchell is giving us. Maybe you don't need the exact same type that Mitchell is, but you still need a primary creator for the offense.
Another possible option is Jaylen Brown... but I'm not sure he's good enough to be primary offensive initiator. In fact, I don't think he is... so if we get someone like him, we will still need a major addition IMO.
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The Randle deal is so ****** though... no thanks. Substitute in Fournier because it is a better fit and will help Rudy.
Barrett is a good defender. I think if they do a star trade it will be to pair RJ with someone like Donovan. Their assets aren't great unless they jump into the top 4 in the lotto. More likely the NY deal would be their pick this year 12-ish, 2023 pick unprotected, 2025 pick unprotected, the Dallas pick they own, 2027 pick unprotected, and Quickly/Grimes/Toppin plus whatever non-Randle salary we can get. I'd go for pick swaps in between the picks they give us too. It could end up being the most meh package if NY is good or it could be a heist.
I think other teams will have something better... even a take off of the Washington deal... we send out Donovan for a pick and a young player and route Beal to a third team for thier draft assets and salary... getting multiple future picks from different teams is a way to try and ensure some are somewhat valuable.
Hell no to Fournier. I'd rather go Randle and hope you can get something out of him that is closer to last year Randle. I'd rather go with that upside than go with aging Fournier
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I think you are more likely to get something useful out of Evan than Julius (either on court or in a trade), but the big issues is Randle has 4/$100M left on his deal and Fournier has 2/39M. The cap sheets will show Evan as 3/60 but final year is team option... so essentially two years left.
You could also substitute AB/Noel... I just would not want 4 years of Randle with how hot and cold he seems to run.
Avery
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Barrett is the only NY player I'd even consider wanting to take on. His shooting %'s are down this year, but at only 21, feels like he still has some runway.
But you'd still need to toss some unprotected firsts in as well. If NY wants to place protections, your counter is a simple 'why' as if they're expecting to be good, they shouldn't need to worry about protecting top five or whatever.
But you'd still need to toss some unprotected firsts in as well. If NY wants to place protections, your counter is a simple 'why' as if they're expecting to be good, they shouldn't need to worry about protecting top five or whatever.
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Their offer is likely not good compared to others so the unprotected picks are necessary. I like some of their guys... Quickley and Grimes are fine... Toppin might be okayish... they just don't have that prime asset you'd need to have. So they need to give us 20 dimes if they want the dollar.
RJ is solid but he's not a prime asset and I think they would consider him to be one. Again... the idea for them is to pair Donovan with RJ for the next great mediocre NY team. I want their entire draft future for as far out as they can go if we deal with them. NO got that from the Lakers plus good young players for AD who had 1 year on his deal. Donovan has 3 years left.
Everyone thought Paul was washed. His contract was viewed as a negative asset, and he then led the Thunder to the playoffs and the Suns to the finals.
It probably shouldn't have been given how young Mitchell is, but the Jazz roster is built for win-now. Blowing it up and trading everyone likely kicks off another 8+ year run of non-competitiveness. I know some of you really like the draft so maybe wouldn't mind, but a total rebuild holds no interest to me. Gobert is a generational talent and if the Jazz have any chance to competing during his prime they should try. Others are welcome to disagree, but I think Dame is a clear upgrade over Donovan for at least the next year or two. He is the definition of clutch and will be well rested and hungry to win. With Dame and a few defensive upgrades I think this team could legit contend for the next few seasons at minimum.
LoPo
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All depends on the direction of the franchise. If the goal is to continue to build around Rudy, NY is probably not the best trade partner because we would want assets to build around the now. If the goal is to trade Don and Rudy, NY could be a very good trade partner. We could get some young assets, draft assets and shed some cap.
NY might be okay if Rudy really wants Fournier and we value Randle, Barrett and/or Reddish very highly.
Are we getting way ahead of ourselves to think Donovan is worth an absolute boatload?
Like, do the Knicks really want to zap everything they got just to build around Mitchell without picks, just free agents?
I'm sure Donovan is somewhat liked around the league, but all his peers are still on their 1st or 2nd contract. Is Donovan enough to convince a Bradley Beal or Kyrie Irving to come to NYK? I dont think so. Who the hell would NYK sign this year to surround Donovan? It could potentially be very ugly.
29 games playing on one of the worst teams in the league vs playing on one of the best with Gobert setting screens for you.
Dame has absolutely owned Mitchell in every stat the last 5 years which is how long he’s been in the league. Please spare me with this.
Can anyone imagine Rudy setting screens for Dame? Some potential glorious ****ing basketball would happen and Dame would pass it to Rudy more than twice a game.