Good Article - "NBA Free Agency 2016: Utah Jazz cap situation and future-proofing"

[Stoked]

If this sounds bitter, it's because, on this topic, I am.

Then said poster "won". But ok, have fun.

 

[Coach Ellis]

Sorry, but I'd always defer to getting young guys on valuable contracts. Even though it's just one and an option, having Lin, Casspi and/or Biyambo would have been great investments. Likely push this team into the playoffs and you can justify playing each and every single one behind the guys already in the lineup.

Not sure if there will be deals like that to be had this offseason. Possibly through trades. I think that draft picks are REALLY going to have value moving forward because of how small the contracts those players are locked into. One of the BIG reasons that I don't want the Jazz to trade #12 unless it's for a real difference maker.

 

[Ron Mexico]

Are you trying to obfuscate? There's a underlying lesson in this example.

Nope havent read any of your discussion or debate just read your post about who is better for getting Harris. I didnt think Jazz had any shot at signing a RFA whos team seemed like they would match. Orlando retained him just like Jazz would have done if he was their player aka Hayward.

If you are using this as an example of something else such as players Jazz should have signed in the off season I dont see him as a good example of that. Maybe find a player we could have signed unless I am wrong and he wasnt a RFA or we could have signed him somehow. I suppose they would have been interested in a sign and trade since he got traded so soon after. If its an example of something else I guess I could go back through and read whatever your discussion is about but I dont even know what other thread and person you were debating this with.

If that is the debate I am not sure who we could have got that would have made a difference this year. I assume there is a player or 2 we could have overpaid and possibly gotten. That player might have helped us get in the playoffs this year. But I dont think making the playoffs this year makes us any better of a team going forward. I am glad we didnt tie up future cap space on a non difference maker of a player that is over payed and slowed the development of players such as Hood and Lyles just to get swept in the first round and a worse draft pick. This off season we have a better developed Hood and Lyles due to playing time and we have cap space to pursue players we want or make a trade we want.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

While Neto's minutes may payoff in some sense, he should probably be added to your list.

Yeah I agree... he was brought in to be a 3rd PG and develop in the D League.

 

[fishonjazz]

I'm just bitter because we were obviously a year late to the party for no real good reason. Now we want to spend... Good luck. Everyone has money.

I was thinking today while listening to a podcast we should throw a big offer to Evan Fournier... Then I thought about how much it would have to be so that Orlando didn't match it. My guess is somewhere in between 15-20M per year and even then I think they match it unless they are on the verge of something else. thats more than Middleton got... And Fournier isn't as good as him IMO.

I also thought it'd be great to sign a guy like Dudley but it'd be nice to know how he fits first... We could have had him for free last year.

There will be very little value plays in free agency this year and there were many last year. If we sign someone this year it screws with the timing of extensions and retaining our guys so much more this year than it would have last year. I will be pissed if we trade one of our first for a win now one year rental. We tanked away seasons and rented our cap space for those picks.

I like DL and think he is good but will be curious to see what he comes up with... Whatever it is it will cost much more this year than it would have last year.

Good post

 

[fishonjazz]

All those minutes Chris Johnson and Joe Ingles got this season will really pay off next year.

Ya I wonder if the jazz could have predicted that Burks would miss 50+ games if they would have signed a wing.

 

[RandyForRubio]

Ya I wonder if the jazz could have predicted that Burks would miss 50+ games if they would have signed a wing.

You're missing the point.

 

[fishonjazz]

You're missing the point.

I think he was saying that the minutes chris Johnson and joe ingles got could have went to someone else if we had signed someone else.

I was agreeing. If the jazz knew that chris johnson and joe ingles would be getting minutes then they probably would have tried to get a better player to use those minutes.
I think that the jazz thought that cj and ingles would never set foot on the basketball court.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Ya I wonder if the jazz could have predicted that Burks would miss 50+ games if they would have signed a wing.

I don't think you can predict a specific injury, but injuries in general are predictable. Average NBA player misses 10 or so games.

 

[fishonjazz]

Yeah I agree... he was brought in to be a 3rd PG and develop in the D League.

Ya I think the plan was exum starts, burke comes off the bench as a scoring pg and neto plays in the d league and garbage time.

 

[fishonjazz]

I don't think you can predict a specific injury, but injuries in general are predictable. Average NBA player misses 10 or so games.

True.
I think the jazz thought it would be risky to give wes matthews, demarre carroll, Danny green 15 million to possibly just wait for that 10 game injury to come along.

And I think that they might have figured the ugrade from joe ingles to a jared dudley type for the predictable 10 game type injury wouldn't make enough of a difference to really matter.

Say the jazz have the predictable # of injuries like you said. Does jared dudley instead of joe ingles win us many more games if any at all? Especially since he might take time to get used to his new teammates and role? Maybe.

 

[RandyForRubio]

I think he was saying that the minutes chris Johnson and joe ingles got could have went to someone else if we had signed someone else.

I was agreeing. If the jazz knew that chris johnson and joe ingles would be getting minutes then they probably would have tried to get a better player to use those minutes.
I think that the jazz thought that cj and ingles would never set foot on the basketball court.

Doesn't matter about the injuries. Sign a good or even decent player so it gives you flexibility to move more players to acquire better players. The contracts signed last year would have been easy to move. They should have seen that.

 

[fishonjazz]

Myself and others have provided some possible reasons why the jazz didn't spend in free agency.

Many people have complained about that fact.

What reasons do the people think the jazz were not active in free agency? They just have the dumbest and cheapest coaches, gm, and management in the league?

Man I'm glad I don't think that. I think they had a good reason.

 

[fishonjazz]

Doesn't matter about the injuries. Sign a good or even decent player so it gives you flexibility to move more players to acquire better players. The contracts signed last year would have been easy to move. They should have seen that.

Why do you think the jazz did nothing? They are pros right?

You think the plan was to suck as much as possible, make the fans mad, look as stupid as they can, and try their hardest to miss the playoffs?
Doesn't seem like a good plan. Maybe they actually thought they had a good reason to not be active in free agency and injuries screwed that reason up.

 

[MDAV28]

Myself and others have provided some possible reasons why the jazz didn't spend in free agency.

Many people have complained about that fact.

What reasons do the people think the jazz were not active in free agency? They just have the dumbest and cheapest coaches, gm, and management in the league?

Man I'm glad I don't think that. I think they had a good reason.

I'm in like neutral zone of both sides of this.

I think the Jazz have been incredible sticking to their plan of developing their young talent and letting them grow together, and they definitely are growing together.

I see the argument, you have cap space, use it. Is it possible they might have inquired at some of these players agents?

I mean Danny Green for example, he was never going to leave San Antonio, evidenced by his contract. Jazz FO could've contacted his agent and realized this and it wouldn't really make sense to go after him after that would it?

Carroll and Matthews could've been brought back I guess and the idea behind that is to add talent and trade other talent away?

 

[Stifle Tower]

DL f'd up by not going after a significant FA two years ago. A 4 yr deal could have been offered and it would be expiring at precisely the time the Jazz might need cap room for Gobert, Exum and then Hood.
Last year the new cap was already built in to most of the contracts that were signed.
And this cake baking is ********. Young guys can still develop while a team is winning. Look at players like Draymond, Kawhi, etc. They're likely BETTER because they had to EARN their playing time. It wasn't given to them because their benches were filled with guys who should be in a rec league.

 

[MDAV28]

DL f'd up by not going after a significant FA two years ago. A 4 yr deal could have been offered and it would be expiring at precisely the time the Jazz might need cap room for Gobert, Exum and then Hood.
Last year the new cap was already built in to most of the contracts that were signed.
And this cake baking is ********. Young guys can still develop while a team is winning. Look at players like Draymond, Kawhi, etc. They're likely BETTER because they had to EARN their playing time. It wasn't given to them because their benches were filled with guys who should be in a rec league.

The only players who haven't had to "earn" their playing time is probably Exum and Hood...

 

[Stifle Tower]

And this really isn't new news. I posted a cap outlook several months ago that showed how tight finances would be in a few years. It's one of the main drivers behind me advocating a trade of Gordo. Offer him $30M and 1-2 other main guys is going to have to go. Gordo would be one of the most overpaid players in the league at that salary relative to his production and value as a non-star.

 

[MDAV28]

And this really isn't new news. I posted a cap outlook several months ago that showed how tight finances would be in a few years. It's one of the main drivers behind me advocating a trade of Gordo. Offer him $30M and 1-2 other main guys is going to have to go. Gordo would be one of the most overpaid players in the league at that salary relative to his production and value as a non-star.

In what way is Gordon unproductive? Cause he hasn't been voted to an All-Star game? His numbers are pretty awesome. Or are we talking about wins? Cause I mean Anthony Davis and DeMarcus Cousins are definitely stars and look at their teams win totals.. The amount of Jazz fans hating on Hayward is pretty fascinating to me. I'm always trying to figure it out. My theory is a majority of fans only see Jazz games and don't see the quality of SF's on other teams.

 

[Stifle Tower]

The only players who haven't had to "earn" their playing time is probably Exum and Hood...

Umm, Burke. All of the starters...and I don't think Exum or Hood have shown enough yet, should have had competition pushing them. DL has taken that away by signing scrubs (even with a TON of cap space). These guys have been bottle fed. They're Charmin soft. Hell, maybe if there was some competition, they'd spend some extra time practicing their damn FT's!